Fabspeed Follows up

Your company says it designs and test all of their headers. Yet 3 years ago in the 355 section Jeremy was asked how much power gain there was in the 355 header and Jeremy couldnt tell anyone. In fact he even said that fabspeed didnt even have access to a dyno. I think a dyno would be a must for designing any headers to get the maximum performance.
Back then and even now, your company and or its representatives dance around the questions possed. I say that you do NOT build your headers in the USA. If someone accused me as I am you, then I would be giving an address to my so-called 200,000sq' design and assembly building and invite those that live in the area to drop in and see. Maybe even take pictures of this huge plant. Sooner or later the truth will fly.

 

Well, I know they do have an in house dyno and plenty of fabricating tools in the shop at Ambler. We toured the facility last year for a PCA meet. So, they definitely do have the ability to test and manufacture the products.

 

I'm just curious. What's the endgame here? If FabSpeed admits they are using parts from Taiwan or manufacturing or whatever, then what? Does the creator of the original thread want an internet attaboy? I really don't understand the apparent witch hunt going on here.

Here's what I also want to know. What prompted the original thread in the first place? Usually, people don't post nonsense like that unless they have an agenda.

 

You don't want your fellow community members to let us know if a sponsor (or anyone) is using our forum to sell/market to us with untruthful information?

I do.

 

There agenda is to make sure someone admits they are wrong, so they can be right. Wouldn't matter what we are discussing. I admit sometimes I have the need to be right, often. But I am working on my one and only flaw.

CCns23, you are now our newly elected President.

 

Maybe its because im Canadian....I dont like being lied to. I know Americans will buy products from just about anywhere even though their country is being desimated with out sourcing ie Walmart. But I buy American and Canadian when its possible even if it costs more. I try to avoid chineese made goods simply because they copy and then produce garbage at the expense of everyone. Today I was out shopping with my wife and I saw a golf spike wrench that I needed. I bought it without looking where it was made. Got home took it to the garage to change the new cleats I bought last week. Second cleat and snap....it broke. Grabbed the packaging out of the garage and sure enough it was made in China. 1 month ago I bought a new HP battery from China because thats where they make the OEMs anyway. The seller said it was an oem battery. I got screwed and now I have a battery that last only 1.5 hours instead of 3. Garbage comes from China and tiawan is not much better. The sooner you learn that the better off you will be when buying anything.

 

Again, if they admit it, what's the endgame here? Are we looking for them to close up shop? Do you want a disclaimer on their product packaging? My point is, now that the inquisition is opened, and "if" they admit they are using products not made in the USA, what will they have to do to make this nonsense stop?

And I still don't understand why this was started in the first place. I will contend the original thread starter either works for or has some affiliation with another manufacturer. Stuff like this doesn't just pop up out of the blue. Something happened, and we're not getting the entire story. At least that's how I see it.

I'm also wondering why I care so much?!

 

Tony, thank you for taking the time to reply.

Contrary to what you have written, I don't think most of us took the lack of response negatively. Jeff was very clear and sensible to post that he woudn't reply further over the weekend. Having read the whole thread I also don't believe anyone thinks 'you only import products'. You clearly have a skilled workforce and manufacturing facility in the US and can correctly use the 'made in the USA' wording for your products.

The OP of the other thread was quite specific with regards to a product that he believed was not US made and about which Fabspeed made claims of it being 'hand made' in your US factory. Jeff in trying to defend this position only served to muddy the waters with regards to the country of origin and it is this lack of clarity that caused so many of us to speculate over the weekend. You have been very clear that for your own Fabspeed products you do all design, development and testing at your factory in the US using your in house state of art equipment. You have also been very honest that some of the manufacturing is put out to third parties but that you have complete confidence in the quality of their work as they strictly work to your design and standards, this is also all good and proper.

