Is it bad to Red line too often?

The OP was about the up-shift point, not about cruising the interstate at a steady 6000 or 7000 rpm.

In the old days, it was considered bad for the engine to cruise 100 miles at *any* single, steady RPM, without variation.

On the other hand, if you're just dozing behind the cruise control, why would you be in a Ferrari?


That said, I do find it frustrating driving behind some dweeb who won't touch the gas pedal *ever*, for fear of "wasting fuel" on a "jackrabbit start".
When that particular Sunday Supplement came out (in WWII?), the accelerator pump used to add a squirt of fuel when you stepped on the gas, to prevent the hesitation as you drew fuel from the float bowl.
News flash: EFI cars don't have carbs -- and, thus: no accelerator pump.
(BMW did the study that shows that it's at least as efficient to get to speed at WOT than with moderate acceleration.
Idling up to speed is one of the least efficient uses of a fuel injected engine.
(You have the mechanical drag of the big mill, but you're running it in a vacuum.)
You can tell a car that spent its life in the DC area: The gas pedal is like new ... but the brake pedal is worn down to bare metal.

 

If you have sodium valves, keep it 5K tops and under.

Ask one of the members from the Rocky Mountain Front Range who doesn´t seem to post here any more (good thing and email him) how he knows .........

 

never understood the point of statements like this:

because you drove it somewhere and have a long highway trip back?
The area is filled with cops?
You don't feel like worrying about speed control at that particular moment?

etc etc.

 

On the Fuel injected cars, driving gingerly is NOT bad; however, running them up to redline is not bad either.

On the older carb cars in good tune, driving gingerly is not bad; however, these cars, especially, like a crisp wrap to redline occasionally too.

As long as the engine is runing smoothly, use as low an RPM as you like. As long as the water and oil temps are within reason (220dF Water and 240dF Oil) use as many RPMs as you can without annoying others.

Getting on it all the time is a recipie for becomming a ticket magnet and having other bad experiences. For me, it takes me about 30 minutes of gingerly driving until I am on a road clear enough to use the car as it was meant to be used. I <generally = 85%> don't do this when there is any traffic around. And after the car has been used as designed, it takes another 30 minutes of gingerly driving to get back home under the radar screen (so to speak.)

 

Oliver - first off, you are crass about the BS comment.- "Bull**** to all of the above folks."

I see in your profile that you do not or have not even owned an F-car?
The OP asked for advice about harm to his 599 if redlining too much.

There were replies from 599 owners and other F-car owners.
I have owned and had experience with these cars for over 19 years.
Though I do not own a 599; I have a 550 and a 575, both V-12 power plants.
These cars are engineered and designed to be driven; and as long as they are not abused, they are capable of being shifted at higher RPM's and driven at very high speeds for prolonged periods of time.....no problem.

If you do not like these threads - "I hate these threads,...." you should respectfully decline to make crass comments about an entire group of F-car owners who are giving their REAL, first hand, experience with their cars.

 

Well, this thread is unnecessary for a different reason. A 599 (and all modern Ferraris) has a rev limiter that cuts power if the driver tries to rev it past the breaking point. That point was selected by Ferrari as the maximum recommended RPM and in order to protect the owner from himself or any random idiot he lets drive his car, Ferrari installed a kill switch to keep the engine from breaking itself. Unless that system fails or is disabled, you cannot over-rev a 599. Floor it and enjoy! But understand that you will lose time upshifting if the rev limiter has to kick in. Much more damage can be accomplished by starting up the car cold and revving it to impress onlookers.

 

well, i'm glad to see that you picked up on my dig at you and your cruising around at 6000rpm.

As for your ownership commentary. The engine in question does not matter as it relates to all modern fuel injected motors.

Are the engines able to be run hard? Of course...just like just about every other modern high performance engine. Does this cause more wear than running it gingerly? Yes.

As to your last point, the reason I hate these threads, is because its all anecdotal "well my car revved to xyz rpm for 40 million hours and its totally perfect" and my "best mechanic the world has ever seen" said you should drive it hard and whatever else.

There does not appear to be any readily accessible empirical data on this, so I instead use common sense...which works on ferraris just like everything else.

 

First off, we are not here to dig at each other, as it seems that this is your intention.

If you read my post; I said I like to drive at between 4000-6000RPM in the city; usually sticking to the 4000 range and then 2000-3000RPM on the freeway.

