Is there any Ferrari that can match a Corvette in performance?

The new version's interior is vastly improved.

 

Ok, so only equally as bad as a Vette

 

My friend is a software enigineer, he has driven the C7 Corvette almost every day for the last two years. He has always been a Porsche guy and never understood the attraction to Ferrari.

I let him drive my lowly, underperforming, low-tech 308.







He said "Now I understand".

 

That reminds me of this vid by an Israeli guy when he gets to drive a 308 for the first time. Ever seen it?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FrPupeeDQHk]Ferrari 308GTB My 1st - A Ferrari Tale (English Subtitles) - YouTube[/ame]

 

I have a C6 Z06, 355 and F40 and have driven 360, 430, but not the front engined F Cars or 458. I love them all, for different reasons.

Those who claim Corvettes are junky, plasticky and soul-less just don't get the car, any more than the person who does not want a Ferrari for want of "performance."

The Corvette is relatively inexpensive because the engineering, development and tooling costs are spread over hundreds of thousands of units over a production cycle and because the car is built to a price point. I personally know many of the engineers who developed the Corvette and I can promise you they are at least as passionate as the Ferrari team. John Heinricy is probably a more accomplished racer than any Ferrari employee I know of, and Jim Mera can drive as well. The engineering, development and testing behind the Corvette is simply monumental and I suspect more comprehensive than any Ferrari street car. Also, unlike Ferrari, Corvette races SPORTS cars in the professional ranks and uses at least some production components on those cars. As wonderful as Ferraris' F1 program is, it has precious little relevance to the road cars in my view. The Challenge program is nice and all, but does not pit Ferrari agaisnt other marques.

Anyway, from an objective performance standpoint, I am pretty confident a C6Z06 is both lighter and more powerful than most of the Ferrais that pre-date the 575, and has a better power-to-weight ratio than the 575 and has to be close on the 599. It is not far behind the 458 and is lighter than the 458.

The Z06 has plenty of subjective "passion," if you get it. It's just different. The torque, grip, and basso sound are fantastic. And I don't give a whit over "exclusivity," either. It is a fantastically engineered car that is quite frankly better than the 355 and F40 in just about all objective measures of performance, and is attainable and affordable to boot. On a road course, I bet a Z06 is quicker than any Ferrari other than a 458 or maybe the F12 and of course the Enzo and LaFerrari, although the driver of the "faster" Ferraris better know what he is doing or he will get embarassed.

But it just isn't always about track performance, now is it? You can't go 10/10s on the street, what with curbs, children, traffic, and law enforcement and so on. And 99% of the perfomance car buyers don't really have the skills to get 10/10s of the car's performance, anyway.

Let's face it, a Ferrari is in part a "fashion accessory" with exclusivity and a fine driving experience as part of the package. The 355 is for me the last of the truly sublimely beautiful Ferraris. I personally like hidden headlights, the lines and ducts are somehow more integrated to my eye (although I do like the 458), and little details like the door handle that befuddles the newcomer are fantastic. The interior is both intimate and yet the abundance of glass makes it light and open feeling. The sound of the high revving V-8 and the gated shifter and the smell of leather all add to a je ne sais quoi about the car that can't be measured or quantified, but make it a lovely driving experience. Use the performance envelope of the car hard and you'll find it actually gets with the program surpisingly well and the driver of a Z06 on track might actually end up watching a 355 tailights fade in the distance if he does not have some real skill to take advantage of the Z06's larger performance envelope.

Then comes the F40. It is simply an event. Everything about the car is simple, brutish and demands respect and attention. Heavy, manual brakes and steering require a very firm and deliberate touch. The gearbox is robust, but heavy to shift unless you are assertive and can indeed heel and toe on the downshifts. The power comes in a rush at about 3500-4000 rpm and you had better be ready for it. No ABS, traction control or other driver aids to deliver you from stupidity or a mistake. Road noise seems almost amplified as it comes through the thin carbon/kevlar skin under your behind and the mechanical sounds of valves, injectors (16 of them), turbos, blowoff vlaves and the single, central wastegate are a symphony that explains the lack of a radio. My wife hates this car!

Now the title of your thread is silly and baiting, IMO, but I love the debate. Don't get a Ferrari if you don't get Ferraris. But to all you kool-aid swilling Tifosi who just have to dis' the Vette, well you don't get it, either.

 

What I never got about the Ferrari/Vette thing is how Corvette owners (not all) always seem to question why you'd prefer a Ferrari over a Corvette. The Ferrari owners understand the value and performance of the Vette but the Vette owner sometimes seems confused as to why you'd prefer a Ferrari.

