F-1 Is it me or the car - or both

There's something wrong. Properly adjusted, you wouldn't feel anything when putting the car into gear. You would hear something, but the car would not lunge, lurch or move in any way.

 

Is your RPM higher than 1000 at idle?

 

from neutral into gear, you can hear a slight clunk over the engine and feel a slight nudge. Never had anything more than that.

 

Ah F1. So happy I bought a stick.

Have they checked the PIS, or the point of slip of the clutch perhaps..

 

Oh yes, I have driven many that buck. The throttle when not deftly applied will contribute to a bucking sensation. Let me guess... It stops bucking if you lift off the throttle?

Its your first day. You will get use to it & learn how to drive out of it. Its not like a 348.

 

Your F1 may need to be adjusted or...

+1; You need to get acclimated to the system and how to work with it. For instance, on my 430 (newer more advanced F1 than your 360, but still a good example); My lovely complained about the shifting roughness our first date night. It turns out;
1. I was not "working with the car"
2. I had it in Sport, with sloppy'er shifting. Race mode shifts more like I do in my 6 speeds.
3. I just needed some experience driving the system. It is great, but like anything, you need to learn how to treat it.

 

See here:

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/360-430/343894-360-f1-bucking-first.html

 

See the thread linked above, this issue has come up before. While a little bit is learning how to apply the throttle, it really should be almost as easy as driving an automatic. So you need to go in for service and have your PIS set correctly at least. It's a 20 minute fix if that is all it is.

 

You will destroy the clutch very quickly if you back up an incline in reverse. The F1 computer slips the clutch in reverse. Never ever back up a hill with an F1 car!

Do a search on do's and don't's of F1 equipped cars and you will find many threads.

 

I would guess that you have a problem. Mine is very forgiving no matter how I treat the throttle. The things I did notice are that it seems to be the happiest if I make believe it's a stick shift and apply throttle accordingly. When starting out in first, I feather it as if I'm releasing the clutch, once it's fully engaged, then I apply more throttle.
Unfortunately, sometimes if I want to take off abruptly (~1/2 throttle), but not a race type start, it may jerk forward a little harder than I want it to, but it won't buck continuously like yours. On a stickshift if I wanted to take off like that, I would just slip the clutch a little bit more than normal, and I would still get a smooth and quick start. In the case of the F1, I have to assume that the computer thinks that you want to take off quicker than you want to (because of the abrupt throttle), and it kind of pops the clutch. It feels weird when it does that, because you only applied a quick 1/2 throttle, and didn't floor it. Other than that situation, it seems to read my mind! It definitely takes getting used to, but I'm pretty sure that it shouldn't buck. I wonder if there is a bad speed sensor or something like that? Or if the PIS isn't set properly, as others have suggested? Either way, I would have a mechanic test drive it, and fix it if necessary. You don't want to ruin the expensive clutch if things are not working properly.

 

Can you take a quick video of this action with the camera showing the Tach and Speedo? This will allow third party evaluations. The viewer will not have access to your throttle application, so maybe you can verbalize that in the short video.

If you have an iphone, you can just upload it straight from the iphone right after you shoot the video, just click the share icon at the bottom of the video viewing screen and select YouTube (*Assuming you have a youtube acct, if not create one, might come in handy, its free and all [boy I must love commas])

Here is my 430 pulling off from a stop sign with light throttle application so you can watch speed and rpm and see the clutch lockup.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9MwHuJPkEtc]F430 launch for clutch slip test - YouTube[/ame]

*Note: I can make my 430 buck like a bronco if i am driving a steady 15-20mph and downshift to 1st with minimal throttle input. It will oscillate and buck, like the software's PID (proportional-integral-derivative controller) has a large error or the gain is too high for the rpm and load. I suspect their gain scheduling at low rpm needs further tuning. One thing is for sure, they are getting better at this and dual clutches are extremely tolerant to PID tuning as compared to single clutch systems.

