Here is the issue with large payments up front from the customer viewpoint. 1: Shop can go out of business the next day. Kiss the money goodbye. (this happens all the time with crooks or business on the edge) 2: if a dispute arise, all you got at best is your car back (or what is left of it) In my opinion if the job is less than a month and below the 5 digits , the shop ought to foot the bill and get payment at the end. Just like any other repair shop If the expense is large, the job can be broken up in "projects" and pay as it goes. Sometime you may not have a choice but going a route you dont like (time, availability, closeness) but I am always very nervous when someone ask for too much up front since i got cought by a crook like this some decads ago.
Please allow my comments in clarification of Tony's post which I can vouch for 100%: The 1979 Countach LP400S Series One # 1121036 is the car in question. This car made the rounds on EBay several times 2007 without selling when Scott B owned it. That is a matter of public record. Subsequently, Tony purchased the car from Cats Exotics fully intending to keep the car as his own (in fact the car resided at his home and is much-imaged in his garage). As with a good percentage of Countach deals that go down, I was consulted on the deal and Tony seemed satisfied with what he paid. There was a Ford GT trade involved. Accordingly, I know exactly what Tony paid for 1036. I made him an offer shortly thereafter which he turned down. Tony then set about investing many hours in detailing the car, and correcting some errors, all with a view to keeping the car long-term. Some 8/9 months later, a client of mine searching for a great car caused me to make Tony a 2nd much higher offer. This offer was about 1.75 times what Tony paid (not 3 times as is falsely reported here), and was given by a long-term collector client of mine who often looks ahead of the current market to acquire the best cars (this strategy affords him the best cars and the market seems to catch up and surpass his purchase number soon). What I did for Tony is exactly what I do for many of my clients time & time again - I sell their cars for top dollar, often times at a very significant profit from the number they purchased it at. I pride myself in facilitating this as my method of operation and am known amongst my clients for this. I am very happy I was able to afford the same for Tony because I know he sold the car only to invest in his business. As an aside: why the sale of the car almost a year later should cause an issue with someone who owned the car prior to Tony's ownership, escapes me. Clearly, it is nobody's business besides seller, new buyer & facilitator (if one exists). Some people have foresight, or luck, or a combination thereof. Some don't. But as the old adage goes: "Timing is everything". I have missed out on my fair share of market increases after I sold a car, but I certainly don't cry about it publicly. Having bought 1036 from Tony, and facilitated 2 other car deals with him (3 deals in total), I can say that for me he was always a man of his word, thoughtful and straightforward, and our deals went as smooth as silk. He always did what he said he would, on time. I would do a car deal with him tomorrow, whereas I cannot say that for many others in the Lamborghini world. Lastly, regarding the restoration side, I have never seen Tony's shop, or his work, so I simply cant comment. My dealings with him were solely on the deal-making side and I recall them fondly. Hope this helps paint a fuller picture.. Best,
"Please allow my comments in clarification of Tony's post which I can vouch for 100%:" I had a long response all typed up here..but deleted it as I have no need to start throwing mud back and forth...it is what it was and is... I do find it intresting that you can not back Tony's shop our his work...after all you have referred his work and shop to multiple clients to bring their cars there...since you have quit using your long time previous shops of George Evens and Gary Bobalieff for reasons that I am sure you have an answer for???
