I will recieve a lot of hate for this, but I'll say it :)

Ian Callum isn't at Aston Martin, and hasn't been for a while now. He's the design director for Jaguar Cars, and (IMO) a true design genius. Marek Reichmann, IIRC, is the design director at Aston.

 

Ferrari needs to hire "ingegnere" to design all future cars.

 

(Serious question). Does anyone know if the new F12 is a hatch back?

 

More of a fast back than hatch.

 

We can call it whatever we want. The question is when accessing the storage area in the back, beneath the glass 'fast back', does the back window pivot up and down like the FF?

 

Appears so. ChalStrad has seen it in person and has said this is the case. It is different than the FF because it's mostly window and very little bodywork. Look at the rear shot of the car and see body panel gap on each side that stop at the small rear lip.

 

correct on both,although Callum's brother is at Ford

 

I actually mostly agree with the OP.

Based on the pictures so far, the car is pretty. It has good proportions. And it looks good. But it isn't is dramatic. When the 458 Italia came out it was beyond cool and looked pretty over the top and a suitable replacement for the 430. It was dramatic.

Ultimately we will all have to wait to see the car, and while I can say (so far) I'm not really disappointed with the car, but just kinda thinking it looks "good". Lukewarm I guess. As styles change and perhaps once I see the car in real life, this will change. But at least it isn't ugly like the FF (my opinion).

 

This thread was started based on a single grainy cellphone pic of a styling buck!

I think today's reveal has added a bit to suggest that one pic wasn't even a small part of the styling story.

 

Didn't your Mom ever teach you if you don't have something nice to say, don't say it at all I think the new line up is sick and I can't wait to step out of my car that I currently have and into the new line up!

 

I have to agree. All of the Ferraris look too similar now. I can understand a mainstream manufacturer creating a similar looking lineup but not a niche company like Ferrari. Sure there will be similarities but I feel like they been blahzay in the design department over the last decade (except for the Enzo and 458). The motor is amazing, that's it. All of the interiors look the same, and the F12 looks like the California raped the 599. Boring and not very exotic looking. I would have loved to see Ferrari make something Testarossa-ish to replace the 599. There is nothing wrong with recycling designs so long as you have a model or two separating them.

Regardless I know they won't have any problem selling them. People want Ferrari because it's Ferrari.

 

I think modern auto design in general is pretty bad. Very rare I see anything that makes my jaw drop (in a good way).

 

Everyone wants to make the fastest car and unfortunately you can't change physics. Aerodynamics rules all. I think too many people are forgetting about that... Hmm... Maybe that is why every brand in NASCAR and F1 look exactly alike?!?!?!

Fortunately for you guys, everyone is entitled to their own opinion! I think they should start a room just for the New Ferrari Haters so you don't have to rain on the parade of ones like me who are enthused about the new line up

 

No John930 is not talking baloney.

There are some Ferrari purchasers that put money down before the car has even got passed the "We are thinking of building this" discussion. There are people that have already put money down for the Enzo replacement, for example.

Some people would still purchase the car in your photo if Ferrari announced it as a new model tomorrow because they are IMO not really car enthusiasts, just have to have the latest Ferrari. Too much money for their own good. The F430 and F612 IMO are perfect examples both uglier than the models they replaced but people still bought them ...

I also believe there are people out there that are so badge struck they would buy your photographed car even if it had the performance of the Toyota (I think) in the photo!, after all it is still a Ferrari.
Pete

 

I like the Lexus LF1, or whatever it is called. Fairly different, IMO has better lines than the F12 (with the weird side swoop thing and way TOO high rear).

Pete

 

I agree and wonder how the future will play out since most of the design houses that created the best designs of the past are going under or being acquired. Giugiaro Bertone and Pininfarina all but gone.

IMO the day the bumper laws changed was the turning point. It eliminated chrome bumpers and all the trim that went with it. Sort of like taking the jewelry off a beautiful women.

 

I cant understand this quest for speed that is unusable except on a race track...and even then 95% of drivers cant use it. Oh well.

I also dont think this is 'hating'. Its simply having an opinion (that goes beyond just Ferrari). Are we going to follow the 'No Child Left Behind' mentality where everything is a winner and nothing can be criticized ?

Finally, if you read my posts I think the F12 is pretty good looking for a modern car, but I want better than 'pretty good looking'. I want something that I lust after and thats really hard to find these days.

I agree on bumper laws. Really hurt auto design.

 

Honestly, there are several reasons -- and it's not all the designers fault.

First, it's the involvement of Marketing. Marketing departments put forth the product specs through research and their own personal beliefs -- even if they have no experience in the area. They direct and sign off on the styling to "fit" that spec of who they are targeting. And, they don't like to take risks. It's "Safety first" as it's billions of $$$ at stake --and their careers. Gone are the John Deloreans and Lee Iococca's of the auto word. That's soooooo 80's.

Second its regulations. There are regulations for how to follow regulations. None of that existed until the mid 70's. Because of this, style takes a back seat to everything from safety to fuel economy to emissions to crash worthiness to hitting a pedestrian. Most all of these effect styling to a large degree.

Third it's what people expect from cars today is different. Gone are the days when we would laugh about our Etype not starting on a drizzly day. Today, that's a law suit and lemon law return. It's nasty things passed around in chat rooms where all dirty laundry is aired. Because of this, engineering has more pull than designers on many issues. Blame the Japanese (or thank them depending on your point of view).