+1; backing up hill will excessively wear clutch, as will full throttle and high-load shifting.

Some GREAT DIYs here on de-stickying

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/360-430/391833-diy-sticky-interior-repair-using-degreaser-elbow-grease.html

Lastly; Post your progress with your F1 so others can benefit.

 

I got my first ferrari in September and it too was my first F1 transmission car. Like you, I experienced the kangaroo hopping and I was concerned it was the car. I took the car to my tech and he confirmed that the clutch, etc was fine. He made one adjustment that you may find helpful. My car idles at 1000 rpm. With the car on a flat surface, the F1 in first gear, take your foot off the break. The car should not creep forward. Now gently apply the throttle and the clutch should start to engage as the revs increase. In my case he set he PIS to engage at 1050 rpm which on my car was a PIS of 4.8. At this point of initial slippage, gently keep the pressure on the throttle until you feel the clutch fully engage. Once the clutch has fully engaged, you can proceed normally. I was having a tendency to back off the throttle and re-applying it which would induce the bucking. I would not be surprised that your experience is same as mine.

I suggest you get the car to normal operating temp and test for creep in first gear. If that seems good, then more than likely it is your driving technique. Develelop a deft foot. Do not back off the throttle when starting off, but apply steady but gentle throttle. In first or reverse, get a feel for the clutch as it starts to engage and apply heavier throttle AFTER it engages. When shifting to higher gears, keep a steady throttle and let the car modulate itself between shifts. And one more thing, in my case I find I prefer to keep the car in SPORT mode in normal traffic as the transmission shifts faster.

Hope my experience is helpful to you.

Steve

 

The ideal situation there, if possible, would be to back down the driveway into the garage just to avoid undue stress.

 

I'm in the same situation.

The first time I tried to back out of the driveway, the car would hardly move and slipped like crazy. Because of the way my garage is, I can't back into my space (to close to the wall to get out of the car).

What I do now is let the car fully warm up (10 minutes or so). Then I check the street and surrounding, pull the car back into the garage, and then hit the throttle with conviction. If you go up the driveway like that, it's very smooth up the driveway.

You can't feather the throttle up the driveway like you do with a 6 speed.

 

The real problem with reverse on the 360 and 575M is that Ferrari made reverse almost as high as 2nd gear. Fixed on the F430 and 599 with a lower reverse gear. So the 360 F1 system has to slip the clutch to get started, much as it would if you made a 2nd gear start. The clutch locks up in reverse once you get going fast enough, just like it does in 1st or any other forward gear. The continuously slipping clutch in reverse thing is an old wive's tale easily disproven by going to a large parking lot, ideally downhill, and reversing. Once up to speed, the clutch will lock up solidly.

So trying to start uphill in reverse is rough on the clutch, almost as bad as doing the same thing would be in 2nd gear.

1st 3.286:1
2nd 2.158:1
Rev 2.562:1

 

All of the above. When you figure it out its great.
Avoid any uphill reversing, any.
Lifting off after initial take off (1 to 2 car lengths) to get the clutch to engage fast is a delicate small lift.

 

Chris- All the immobilizer does is prevent the car from starting if the Alarm ECU has not seen a valid unlock signal from the remote or PIN key strokes. All the Alarm ECU has to do with car running is sending a signal to the Motronic DME that it is cleared to start. Nothing else

For a cheap solution, try putting a can of Techron or other fuel injection cleaner in the gas tank. It cured my rough start problem and I now get smooth starts to high idle and smoother running.

Incidentally, if you keep the car locked and alarm armed all the time, once you hit the remote to unlock the doors and disarm the alarm and immobilizer, you have 120 seconds to start the car before the immobilizer rearms. Plenty of time.

When I go to the gas station, I lock the car when I get out so I will not forget to disarm the immobilizer after refueling. Saves embarrassment.

 

Terry is a heck a guy, eh?


Glad to hear you're back in business!