As for the ownership commentary; are you on this forum because you are looking at buying a Ferrari? or to insult a group of Ferrari owners with your BS comment? to incite arguments? or to be respectful towards other members, even though you may not agree with their comments.
If you are here to be part of the community great!, if not, you should think about what you type before you make uncalled for comments towards people you don't know....

ps.Will you explain to all us folks, the need to say: "Bull**** to all of the above folks."
Be respectful, don't be offensive to the people on F-Chat.

 

What gear you drive in depends on what your objective is. I generally drive in the lower RPM range to conserve fuel and keep the noise level down. That makes up for all of the times that I drive in a more "spirited" fashion in the 5-6,000 RPM range. Redlining is not maximizing performance, btw.

 

Agreed.
But there are 2 local guys that are 1st time Ferrari owners and they happened to buy the 599 as their first Ferrari.

As to the OP's original question, it is probably reassuring for him to have heard opinions from current Ferrari owners with past history and experience.

As I stated in an above post, I have had these cars for over 19 years and if I have a question about something I want to know about, I would like to hear other owners opinions in a thread I may start......even if the question may sound silly to some.....

 

I realize this and I am not always in the high RPM range......but I definitely do not up shift at 2000-3000RPM's wether in my 6 Speed Barchetta or 575M F1. I usually drive on our local freeways and out to the Rocky Mountains, as most V-12's were meant to be used. I try not to do very much city driving......it's not too fun in stop and go traffic.

I like to take my cars out for "spirited" drives......I don't really look at the fuel conservation aspect.

 

Lol

 

I'm here to discuss ferraris, the mechanicals of them and other vehicles and cars in general.

If you find me abrasive, so be it.

 

I find with my 575 that on a strong acceleration, I get up around 6500-7000 rpm in second gear , attempt to upshift to the next gear, and the car usually jumps into 6th gear. Anyone guess what is going on here ? The manual claims the car automatically goes to the next gear [ if I read it right ] and that would be 3rd gear, not 6th gear.
Any thoughts on this issue ?
Thanks.

 

Are you sure that's not the fuel burning that you are smelling?

 

Bruce, that does not sound normal.
I had a 575M 6 Speed manual that I sold last fall (regretted) and replaced with an 05 575M F1 this spring.
On hard acceleration, I up shift in that RPM range and have never had my car jump a gear.
Do a search on here because there is definitely something that is not right.

Hopefully it is something minor.
Maybe start a thread in the 575 section and someone who knows the mechanicals of the F1 system will know.
Good luck.

 

I think that smell is the engine getting up to, "near peak" operating temperature.
My current 575M F1 smelled like that after a spirited run because it hadn't been driven for about 6 months before I bought it.
These V-12 engines generate a fair amount of heat.

 

I remember a conversation that I was having with master mechanic Bob Wallace regarding shift points. When asked where Ferrari's should be shifted, he barked in his gruff, Kiwi accent, "RED LINE"!

 

+1
lol

 

Why buy it if you are going to avoid reving the engine to red line? An F-car would look pretty neat tooling around town and highway at 3-4K rpm like most family cars, but . .

As for the 360, most of the good stuff is there when the tachometer passes 5K. The power comes on, the sound gets insane, the passanger gets concerned. The car becomes something more than the average sports car.

I like to keep my car nice and avoid unneeded expense. I would never drive for an hour in stop and go traffic if I could avoid it because I don;t want to pay for a clutch any soomer than I have to. For me, to not red line the car as a way to avoid wear and tear would be defeating the purpose of the car. It would make owning it dull (unless I saw an unmanned shopping cart in a parking lot rolling towards it at high speed).

 

The question is not "never redline", it is "is it bad to redline too often"

 

As a new owner of a 348 I find this thread to be quite useful and one of the questions I had lurking in the back of my mind as well.

As for "Quad" if you are not an owner or planning on becoming an owner of one of the finest automobiles ever produced, then get off the site and leave it to the people with a passion for this exotic and go insult people on facebook!

 

By definition, operating a Ferrari, or any vehicle for that matter, at red line means you are pushing it at the highest operational load allowed by the manufacturer. Doing that over and over and over again certainly isn't "good" for an engine. All mechanical things eventually wear out. Pushing any mechanical device to the extreme limit of its operating envelope will result in premature wear and, finally, failure.

If the expense and hassle of repairs is no concern, then red line it every time you drive it. I'm sure your Ferrari mechanic will appreciate the business.

On the other hand, those who argue that you are somehow doing something "wrong" by not red lining your engine should not be taken seriously.

Let's try not to outsmart our common sense, folks.

 

The previous owner of my old 246GT (no longer mine) red lined it one too many times and broke a sodium filled exhaust valve. It wasn't pretty. Just sayin'