Senna

When the film debuted in Austin (at SXSW in March '11), with an intro plus Q & A after by the director (Kapadia, i think?), he was asked about the somewhat obvious bias against Prost in the film. His answer? "Well, the film is called 'Senna' afterall."

There ya have it.

 

Lol!

 

Some other top drivers who survived the 1950s were Tony Brooks, Maurice Trintignant, and Dr Farina.........ironically, since he was a danger to himself and others on the track, survived many crashes, and was killed in a road accident in 1966.

And I don't believe Senna's fatal crash was caused by car failure.....just that the cars were nasty things at that time that had huge grip in a very narrow window, and Senna just briefly got out of that window when he hit a bump.

Paul M

 

Who knows what the cause was. It sucks and was ugly to watch. As well as Roland Ratzenbergers crash the day prior. One thing that Bernie has done very well since then was promote track safety.

 

fwiw ... I'm pretty convinced Senna's fatal crash was caused by steering column failure at the bad weld. Couple reasons : a human can't "hold" a wheel with enough resistive force to cause the steering column to break where/how it did as a result of the crash, and also Senna's reaction times were the stuff of legend ... he had enough time to steer from the direct impact (if he indeed had control of the car).

I know, i know ... debated to death, never to be resolved.

just my 2 cents

 

It's been debated for years and years, sometimes in a court room. The short answer is we'll never know;

- If you adored him the way many of us do, the car broke - It's incomprehensible that he lost it.
- If you weren't such a fan, he was reckless and was pushing too hard etc.

The *only* good thing to come from it was the immediate heightened awareness of safety issues. IIRC, Professor Sid had just joined the circus and he insisted on a rescue chopper and safety car following 'em from the next race on for example.

Cheers,
Ian

 

Yep, 2 sides to every story (or is it 3?)....the Williams that year was a very nervous, twitchy car and only adds fuel to the "mechanical failure/he lost it" debate.

No one has died in F1 since although Kubby came close in Canada.

 

Agree on both points. My only real complaint with the Senna film was how Prost was portrayed as a whiny villain and Senna a golden God. It's well-known that Senna could complain with the best of them...

 

I think both of them were 'gods', but both drove very differently and achieved largely the same results. Piquet was right up there with them at the time, to me he was a somewhat cross between the two.
All three were winners.

 

He did, along with Ross Brawn and even Jean Todt.

Funny how he doesn't seem to be getting any better (position-wise) last year or this year.

 

Senna always pushed beyond the limit of what other drivers would and that is what made him so great, he even mentions that in his documentary. I also witnessed Bergers accident at Tamburello and was amazed he survived but racing is very fickle and the results and outcome are in Gods hands.

We all know that Senna's accident was not from driver error. Williams was using a power steering system that season which Ayrton complained about and reportedly a poorly done weld on the steering shaft broke and then..............

 

Senna was not only supremely talented, he was also dedicated. My lasting memory is from practice for the 1988 German GP. It was wet, and nobody but backmarkers went out. Oh, and Senna, who hammered around for the entire session. Sunday it rained, and nobody ever saw him again.

That said, Senna was also the worst thing ever to happen to F1. The things he did, and was allowed to get away with, fundamentally changed the nature of the sport. Senna should never have been allowed back in an F1 car after Suzuka 1990 (?) when he deliberately took Prost off at the start. He did the same to Mansell mid-race in Canada(?) one year, but it was not caught on film.

If even Lauda, who freely admitted to banging wheels around the back of the circuit in the old days when no cameras were watching, didn't like Senna's ethics, that says something. Anyone who claims Schumacher did unethical things on track needs to point their finger straight at Senna. It was Senna who made such behaviour the norm.

 

I fully agree, and not because being french: I don't think I have a bias towards Prost, I was rather "neutral" between the two at the time (besides, Prost wasn't truly popular in France, but that's another story...).
I still think that ethics are important in sport; Senna was, without any question, hugely talented and dedicated; but he could also display bad faith to the point of dishonesty.
This has been discussed and commented by a lot of people better qualified than me (Jackie Stewart and others).
As a driver, he was supreme; I admired him a lot; as a man and a sportsman, he was a flawed genius that I disliked. Therefore, I still have mixed feelings about the guy.

 

+1, i Also admire Senna for his amazing talent but his behaviour in and outside the track was not worthy of a champion. I leave here a quote from keke Rosberg...

Keke Rosberg Quote: "To Gilles, racing truly was a sport, which is why he would never chop you. Something like that he'd look on with contempt. You didn't have to be a good driver to do that, let alone a great one. Anyone could do that. Gilles was the hardest bastard I ever raced against, but completely fair. If you'd beaten him to a corner, he accepted it and gave you room. Then he'd be right back at you at the next one! Sure, he took unbelievable risks - but only with himself - and that's why I get pissed off now when people compare Senna with him. Gilles was a giant of a driver, yes, but he was also a great man."

 

After watching the movie this past week-end, I remembered why I never liked Senna or Prost. They were both cheats and crybaby's,

 

LOLOLO, well, i personaly never liked them because they where kicking Ferrari´s ass for so long!!!!

 

Most of the recent champs are also.

 

Err, who, exactly?

I don't think that charge has been made against Seb and certainly not JB, Fred or Kimi.

*Maybe* Mcham, but that all depends on your POV. () Then we're back to Michael and while he's hard, he's not any kind of crybaby IMO.

Cheers,
Ian

 

Alonso is always crying about something, he and Hammy are the worst...Sebs complayning about Narain was pretty crappy too

 

Guys:
At least we can all agree that none of today's drivers had the talent/determination of Senna and/or Prost.

 

Accept for Schumacher.

 

Yeap, we tend to forget he still races....

 

I hate to revive an old thread but there's an interview with Jo Ramirez in an old issue of F1 racing that provides a more complete explaination. Prost didn't really do it on purpose, he had just signed for Ferrari and the crowd was screaming for him to give them the cup. He felt like that was the only thing he could do so he dropped the cup into the crowd. When Prost returned to the team, Ron Dennis was there and slammed the constructors cup at his feet, he was so incensed. Ramirez, years later, arranged to have a replica cup made and had Alain give it to Ron Dennis during some sort of ceremony.

 

Explaination? Why was Prost not popular? It's not that I know any better. Very curious