I drove my 308 out to this little seafood place, had it parked way out at the end of the parking lot and as I'm sitting there minding my own some loud idiot sees my car from the next table over and says out loud to the others "who would buy a FERRARI!?" Then started talking about the virtues of Corvettes. The golf buddies he was with just shrugged as to say "whatever" but he kept going on and on and getting louder as he did so. As if he wanted to get the whole restaurant to join in and agree with him or something. A few years ago at the Chicago auto show they had a blue 360 with daytona seats. I was smitten and just sat there quietly staring at it and out of the corner of my eye I see some some camo dressed yuck walk over to me from the other side of the display just to say "hey buddy why don't ya just get ya a Vette and be done with it?" Not like I saw him dressed in camo and went over and said "hey buddy, you get lots a chicks dressing like a tree like that?" Both times it was this intrusion into my personal space to tell me how my like or my preference was "wrong".

Had other cordial owners and still others driving Vettes give me a nod or a thumbs up too.

If you have to ask you'll probably never get it.

 

Well put.

I think you have over the past few moyhs convinced a number of us to try the vette thing. Waiting for the C7 z06, lets see.

 

So if one guy who has owned multiple Ferraris and multiple Corvettes has one opinion of Corvette that differs from your own, having also owned multiple of either, the guy who disagrees with you on some small points doesn't "get it"?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I717 using Tapatalk 2

 

If I may, firstly very jealous, secondly think Alonso and Massa may disagree, and thirdly I think that's the difference right there.

By the way, Ferraris compete against other sports cars all the time in things like the World Endurance Championship. In fact they race directly against the Vettes, they just beat them all the time, so maybe you don't see the Vettes crossing the line Last year Ferrari racked up more than double the points in the Manufacturers' World Cup as Chevvy Corvette. It doesn't take place in the States but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen

And yes, I am taking the mickey.

Seriously though, do you guys not get that televised?

 

I rember well the suzuki GSXR people could never understand why someone rode a ducati monster. Some people jus need validation of their choices by dissing other. Some people in the USA seem to feel insecure about the country so think a Vette is simply the best car and a Harley the best bike. Objectively a vette is in the hunt. A Harley may well be one of the most desirable subjectively but it is objectively far far from the best bike, yet it has an essential appeal and pleasure of riding, just like an older ferrari.

 

Sort of - the fact that you want leather all over the place in a Vette and have an automatic transmission (I think?) tells me you don't get what in my opinion are the virtues of a Corvette. To each their own, of course, and you are in good company as 80+% of Vette buyer buy automatics. Just my opinion, as was everything in my post, of course. No right and wrong, here.

 

Oh and by the way, I do get the Vette. I like them a lot. I just, personally have far more of a connection with Ferraris. I think the Vettes are awesome performance wise but just find something lacking that I find in a Ferrari. Call it soul or passion or whatever - to me it's not really that, it's intagible, but it just means they feel special to me in a way very few other cars do. Absolutely no issue with anyone who prefers a Corvette.

I've always thought cars nicely mirror the countries they're from. German cars are clinical (and good), Britich cars like an Aston, Bentley or Rolls are refined and have a certain style, Japanese cars are fast due to high tech, American cars like a Vette are, let's face it, fast due to being pretty forceful (not meant in a bad way at all, you do kind of have a certain standing on the world stage at the mo), Italian cars have passion, often so much they blow up.

 

Guess I don't "get" the vette thing. The same way I don't "get" driving in a huge Bubba truck with 55 inch wheels. Is is a middle aged salt and pepper hair, slight paunch and mustache thing?

I guess I also don't "get" the 355 as the 355 Wedge/Lotus front end thing is dated...

IMHO regarding "Corvette guys" that question Ferrari, its the same Applebees eating guy of whom opinion I could care less.

 

I love it when people key on the fact that I don't want to drive a stick as evidence I'm not a car guy. Toggie's tried repeatedly to get me to learn a stick again, haven't driven one since college and don't want to. Ironically, he's offered in either his ferrari or his corvette.

Simple exercise; start a thread on corvetteforum titled "Corvette Interiors" asking opinions. While waiting on the overwhelmingly negative response from corvette lovers to pour in, stop by your local ferrari dealer and count the number of cars with full leather as opposed to alcantara/cf/bare metal. Then let's see if I'm about spot on that 95% agree with me that corvette interiors suck and upscale leather interiors are nice and the market bears that out.

One thing you've said I agree with; to each his own.

 

I like the new Vette, in a year and half if my 360 gives me any grief about passing smog again, it might get traded in on the new Vette.

But the very best looking Vette is still the 1973 t-top, I just want something more comfortable as I get older and the new Vette looks good, has the performance, looks comfy and oh yeah has a warranty

What people think about Ferrari's or Vettes dont bother me, I don't drive my car for them, I drive it because it speaks to me. I do agree that driving a Ferrari has a special "something" that I don't get with other cars, even my S2000 is just a plain car to me, it has no "soul" and Vette's don't either.