Fourth its cost and ROI. It takes billions to develop a car today because of all of the above. And, it takes a lot more money to recoup that. So, margins need to be made higher to make sure that the investment will pay off eventually. Because of this, cost reduction is a key element in the design phase. In addition, International sales are a big part of the equation and there's a strong effort to get a platform that works easily in all of them -- not to mention common parts sharing.


It's easy to blame designers. Believe me --- designers are NOT worse or less creative than they used to be. They are wasted making stupid retromobiles in the Chip Foose style to aging baby boomers and fulfilling the demands of the market and economics of today.

That is the real story. Like every industry, it ain't 1969 anymore. As a company, you have to deal with the new reality or die.

 

Very true. We are in another begining as that of the 70's. With gas reaching near $6 per gallon soon, this will officialy enter us in the zero emissions era. This will indeed change the style and mechanics of our cars as those of years past did.

Right-------Every old man wants to remember thier "first time" in that old tricked out Camaro that Foose is dishing out. I am to, tired of it.

 

I do agree that the 458 is a masterpiece and that masterpieces tend to come along rarely. But I do not agree that the styling of the F12 is unoriginal. One can argue over whether it is a masterpeice but unoriginal it is not.

 

Does this offer extend to everyone?

 

Everyone has an opinion, which is why I suppose we all come here. To get upset about someone else's opinion seems silly. It's a subjective thing.

The 458 is REVOLUTIONARY and I'll go out on a limb and call it an instant classic. A huge departure from what came before. It isn't about whether it appeals to me or not, but you have to at least acknowledge that 25 years from now, the 458 is more likely to be considered a classic than the 430 it replaced. The design of the 458 is also a reflection on what the car is supposed to be.

Add a bunch of diffusers, wings, intakes and other bling to a California and it would be a disaster. I love the California. It looks like what it is ... a GT car. Styling elements that some would consider necessary for such a car would make it look silly, in my opinion.

The FF will also be remembered in 25 years. Not sure if it will be remembered in a good way or a bad way, but there is certainly no mistaking it with a 612 and I applaud Ferrari for making it. It would be far, far worse if it was a dud. It is not. The performance of that car is lauded as brilliant, so think what you will about the design, but it would appear that the engineers got it right. Again, for what it is.

As for this, it represents a significant enough departure from the 599 that it will stand on its own. Hard to get a feel from pictures, but I like it, save for the foglight (still not sure about that one). Time will be the true judge, of course, but the car will sell and it will sell well. Luckily for Ferrari, they don't have to appeal to millions. They're not making Camrys. There are so few people who can afford these cars that they will meet whatever sales goals they have, and demand will easily outpace supply. I'm willing to wager that the performance reviews will verify that the car is spectacular. Mission accomplished, our collective opinions be damned.

 

Something you have to stop doing.

Stop pitting Lamborghini vs Ferrari. Its almost like comparing apples to oranges these days. Ferrari's brand is so strong globally they don't have to try and "stick it" to Lamborghini. It was a report today on Italiaspeed about Lambo. How they've barely sold any cars for the past 3 years & how the global recession didn't affect Ferrari one bit. Lambo execs are doing cart wheels because they sold 300 more cars so far this year. Lamborghini isn't a main competitor to Ferrari IMO. Look at each company's profit margin balance sheet. Its no contest. Lamborghini is still doing what it tried to do 40 years ago. Upstage Ferrari at every turn, but that doesn't make car sales.

Lamborghini has boxed itself in a corner. They can only make 2 models that look nearly identical and make any money off it. All the cars you mentioned above are nothing but rehased evolutions. I've been mad and upset with Ferrari in the past with some styling cues. But I have to give Ferrari credit, they have courage and balls to design and create a car in totally different directions while making great cars to actually drive.

The 288 looks nothing like the Testarossa. The TR looks nothing like the 550/575, the 575 looks nothing like the 599. The F355 looks nothing like the 360, the 430 looks nothing like the 458. The F40 looks nothing like the Enzo. The Aventador is nothing but an evolution of the Countach. And to be honest the Countach has aged UGLY!!!! I wouldn't drive a Coutach to a dog fight. Those things looks so out dated tacky and cheap. They look like a bad space ship design from a B movie like Flash Gordon. Lamborghi hasn't created anything fresh or original in 40 years. Even the Gallardo, thats nothing but a small Countach.

Ferrari's strategy is to make 1 space ship halo vehicle once every 10 years. The mid engine V8 will be sporty and exotic. The front engine V8 will be practical along with the FF. I agree with you about the FF's looks but you have to understand the crowd Ferrari is aiming to sell that car to. They aren't looking to sell that car to rich 30-45 year old single guys. I don't expect Ferrari's 2+2s to be jaw dropping anymore. Not all F customers want their cars to be ultra flashy. I personally thought the 599 was a little too conservative but the F12 looks great, I just don't like the large grill. You have to understand Ferrari is trying to turn a profit. You can't make any money just buy selling over the top styling. I'll bet you anything if Audi puts the Lambo SUV concept into production its going to flop. Nobody will buy it because its not over the stop styled. Thats all Lamborghini is known for.

 

Funny, I just got off the phone with my Brother in law RE: this subject and now I see it on this forum. He too has a Ferrari so no bias opinions . I support the direction in which Ferrari is going and he does NOT. I respect his view.