NEED HELP -- roof won't go up

Congratulations on the fix.

I was monitoring this thread since the first posting like a hawk, as it gave me fears on what could potentially happen to my softtop 360 as well.

Glad that you have solved this annoying 'gorilla on your back' problem. Awaiting your DIY instructions for my 360 documentation library.

Cheers!

 

Hard to answer definitively, but I'd say it would have been significantly harder. Second time around, I think I could now do the removal and instal in about 4 to 5 hours top. My gut tells me that it wouldn't be possible to remove and replace the entire roof assembly within a similar time frame, even if one had done it several times before.

I definitely learned a lot doing this work, and my total labour time included much head scratching when I couldn't understand why the lines refused to be pulled. Of course, I figured this out by removing interior trim which revealed the offending cable ties. All be be revealed when I post photos.

I have a strong feeling that the agony I just went through, and the processes I will describe, will have much overlap with several of the other hydraulic rams if they ever need to be replaced. These buggers no longer scare me!!

 

The problem I'm having concerns hydraulic pressure absent from main cylinders. Aux cyls cycle OK..but with lines to main cyls open, only rear right fitting has any trace of pressure. I recently replaced the pump, and have been struggling ever since.... My thought is that perhaps the valve body/solenoid at left rear could be involved..or possibly an incorrect line connection at pump. Any ideas (besides buying a Porsche)?

 

I think you should open a new thread with a very detailed description of the issue, or maybe buy a Porsche

 

I was being lazy, optimistic and hopeful Trent...and a yes, to both

 

Here's my first cut at writing up some of the procedures that I followed when replacing my hydraulic ram. Feedback will be gratefully received. I think I was getting lazy towards the end of the doc so more detail is probably required.

Okay, I hit a problem, the doc's too big. What should I do? I've attached pages 1 and 2 anyway, but this isn't too much help.
View attachment ‘04 360 Spider - Roof Repair (pages 1-2).pdf

 

Fabulous! That is wonderful news. Kudos to you and Trent that you were able to fix this WITHOUT TAKING IT TO A DEALER!! I am in awe.

Once again, congratulations. Truly the thread of the month!

 

If I subscribe to Silver will I be able to upload the whole doc (about 40MB)? I should subscribe anyway, and have been meaning to do so forever.

 

Compressed the images. Should upload now as the doc's much smaller.
View attachment ‘04 360 Spider - Roof Repair Rev.2.pdf

 

Excellent write up. So good in fact you will need to change your screen_name from newbydude to F1TechnicalWriter or the like.

I cant overstate how important it is to fully document a complex fix like this, and as such your contributions to the forum are invaluable.

Ferraris workshop manuals are good, but your 13 pages would have been reduced to one paragraph that would go something like: "Remove old ram, replace with new ram, test top.".

Some comments:
1. Too bad you had to cut a little plastic, but heck, its just a little plastic. No worries.
2. Using safety-wire as a fish for the new hydraulic cable was a great idea. I wonder what one might do if they pulled the old hydraulic lines out, then tried to push the new ones through... ...likely not a happy ending.
3. I would like to know where you purchased the hydraulic syringe? Would be a handy tool to have.

Great contribution to FChat!

 

Thanks for the kind comments Trent. I think we can both pat ourselves on the back for a job well done.

In answer to you specific questions I think it would have been possible without the safety wires, although they definitely (IMHO) made it significantly easier. Things get tricky around the firewall and the safety wire was useful when a little bit of pulling back and forth was required. I borrowed the syringe from a bicycle nut friend of mine -- it's used for bleeding hydraulic brake systems, and I gather, is readily obtained from any decent bicycle shop. The plastic tubing was 1/8" ID (3/16" OD) from my local hardware shop.

 

Thanks heaps again for this article. I have downloaded and kept it aside as part of my documentation collection.

Appreciate the nightmare you went through to diagnose and fix it all up.

How long was your car decomissioned for until you had it all resolved?

Thanks again.

 

Pleased to know that you appreciate the work/nightmare behind all of this, and of course, I hope that you never have to dust-off the document and use it in anger!

In fact, I used my car the entire time -- I either just parked the roof up or down, and got quite good at the manual process for opening and closing! I'd check the weather forecast before going anywhere with the roof down! I got the new ram a couple of weeks after ordering it (would have been quicker, but I was out of town on a business trip) and had it installed within a couple of days.

 

Trent, you are the man, your time and support on this matter was ... well, Priceless!!!

What an impressive thread.

I was thinking about lubricating the joints on my soft top, after reading this thread I don't want to touch the damn thing.

