Hi I need to do both head gaskets on my cars. MIE has a set and so does Maserati source. Does anyone have any experience of the best ones to use for this. One is as 1981 QPIII manual and the other is the 1986 Auto. Appreciate the advice.
William: The only ones I had past experience with, were the head gaskets from MIE. Worked like a charm! Mike
I've found it difficult to get a straight answer out of Jacques (Maseratisource on eBay), although the parts I've gotten from him have been as described. Picked up a full set of ball joints and tie rods for next to nothing last year. Don't need them now, but will at some point and the price was too low to pass up. Otherwise I generally have found MIE the easiest to deal with. Campana also have a lot of stuff at decent prices, although can be slow at responding to inquiries. I've found that usually Campana or MIE has the best prices on parts, unless you find something you need on Maseratisource sale pages. Hope this helps.
Can I tap the collective wisdom and expertise of the Maserati aficionados regarding the rebuild of my 4.7 AM115 Ghibli engine. This thread has been great but I cant seem to find what Im looking for on the head gasket question I currently have. The bottom end is all assembled up with reground crank, bearings, new pistons etc and the oil pumps and sump have been fitted. I should say at this point that the engine has been in this state for the last 8 years but has been turned regularly and is clean as a whistle. I have just checked the cylinder liner top to deck height and the two are flush. The liners have never been out of the block so am I OK to just fit the heads with new gaskets? I have read that the liners should be 0.003-0.004 proud of the block deck but Im hoping this is for newly fitted liners to allow for them compressing into the block on assembly. Advise from those who have been there, done that on the type 107 engine would be most appreciated. Very best regards Chad PS If the consensus is that the liners need to be proud then Id look at putting Wills rings into the heads instead of stripping the bottom end and pulling the liners out.
I have no experience with Maserati engines but with Alfa Nord engines the liners are supposed to stick proud to allow for the different expansion rates between the steel (?) liners and the alloy block. Pete
Pete You are right, the requirement to have the liners proud is common on many alloy block/cast iron liner engines, Imp, K series etc but if the liners sink into the block on assembly or over time, is there a need to remove the liners and re-shim them every time you remove the heads? Aluminium has a thermal coefficient of expansion approximately twice that of cast iron, so a quick sum indicates that over a temperature range of 150 degC the block will expand 0.25mm or about 10 thou more than the liner. In reality its probably a bit less as the liner will run hotter than the block and the alloy used for casting the block is likely to be more heat stable than aluminium, but all that is academic, what would give me a bit of confidence when I assemble the heads is the experience of someone who has actually been there and done it. I am however slowly coming to the conclusion that to be safe Wills rings may be the way to go. Wills Rings® O - Trelleborg So if anyone has experience of an engine machine shop that can machine and supply Wills rings in the UK Id be most grateful, or indeed anyone who has fitted them to Tipo107 heads.
The QP3 engine manual on Ivan's site <http://thecarnut.com/Manuals/QP3_service_manual_engine.pdf> gives the specification for this. Although the engines aren't identical, the sleeves and pistons are, so the number should be a good guideline.
Thanks GLB this is looking more hopeful. The QP3 engine manual seems to suggest a tolerance between liner height and block of 0.000 to +0.010mm, that's flush to 0.0004" which is what I have. I now wonder if the 0.003-0.004" I had in mind was incorrect or the latest modern procedure?
There are people on this forum with lots of experience with these engines, but unfortunately I'm not one of them! Pete mentioned Alfa engines, but after looking at the QP3 manual, I think they're built differently. Alfas use wet liners with a seal at the bottom. The Maserati V8 uses an open deck design with dry liners, like a modern Honda. The instructions say to use the torque plate ("false head") to push the liners completely to the bottom. It would seem that the 0-0.010mm dimension is more a check on manufacturing tolerance than a setting. I am interested in this at the moment because I'm contemplating at least cleaning and freshening my Bora engine while I have it out. The car ran fine and has only 30k miles, but it ate its water pump and has been sitting awhile, so it might be worth it. Besides, it makes it easier to paint the heads - you know, the important stuff. Larry
I believe you cannot have an open block and dry liners. Anyway I've looked at the PDF and the pictures show what I believe are wet liners and they mention a seal at the bottom of the liners. Anyway if the manual says 0 is okay that is great news. Pete
Just to clarify things guys, the Tipo 107 engine is open deck with wet liners. As I'm going to run the engine in a frame out of the car, and on the strength of the information given in the QP3 engine manual, I'm probably going to fit standard head gaskets with the liners as they are. Painting the heads is a good point Larry and as you say, important stuff. What process/paint do you intend to use? I've seen a good many cars with this engine in and very few have the paint on the heads in tact, seems like a ***** getting it to stick through all the heat cycles and that's without the odd drip of oil and petrol.
