Plane crash on Rt. 287 in NJ | Page 2 | FerrariChat

Plane crash on Rt. 287 in NJ

Discussion in 'Aviation Chat' started by rdefabri, Dec 20, 2011.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. Roger103

    Roger103 Karting

    Sep 13, 2009
    112
    Full Name:
    Trim Tab
    On a King Air 200 that I use to fly we had ice vein doors on our Pratt and Whitney engines that we would deploy causing heavy air (rain, ice, etc) to not be able to make it into the induction. Everytime we depoly the doors, power was reduced and more throttle was needed to keep the same amount of power if it was available.
     
  2. solofast

    solofast Formula 3

    Oct 8, 2007
    1,773
    Indianapolis
    I'm not sure if the TBM has ice doors (I suspect that it does too) but you lose ram pressure on the engine inlet when you open them. If you aren't going that fast it isn't as big a deal, but at higher speeds inlet ram is considerable. Still an additional power loss that they didn't need at the time.
     
  3. Roger103

    Roger103 Karting

    Sep 13, 2009
    112
    Full Name:
    Trim Tab
    I remember when a King Air 90 was doing low level agriculture missions of some sort. The plane flew through a swarm of bugs and did not have the ice veins down (and there was no reason to have the doors open for the conditions) and the bugs cause flame outs on both engines. So flying fast or slow you dont want heavy objects like swarm of bugs, water or ice going into the engine. Some king air pilot i know only close those doors for takeoff and landings.
     
  4. Tcar

    Tcar F1 Rookie

    Roger..

    They are ICE VANES. I have blood in my veins. :)
     
  5. James_Woods

    James_Woods F1 World Champ

    May 17, 2006
    12,755
    Dallas, Tx.
    Full Name:
    James K. Woods
    It still reduced power. I was instructed that you should pull it on all the way even if it seemed to make things worse and sweat it out until the carb ice melted. It cost power even in non-icing conditions when you turned it on for landings.

    Cold air = good power. Hot air = less power. Carb blocked = no power.
     
  6. solofast

    solofast Formula 3

    Oct 8, 2007
    1,773
    Indianapolis
    The PT6 is an odd duck in that the compressor is at the back of the engine and the air turns around, after running under the engine, and enters the inlet. This results in more inlet losses and that costs you power and fuel all the time. Most PT6's have a screen around the inlet and that could get clogged, but the mesh is big, it would have to be a swarm of locust to clog one up. The long inlet also has the potential to have ice on the inlet walls, so that is a disadvantage of the design in that you have to heat more of the inlet.

    Opening the doors dumps the pressure in the inlet and lets the air pass through the inlet and out the back. Most of the time FOD does get trapped at the back of the inlet, it would take a whole lot of junk to clog up the inlet on a King Air, and the pilot should know if he is in a situation where he should open it.

    The ram pressure that you gain at 120 knots isn't much, about a 3% loss of power with the doors open, and since the engine is flat rated, at low altitude you wouldn't miss the power at all. At high speed and altitude you really should keep the doors closed unless you are in an icing situation. At 300 kts you lose about 18% of ram pressure that you would recover with the doors closed, and the engine has to make that up by burning more fuel and running hotter, which shortens engine life.

    While I'm sure there have been situations where engines got clogged, it's exceedingly rare and certainly not a reason to cruise with the doors open all the time.
     
  7. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 5, 2002
    26,265
    Portland, Oregon
    Full Name:
    Don
    I see that the basic question has already been answered. The TBM has both a heated inlet and ice vanes, so it's a double whammy. And, this was a TBM-700, not an 850. I believe that means it has even less power.
     
  8. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Miami 2018 Owner Social Subscribed

    Dec 1, 2000
    64,290
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    --------

    NTSB Identification: ERA12FA115
    14 CFR Part 91: General Aviation
    Accident occurred Tuesday, December 20, 2011 in Morristown, NJ
    Aircraft: SOCATA TBM 700, registration: N731CA
    Injuries: 5 Fatal.
    This is preliminary information, subject to change, and may contain errors.

    On December 20, 2011, about 1005 eastern standard time, a Socata TBM 700, N731CA, collided with terrain following an in-flight loss of aircraft control near Morristown, New Jersey. The airplane was registered to Cool Stream LLC and was operated by the pilot. Visual meteorological conditions prevailed and an instrument flight rules flight plan was filed for the flight from Teterboro, New Jersey (TEB) to Atlanta, Georgia (PDK). The personal flight was conducted under the provisions of 14 Code of Federal Regulations Part 91. The airplane sustained substantial damage. The certificated private pilot and four passengers were fatally injured. The flight originated from TEB at 0950.

    A preliminary review of recorded radar and voice communications revealed that the pilot was in communication with the Federal Aviation Administration, New York Air Route Traffic Control Center (ARTCC). While flying at 17,000 feet mean sea level (MSL) the pilot reported that he was in icing conditions. The pilot requested a climb, and the flight was subsequently cleared to flight level (FL) 200. The aircraft reached a maximum altitude of 17,900 feet and then began to descend. Radar and radio contact with N731CA was lost about 1005.

    The airplane impacted a wooded median on Interstate Highway 287, about 1 mile south of Morristown. Several sections of the airplane, including the propeller assembly, came to rest in a wooded area on the east side of the northbound lanes. A post-crash fire was evident in the highway median, where the fuselage came to rest. The outboard section of the right wing and several sections of the empennage were found about 0.25 miles southwest of the fuselage, in a residential area.

    The pilot held a private pilot certificate with ratings for airplane single-engine land and instrument airplane. He reported a total flight experience of 1,400 hours on his latest second-class medical certificate application, dated July 14, 2011.

    The airplane was manufactured in 2005 and equipped with a Pratt and Whitney Canada PT6A-64 turbo-prop engine. The most recent annual inspection was performed on July 27, 2011. At that time, the airplane had accumulated approximately 702.0 total flight hours. The last logbook entry was recorded on November 18, 2011, at an aircraft total time of 724.6 hours.

    The wreckage was recovered to a storage facility, where a detailed examination will be performed NTSB.

    --------
     

Share This Page