Anyone think this could be a bad idea? I think my joints are bone dry.

 

great thread,

I posted many many moons ago. Could someone post a photo of where I can find the microswitch within the top bay.

I want to try and tighten that first ... as we did before .... and if that works ..... I will be soooo happy. If not then to the dealer it goes. I know I my abilities are and this would not be one of them. Amazing thread with tons of details

 

Before I delve into the details of this thread, I am hoping to appeal to the people who know the top system well to help.

My problem is as follows:
1) Top goes down fine (opening the roof)
2) The top going up is intermittent (closing the roof)

Symptom is as follows:
In the failed top case, while closing the top all the painted covers open correctly. However it appears (looking in the rear view mirror) that the rams for the soft top start pulling the soft top down into the engine bay instead of pushing up to close the roof.

Opening and closing the painted covers a few times usually get it closed.

Hydraulic fluid levels are fine.

Pointers much appreciated.

Chris

Any pointers would be appreciated.

 

I think you should start a new thread. This description is fine. I would also like to request a video of issue. iphone videos can be directly uploaded to youtube and youtube videos directly linked here.

Add:
Year
Video
Q: Does lifting up on the top slightly make it work correctly?

I will address the new thread. good luck.

 

Thanks for your assistance, thread and video posted.

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/360-430/409070-360-top-help.html

 

Just wanted to say big thank you for posting this manual
I finished replacing my ram last night, put the car back together - happy days!
Overall, it is a pretty laborious procedure, would easily consume your weekend and potentially some time during the week too.
The most difficult part for me was to get the circlip out and put it back on again - I probably spent 2 hours trying to remove it, and didn't even bother putting it back on as I knew I'd lose it.
Instead, I removed a clip from the other end of the ram and went to the local hardware store with it, where I was able to find a similar clip. I installed it instead of the circlip - much easier to take it off should this ram require replacing again in future.

 

So here we are some 9 years later. Can it really be 9 years?!

Well my convertible top on my Trusty F430 Spider is not working correctly. It will go down, but not up. So I was googling to find some assistance and happened on this thread. Here is the funny part. I had completely forgot about this endeavor.

1. My access to the Ferrari 430 online tech manual is no more. Expired. So the uploaded wiring images were priceless. Thank you Trent!
2. I had 4x issues compounding:
I. BOTH Secondary Rams failed with external leaks simultaneously. Ok, no problem. They are easy to change as the lines disconnect and they are conveniently located. 3 Hrs work. FYI: I had them rebuilt for $260 / each at Rebuild Company A.
II. Then the center latch ram failed immediately. Another mess. Its not so easy as the hydraulic line routing is tricky. But pulling safety wire through was the ticket. You can also now buy couplers from a second ram rebuild house so the lines dont need to be removed. I used a second rebuild house just south of Tampa FL for $160. Both shops did a fabulous job.
III. Microswitch EVVD-L was misaligned and not actuating. 30min fix, 28 of which was figuring that out.
IV. On TOP_UP the Center ram wont latch. No resolution. This is how I landed here. I think I have a microswitch issue and was looking for a logic table, and BAM it is in this thread, provided by the OP. Thanks!
3. Yes I am still alive, and I still own the F430. It now has 20k miles on it and shares drive time with my Bentley Continental GT and Tesla 3. I still do all of my own car work, and have like three more kids.
4. I sold all of my companies and now just work on military fighter jet avionics for some local company, mostly for fun; dont tell them.
5. As a hobby I build nuclear fusion reactors that run on Deuterium, just for fun.

I will post my fix to the current issue here to keep the knowledge in this thread.

 

Yes it was the microswitch for the middle softtop section. The microswitch ESDA driven by the Secondly Rams MSDZ on Solenoid 4 and 5.

Symptom: Hooks wont actuate, top in correct position

Issue: Microswitch ESDA bent to be CLOSED 100% of the time independently of the MSDZ Rams.

Time:
This took about two hours to track down by testing every microswitch value at every top position at the TOP ECU Harness T019 tQ (Top Harness of the three). Pins are numbered on harness.

Fix: Just bend the microswitch toward the sky until it clicks when pushed. Verify with meter.

Test Methodology: Ohm Meter set to BEEP with closed circuit. One lead grounded to chassis. One lead pushed in top ECU harness at the corresponding pin. A small piece of SOLID wire works perfect on that small pinned connector.

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This is the Money Shot.
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hello I have problems also someone would have the workshop manual of the 360 spider? thank you very much

my mail is [email protected]