New Saner-style Swaybar - Group Buy

BTW, it may be possible to finesse the bar into the U channel of the lower control arm leg, but the longish spacer would still be needed, and installing the bolt would be a problem, and it wouldn't be optimal.

Edit. This wouldn't work well. The bars need to be wider. I have 8" rims and 245/45-17 tires, and there would still be plenty of tire clearance.

Doug

 

This is concerning. Does anyone know if the original Saner sway bar for the 308 actually worked? If Addco fabricated the sway bar to the print, i would have to wonder if they did indeed get the right drawing of the part that was put in production.

 

They didn't work off a print, they bought Ferrari sway bars. Since they didn't have an fcar, they wouldn't have known about the control arm interference. I am the trial and fit monkey.

Doug

 

Appreciate your help Doug.

 

First, thank you for your efforts. Second, I would imagine this will set the delivery back quite a bit. Any guess on how long? Will you be talking with Addco very soon?

 

Doug, thanks for volunteering.

I remember from older threads on the Saner bars there was discussion of an interference issue with the front bar.

When the suspension is at full drop (as in car on stands) the tie rod/steering arm tip area would collide with the bar/end-link with the steering at full lock.

I realize the car doesn't see that condition in normal use but people have questioned it when thinking about hitting a pothole during a turn or tracking the car and having a wheel drop off an edge or what not.

Any observations there?

 

Front bar trial this weekend, with luck.

I have already left a message at ADDCO about the rear bar,a nd will contact them again Monday.

I will keep an eye out for front bar issues at full lock and unloaded suspension.

I am sure these will be just fine, once it is known exactly how they must be configured. it isn't rocket science. I have been designing and building things far more complex than sway bars for decades.

Doug

 

I will see if ADDCO will let me cut the rear bar in half, that way, i can fit up both ends best way and measure the gap in the middle.

Doug

 

Just mount one side correctly and measure to the center point of the chassis. Then double it to get the corredt length overall. No need to cut anything.

 

I can't, that just makes the other side control arm interference worse. No way to get the bar over at all, unless it hangs way, way down at a 45* angle,a nd that is way beyond the extension of the heim joint.

Doug

 

Doug, any chance you could post a pic or two to help the rest of us visualize what's going on?

I just measured my stock rear bar with the stock 225/50 R16 and I have 1 5/8" clearance between the end of the bar and the tire. Same clearance on both sides.

I'm going to be running 10" wide 360 wheels on the rear of my car this summer, so widening the bar (more than stock) would be tricky for my case. I was going to get rid of the stock drop links, narrow the bar slightly and swap to heim joints to make the stock bar work. Of course, you guys have to build the bars to work best for the group and then I'll figure out if I can mod the rear bar or figure out a different course for that end of the car.

 

Not a Saner bar but, here's a 22mm rear bar I had custom made out of 4130 chromoly steel that works perfect. I took my original rear bar to the shop and they just copied the shape. I just have to change my end links.
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Here you go, the last one is out of focus, but you can see how the bar doesn't come close to the Heim joint, and that there is plenty of clearance between the heim joint and tire. the springs come closer to my tires than the Heim joint does.

If the bar is widened so it attaches at the outside of the heim joints, it will clear the control arm in all three hole positions, and not add any significant width, just the thickness of the bar (about 1/2" at connection point) and bolt head height, not getting anywhere near the tires

Doug
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Comparing the two sway bar pictures you can see what they forgot to include in the layout. Can you use a piece of all-thread and double nut it at both ends to span the gap?

 

It would still hit the control arms. The all thread would bend, anyway.

Doug

 

Slick little setup. Very cool, Mike!

As the other guys have said, thanks for doing all of the leg work for us here, Doug. Much appreciated.

 

Both the front and rear saner bars suffer from being too narrow.
They made up for this by installing thin thin aluminum spacers that allowed more misalignment. Torquing them down distorts them.

I have railed against this for years.

Here is a photo of my fix, not elegant but strong enough.

I used a hardened allenbolts to take the single shear twist.

A piece of all thread is about as weak as you could get other than going with a thinner diameter bolt. Not recommended. Sorry, don't mean to be peevish :

Too bad they didn't make the bars wider.

Note the skinney black aluminum spacers and the still bad angularity. I was affraid to tighten them up much. still, look at the bell mouthing of the black aluminum sleeve.

The last photo shows the longer allen bolt, the nut used as a spacer to get the linkl vertical and the "safety washers" which help with both the spacing and the ability to tolerate more drop link angularity.

Having the bars the right width would be best, but it can be fixed with stronger bolts, a spacer, and the safety washers.

Hope this helps,
chris
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

I don’t mean to argue ( I love to argue) but if the all-thread is double nut with washers there would only be about an 1/8 gap between the nuts, I know, that’s what she said. It will not bend unless there is 2” or more without support. All-thread is just a short bolt without a head on it.
I did not realize the hemi joint was not adjustable like most are.
I would also like to thank you for for installing them as quick as you did and trying to make it work.

 

All thread is not just a short bolt without a head.

The tensile strength off all thread is about 78KPSI, the tensile strength of a grade 8 bolt is in the 170-180 KPSI range is memory serves me correctly.

Google mechanical stress risers and see why all thread is a really bad idea. The thread root is a stress riser. You have a weak material, with stress risers, put under repetitive, alternating shear load, I doubt all thread would last 100 miles before it snapped.

The heims are adjustable, but if you read my previous posts, they would have to be adjusted so far out that the bar would hang down at about a 45* angle and still wouldn't allow installing into the first hole , the heims won't adjust out 6" anyway.

I have a lathe and mill and welding equipment, and have a degree in mechanical engineering, I am perfectly capable of making this bar work, if it was the last bar on earth, but why? This was a trial bar to see how it would fit. I tried the bar, it doesn't really fit, so we will get bars made that will fit.

Doug

 

Once finalized, Addco should call this the DSW Bar (Doug Sway Bar)!

 

OK, got permission to cut the rear bar.

the correct length for the bar should be 3.5" to 3.925" longer than it is now, that puts the forge of the bar outboard of the heim joints and allows about 1/4" between the joint and the bar on each side if the bar was lengthened 3.92".

The front bar fits, but, it needs to be adjusted to clear the tie rod ends, see pic. This can be done by kicking the forge ends of the bar up at about a 50* angle from horizontal such that the three holes are in a horizontal plane when the bar is installed.

Doug
Image Unavailable, Please Login
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

I'm glad that you're providing them with this feedback. And I can't wait to install these sway bars. Thanks for all of your efforts, Doug.

Sean

 

i am also going to see about reconfiguring the front bar for better tire/wheel clearance, i have wider than stock, and I can see that will be the next interference after the tie rod end is dealt with.

Doug

 

I faxed sketches and dims to Ernie at ADDCO for the front bar mods.

Doug