However Tony, just as Jeff did, you have managed to avoid specifics and have only made general statements about your products, design, and manufacturing that clearly must be 100% true. The thread was specific, it related to one product line, namely the Ferrari 360/430 headers. There are several questions that really do need addressing if there is to be closure:

1. Are the headers for the Ferrari 360/430 that you sell, a Fabspeed designed, developed and tested product?
if yes, then:
2. Are the headers 'made by Fabspeed in the US in your factory' as Jeff posted in the thread or are they infact 'sent out for manufacture elsewhere in the US' or are they actually 'manufactured abroad'?
If no, then:
3. Are you marketing another manufacturers product and branding as your own?

If you say that the headers are manufactured in your own facility in the US then that will be the end of it. If you say the headers are built to your design, specification and standards by a third party in the US then again that will be the end of it. If you say the headers are made abroad to your design, specification and standards then you will have some explaining to do to some of your customers. If the answer is number 3 which is what the OP suggested then....

Unfortunately, as you have so far seen, lack of clarity to these simple questions tends to make many of us start to wonder what the actual position might be, and that can't be good for anyone.

I for one hope you can give clarity and that the 'made in the USA' wording is deserved for these headers.

 

I think it's obvious that not all the parts for the headers are made in the U.S.A. Some parts are imported, from where????, and then they are assembled here in the U.S.A. with some kind of quality check. Are they going to come out and disclose exactly how the headers are made, from start to finish, probably not, but I think I am close.

While we are at it, I would like to see "another" header manufacturers process from start to finish.

 

If you don't understand or care then stop posting your "nonsense" and move on.

Let's hear the truth fabspeed is it that hard to man-up?

 

Also, the original thread starter says he has nothing to do with the automotive industry (or someone else said something to that effect). However on another site he says he spent some time at the Capristo factory (4 days and countless hours) with an "Antonio" (owner? sorry, know nothing about them) and then all of a sudden this trouble starts.

So again, I say there's more to the story here and we're not getting the whole book.

 

All of a sudden what I'm saying is nonsense? This whole thread is full of it. If everyone else can waste each others time why can't I?

 

Since you seem to care so much, I suggest you make an appointment with them, bring along someone really big and tough, schedule a flight, and make them tell you the truth. Good luck.

 

Sorry, I wasn't paying attention. Just wanted to get my post count above 200. Mission accomplished. As you were...

 

congrats!!

Regards, Jim

 

At this point I don't care what they do. That said, many of us wanted them to have a chance to set the record straight and stand up to the allegations. That is only fair and frankly many posters kept saying "well, these are only allegations, I'm sure Fabspeed will set it straight". So, we had to wait for that to happen. Fabspeed hasn't set anything straight in their two posts on the topic. And, at this point, I don't think they can or will. So, in that sense you are correct there is nothing more to see here. But, please understand, no one wanted to jump to conclusions based solely on the accusations. We were asked to be fair and let Fabspeed deny them. In a sense, that was what we kept waiting for. Clealry that isn't going to be possible. I don't see how you can blame folks for asking them to come clean. Its their choice whether to do so or not. Not doing so will result in the continuation of this...

You can certainly make that accusation upon Stef's motivation and character. Many of us know a bit more about that than you and have concluded that he did it for one simple reason. He knew they were lying to us and wanted the ferrari community to know. Stef has flatly denied any relationship with Capristo other than customer. Stef is a well known person on F-C and his expertise speaks for itself. [BTW, so f'ing what if a competitor were to tell us that a vendor is lying. I don't care who let's the truth out...but that's just me.]

I'm sorry you don't care or understand that sponsors should be honest in their posts on F-chat. Many, if not the vast majority of us, do.

 

Since every cares so much about honesty, would like to know the following:

How are Agency power headers made from start to finish? Where do they claim they are made / manufactured?

How are Capristo headers made from start to finish? Where do they claim they are made?

Since you want to jump all over Fabspeed, let's be fair and find out about all our major exhaust vendors.

We already know Timate is made in Taiwan.

And I expect a reply within 24 hours.

 

I'd work on that but my friends are getting ready to jump off of a bridge and I have to go join them...well...just because....and after that I have to go to my room because my mom caught me lying about getting into trouble at school today...and she muttered something about two wrongs, not being something...but I couldn't hear the rest.