 

This is another interesting vid, and kind of relevant to the 'debate'. The performance figures when you get to about 7 mins in are interesting, particularly comparing the BHP and Torque figures to how that relates to their actual performance.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhOU9uOtAWI]Tested: Chevrolet Corvette ZR1 vs Ferrari 458 Italia vs McLaren MP4-12C - YouTube[/ame]

 

Well, on the whole market thing, all things being equal I do prefer leather, but I think the market bears out that most people would prefer to save the money and pay for performance first, luxury second as indicated by the relative sales volume of Ferrari vs Corvette. As for those complaining about Corvette interiors, I do wonder how many would actually pay an extra $10K or so for more opulent leather? I am not sure I would.

 

Lots of things you've said make sense, but no, the relative sales figures have nothing to do with leather interiors in Ferraris being too expensive so they sell fewer cars. Ferrari sales numbers are deliberately capped, have been for some years. Particularly with the far east markets increasing they could sell more cars, leather interiors and all. Not sure Chevvy sales are capped in the same way.

 

The Vette aftermarket is so vast, so varied, that if there was a demand for a $10K interior there'd be at least some proof. Either GM is ignoring what it should be studying like mad -- not at all unlikely -- or not enough people are interested in dolling them up with furniture grade leather.

 

Sorry, but it's a slightly daft comparison. Try taking 10k off the price of a normal road going Ferrari and give it a plastic interior - see if it sells over the leather decked out version. Ferraris are top of the market premium marque cars, Chevy Corvettes aren't. Not taking anything away from the Corvette but I may as well be comparing a Ford Cosworth with an Aston Martin from the same era. Similar pace (actually the ford would possibly have it), very different cars. I'd take the Aston though, thanks.

 

I'm kinda like you in this regard.

I was a Corvette owner from 1998 to 2005. I bought two C5s in that time period and the first one was by far the fastest car I had ever driven and got a lot of head turns when I bought it in 1998.

Fast forward to 2005 when I bought my first Ferrari. It was a yellow 348 Spider. It was less refined on the inside, less horsepower by 30 hp and frankly, didnt handle as good as the vette. Dont get me wrong, it was no slouch!

But talk about an EXPERIENCE! This car was FUN to drive. Sounded like a FERRARI! Turned heads everywhere I went.

Trust me, whatever Corvette you parked next to, it was the Ferrari that people wanted to talk about.

 

For any unaware, GM has a factory leather wrap option for the dash and doors. There are several aftermarket vendors for the same and they sell well. Many corvette owners do indeed buy this option. Many, many more like me end up with a car without this option and upgrade later. It's quite common. The leather available factory or aftermarket isn't what I would call opulent, though certainly beats the alternative. People that buy corvettes actually think they're at the high end of the market and would probably find it funny that there are those who think they need to save money with a plastic interior. I made the decision to buy this last vette and pulled the trigger in relatively short time and took advantage of all the incentives by buying from dealer stock. There were three cars in the country I liked, out of about 10,000. None of them had the top package, mine being 3LT and second from top. Pretty much all it's missing is the leather, all I care about anyway. If my car doesn't sell pretty quickly, I'll probably order the leather panels in matching cashmere with red stitching. I'll love the car a LOT more. I really owe it to myself to go there. I love everything else about the car.

 

If you want the Vette experience, by all means do so. My first car love was BMW and at present, I am lucky enough to own the early M Cars and some through the 90s. I don't so much like to 'compare' BMW to Ferrari. They are just different, just like maybe the Vette would be. The Ferrari is an experience, very visceral, the sound, the gearbox shifting, the styling, the power. I haven't driven any other car that comes close. Part of that Ferrari 'experience' is also dodgy AC, things that break and then break again, sometimes questionable build quality, etc. But in the immortal words of Clarkson, 'you know what, I just don't care'. Because when its humming along, its perfect. Even when its parked, its perfect. Does it require some extra patience, sure, but the reward is not (for me) found anywhere else...probably like the Vette is to its fans.

 

I think time was when a vette was a far more pedetrian car. A harley was also a 4k bike, now people like baggers that cost 30k+. These days the person who can shell out 60K+ for a non essential car wants and expects luxury and quality interior bits. That is not just leather, but switches that feel substantive and move ike well oiled bits. Door handles that dont flex and a whole host of other things.

Mercedes makes some great interiors with their MBtex which is an upscale plastic, but everything feels quality and all plastics are soft touch. That is what GM misses, its not afcator of just swathing the interior in leather that feels like slimey plastic. And yes for 5k more they could make a decent interior without leather. The Caddy CTS for one has a halfway devent interior.

What Gm lacks is conviction and execution. But lets not judge till we see the C7, so far though in c6 back they have missed the mark.