I am sure you find a lot of things interesting, but you ought to know me by now, I'm happy to discuss anything, with pleasure, especially when it concerns you! Meanwhile, perhaps you care to comment to the community-at-large why you continue to come on these threads and issue false proclamations such as declaring that Tony sold his car for 3 times what he paid you - an outright falsehood which along with your suggestion of collusion or skulduggery in a public venue maligns Tony's standing unfairly. Your most recent posted falsehoods are: 1. That I have referred "multiple" clients to Tony's shop. False. One single person discussed sending a car there and sought my opinion, but travelled to Florida themselves to meet Tony in person and see his operation BEFORE sending a car there. In the end, that person declined to do the work Tony advised him to do. 2. Another falsehood you have reported here is your suggestion that I have "quit" using George Evans. False. I have had a 10-year-plus relationship with George Evans and it was 100% based on parts-supply only. I have never used him for maintenance or repair work, ever. If I need a part which George has tomorrow, I would be on the phone and he would supply it. My dealings with him have been just like my dealings with Tony, smooth as silk, no issues. As regards Gary Bobileff (please note the correct spelling of his last name), I must have missed the press bulletin I released declaring that I have "quit" doing business with him. Whilst we have had our differences of opinion on car deals, the truth is that in recent times I am not finding that my clients are wanting to buy project cars and have them fully restored (Gary's speciality), so I have not had to recommend them to any restorer, Gary or anyone else! As regards differences of opinion with Gary on business matters, next you will be trying to have us believe that hasn't happened with you in some very notable instances ?? A while ago, per your own trumpeting of your activities, it seemed like all your cars went to Steve Gleaner @ Driven Exotics. Next, you waxed lyrical about your dealings with Evans. Who's next? I have a few more shops I can suggest also, as you move along from shop-to-shop. The bottom line is, either you are extremely poorly informed, or exaggeration is your stock-in-trade, or a combination thereof. Yet you seem very happy to falsely accuse others in a public venue of many things in a characteristic shouting tirade of illiterate drivel based on poor intelligence. Honestly, I do not know of another person in business who willingly paints such a poor public picture of themselves without any assistance from detractors whatsoever. Truly. For a guy who lives in a glass house (and a thin-gauge one at that), you sure do cast a lot of stones! Something that is important to impart here is best explained with Enzo Ferrari's famed proclamation: "Shoot, but aim correctly". Plainly put, if anyone wishes to disparage another person's integrity on a public forum, they better not be carrying a gun loaded with blanks. It is one thing to seek clarification, and entirely another to malign, so come with facts, figures & docs that support the claim. Or expect the same unfair treatment in return. I also think that anyone with an issue should man up and make the claim themselves, and not do it through a third party or behind a veil of anonymity. The latter method takes away all credibility of a claim. If you have a problem, step up, identify yourself, and present your case properly and in full. Meanwhile, I know a man of integrity when I deal with one. Tony is that, no question. However, the maintenance & restoration business is fraught with issues & difficulties ranging from parts problems, costs well above estimates, quality of work issues and timeframes exceeded. I've restored my fair share of cars so I ought to know. That said, as I have already pointed out, I am not in a position to comment about Tony's maintenance & restoration operation because I have never seen the work in person. But if you are asking whether I would refer someone to him tomorrow for him to do work on their car, my answer is that, yes, I would. My reason is that Tony has shown himself to me to be the type of man of integrity who is always looking to improve their game, and put any past issues firmly behind them. I relate to such people.
Peter, Since you find our deposit system so disturbing and bad business, I will explain it a little further: When I started the first franchise of DMC 8+ years ago, the president of the company told me after 30 years in the business: he wanted me to do 60% up front, additional 20% at the 80% completion mark and 20% at delivery on jobs over $5,000. I did not understand this approach until almost every other customer, be it DMC, Lambo, Ferrari, Corvette, you name it... all disappear on business and personal trips when their car is complete. Now I'm sure some were legitimate, and some were just not their "priority" but any business has expenses and even though I do have more than enough to cover the jobs, I would not for long if 3 or 4 very large jobs decided to pay when ever they get around to it. I was very flexible with the deposit system before the recession, during and after the policy became less flexible. I have had customers ask to pay as they go "monthly" and we have made exceptions over the years. I am willing to work with any customer on any budget. We have made some changes where we will no longer sub out some work do to extreme time delays. I work every day on making the business better for the customers and cars, that has been my focus and the reason I have not posted much on F-chat. Tony Ierardi
Tony, Because I have mainly dealt with straight cars deals with you, I was unaware of your restoration shop terms & conditions until it was brought up in this thread. Following your explanation detailed above, and given that you are restoring Lamborghinis and not Hondas, it sounds like a perfectly reasonable business plan. Members of the public are free to decide if it fits their parameters or not.
Hey Peter, What's with the Tony bashing? As an ex employee I personally can assure you that no corners were ever cut.... no matter the circumstance!!!! I thought you were supposed to be a driving coach. Guess you changed professions. Bye the way were are all the world champions you coached?
"We are a full service shop and you are right about one thing for sure, doing "only" what the customer wants to pay for can sure come back to screw you (me) in this case. That will never happen again without the customer signing off at the bottom of the invoice that they are aware of our recommendations and have refused necessary work." Tony Very curious about this statement. I certainly hope you are not disparaging me or the work you did on the LM I sold to Roy. I can certainly remind you about that deal, our disputes and your remedy but you asked me to keep it confidential. I am certainly willing to explain it if your response to Roy is to somehow drag my actions into your defense.
All I wanted to know when I started this thread was how much power the car made. sorry I opened this can of worms for those involved.
LOL! 1-Never really said cut corners. 2-Never knew I was a driving coach. Maybe you should stop thinking so much. 3-I have not changed professions, still at the same ole job. 4-Never knew I coached world champions, but if I did, I would have coached Jimmy Clark and Fernando Alonso and Damon Hill. Dude, you are just f-ing weird. Try not to post agian.
John, My statement was about countless times this has happened to me with many customers over the years. I was not referring to you or any of your cars. Tony