You are a worldclass troll. And I actually mean that with respect!

 

+10000


The two posters here that are getting all hissy fissy need to settle down.

The OP started a new thread and did not answer the question that everyone is asking.
The product is not in question but the information about the construction of the product.


Its a simple Yes the product is manufactured in USA or no the product is manufactured in taiwan. If that is the case then its as simple as stating that the product is deisgned in the USA..

BUT to keep skirting around the topic istead of confronting it head on makes fabspeed look very guilty, unproffesional and will make potential buyers wonder on the chance a claim was to be made that whether the company will standby their promises.

 

Personally, I don't use Fabspeed, I stick with OEM or Hill Engineering wherever possible, so I honestly and truly do not have a dog in this fight.

However, I think in the fog that has been cast over this debate, some real issues are being lost.

If I can, it seems to me the issue with Fabspeed has more to do with what it is to be "Made in America." Those are not words to be taken lightly. America has seen a wholesale shift in manufacturing, and as our economy has tightened we have watched our manufacturing jobs shift overseas. Moreover, it is a commonly held belief that American made products are among the best in the world. So we have at least two issues. (1) a belief in supporting those few american manufacturers who are fighting the good fight and insisting on making their products here, despite increased pressure to move operations abroad and (2) a perception that American quality control is superior to that of China, Taiwan, etc.

If Fabspeed is indeed claiming their products are "Made in America" within the statutory definition, they sure as hell better be, or they are doing an injustice not just to the consumer, but to the many other small american manufacturers who are doing their best to continue employing americans in american factories, despite the clear financial incentive to move elsewhere.

This issue is a lot bigger than headers. It goes to the very heart of what it is to "Buy American." I don't know what Fabspeed's deal is, but assuming the worst, its not about a bunch of Ferrari enthusiasts buying headers. Its about the cumulative effect of turning your back on American workers in the backroom, by claiming the opposite to the public.

Many of you may have a low opinion of American Labor and quality control. That's OK, but the intended audience to a claim of "Made in America" clearly does not. In fact, in some cases they are intentionally eschewing a cheaper foreign made product to support a local company.

FWIW, "they all do it" is not an excuse. It never is, for anything, and we shouldn't all become so jaded that we are willing to accept that as an excuse rather than demanding better.



Again, I don't know Fabspeed from a can of paint. I just thought I would try to reframe the issue if I could. For me, this is not about Fabspeed. If they are not manufacturing in America, they need to be explicit with the customer...whether they have in the past I don't know...but if not, I would personally appeal to them to make things unambiguous moving forward.

 

I know, I just am trying to get everyone to lighten up in this serious thread. I just laugh because like the Energizer Bunny.....it just keeps going, and going, and ............... Lol

The thing most of these people don't understand who are coming in late is someone called out Fabspeed, why he picked this week who knows, yet no one has called out any of the other exhaust manufactures. For example since he is pro Capristo, then he should show us their honesty in manufacturing info and part sources, then I would agree with everything.

 

Sheesh I'd hate to be looking over my shoulder and expecting a call from the Feds(FTC law enforcement) over this? Their claim is a clear violation of the standard for "Made in USA." "Designed and partially assembled in USA from Taiwan components" is more to the truth.

 

Well, I've had enough. I need new headers for my 355. Fabspeed can't answer questions that have been clearly asked by the community that supports their business.

The only bad news is, I now have to spend $5500 on new tubi headers.

 

Credible information has been provided that Febspeed 360/430 headers aren't what they are advertised to be, and Fabspeed is only fueling the speculations by not providing a clear response. If my 360 needs headers I would be reluctant to consider Fabspeed until they have cleared this mess. As a consumer I want to know what I'm buying. Their reluctance to do so does no good to their credibility.

If you have credible information that other exhaust manufacturers are misrepresenting their products why don't you start separate threads to enlighten the Ferrari community.

Jes

 

Great so when you look into the other manufacturers, let us know where they are made.