Hi, I have successfully used VHT wrinkle paint out of spray cans on my engines. One has it on for some 6 years and 35.000km, still looks like I put it on this morning. Actually I do spray a thin layer of oil on them every once in a while so it stays like new! The trick for the cohesion is to get the aluminium parts absolutely grease and oil free by thorough cleaning. I did it with all the components lose and used an aggressive paint stripper and de-greasers in combination with the hot water pressure cleaner. See picture: I have got the "greenest" spray cabin in town! After that it is a matter of masking the holes and surfaces. To put the spray paint on I heated the head and covers with a hot air gun. Then put 4 cross layers of paint on and dry /heat up between the layers with the hot air gun. This prevents runners. Curing time after this is minimum 2 days. After this start assembling your engine! I even wanted to use the engine as a table stand in the dining room for a while but the parliament objected Takes a bit of time but is worth the effort! Ciao, Bart Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Thanks Bart, most useful. I actually have a couple of cans of this VHT Wrinkle Finish Aerosol (310ml) | Frost Auto Restoration Techniques in the garage, is this the stuff you used and did you mask off the Maserati script or file the paint off once dry? Out of interest, did you measure the liner to block projection before re-fitting the heads, I'd be interested to know what it was if you did. Chad
I've used VHT several times with great results and very long durability. But that was in the late 1980's and early 1990s. I wonder if the formula used now is as durable. Especially if it's sold commercial in a rattle can. Th EPA has been pretty tough on all paint manufacturers. Yes get it squeaky clean. MY heads and cam covers got a very thick coat and somewhat larger wrinkles . But that's because there were terribly ugly casting irregularities to hide. The block and bell housing cleanup very nicely with repeated coatings of Duro Aluminum Jelly Corrosion Remover. I wasn't taking the short block apart at the time.
Hi Chad, Yup, that is the wrinkle paint. Watch out if the cans were exposed to frost in your garage I would throw them away. I scraped the pain off with a scissor after one day and used a block with P400 sandpaper to clean the letters. I just checked my block and liners with a flat strip and they were about level. Hein Brand supplied my head gasket sets and it seems the were able to absorb the slight tolerance. Success, Bart Image Unavailable, Please Login
I CNC manufacture solid copper head gaskets, copper dissipaites heat better than any other material, also they can be reused, and blown head gaskets are a thing of the past. Stock thickness $350.00 a pair. Image Unavailable, Please Login
I'm in Southern California. At the moment i don't have time to make gaskets for other engines. I'm considering making Ghibli stainless rocker panel moldings, i need 5-6 sets for myself, if some else needs them i would consider manufacturing additional sets. I can be reached at 760-363-7448 [email protected]
Was there any European manufacturer that didn't use that York a/c compressor back then? wow, they're everywhere
How long is normal for valve adjustment for a 4,2L. I just received the bill from my workshop and they charged for 10 hours of work. This with the engine already out of the car. It sounds a lot to me, is it reasonable?
Hmmm I just got hit with 11 days work to replace and fix the cracked head on my 1986 QPIII. Bill is more than I originally paid for the car!!!
11 days sounds like a lot of time for that. I the head repair work time consuming? I am replacing my entire engine. Are you interested in one of the heads William?
If they are good (no cracks) and match mine I need them. He used the heads from my dismantled 1981 without telling me! I guess it was needs must but I would have kept the motor all as it came. Not such a big issue if I get the right ones. Send me a PM
No shop has ever surprised me with a lower than anticipated price. It seems that generally things cost about twice what I estimated. If I was satisfied with the quality of the work I could be okay with the price, but a few times I've been disappointed.
