Concours Question

It depends on the event and judge. Technically they are supposed to take points away for any non original item but it was just posted recently that radios seem to get a pass.

 

just go and have fun and laugh at all the nerds that insist on breaking out the q-tips and factory pictures to see at what angle their center caps were when the car left the factory.

 

^LOL I fit that description... on my Porsche's, the crest on the center cap has to be pointed at the tire valve stem.

About the original question, it is likely that points will be deducted, but probably not too many if this is the only aftermarket part.

Tips: Cleanliness will likely be incredibly important, so make sure your wheel wells/calipers/undercarriage are all spotless (I usually put on white gloves and clean until I see no residue on the gloves after rubbing the surface). Make sure your door/bonnet hinges are also spotless... always a very important area in a concours.

Here's a helpful guide to concours prep.... written for Porsche Club of America members, but provides some very useful information... depending on how intense you want to get.

http://zone8.pca.org/Articles/concours101.pdf

Good luck!

 

PCA is very different.

 

You obviously have no experience.

 

If it is a good quality repo and looks pretty much like a factory unit it should get a pass. If asked you don't know nuthin. If they can't tell it shouldn't be a deduct anyway.

Bring your manuals, tools, make sure it is all there. Make sure the original floor mats are in place.

What will really matter is the quality of the judges and if they are following the IAC/PFA guidelines. In local events you get guys who are really not up to speed on how it's done. I have literally seen local event judges take points off for the wrong brand of black rubber valve stem cap. If that is the case just have fun.

If it is judged by knowledgeable people originality is paramount. We're not worried too much about a few rock chips or even a few bugs. The whole idea is the cars should be driven. Taken care of but driven.

 

Just use their judging as a guide for future events. They will tell you what you need to do for next time!

 

I usually bribe the judges and it all works out ok

 

I have had my car at 2 concours events since owning it less than a year ago. I am by no means an experienced show person. The car was awarded Platinum in both events and what I did was remove or exchange what I could to approximate stock. For me that was:

Replace the Horse tire valve caps with black

Swap out the after market floor mats with the OEM originals

Remove the sub woofers that sit on the shelf behind the seats and tuck the wires away

Detail the car.

In reading the link posted above for the Porsche club preparation, in my limited experience with these two events near me, the judging in no way came close to the level of inspection of cleanliness that looks to be the standard as outlined in that pdf. It may be the shows that I attended and the judges assigned but neother event was rigorous by my observation.

I am going to the Cavalino this year (no car) and will be interested to see if the judging is more detailed than what I have experienced. I would be interested in knowing others experiences at various concours as well.

Good luck and have fun.

 

I've only participated in one FCA concours. Took Platinum / 99 points. They deducted a point for Ferrari-brand chrome valve stem caps (plain, no cavallino). The judges said mine was the only 355 they had seen that still had the seat belt tags (Allied Signal?).

 

Mine does not have tags but TRW is silkscreened on them IIRC

 

Funny you should mention the seat belt tag. At my first concours a knowledgeable attendee came over and was talking to me about my car and on telling him it was my first concours he asked if I minded him pointing some things out. He wasn't a judge but someone who had been involved in these before.

He mentioned a couple things, the tire valve caps , and told me to tone down the shine on my tires (haha) and he noticed the seat belt tags and said you have the original tags. That's great. I had no idea what he was talking about but here is a pic of the seat belt tags I have.
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You guys with Spiders must have different belts, zoom in and you can see the TRW on mine
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Wrong photo
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I certainly have a lot of respect for those that prep to platinum level..its very hard to achieve with a car that is driven. My car has aftermarket exhaust and I am pretty sure there are enough points deducted for that so as to make it very tough to get a platinum. So that's my excuse! I love the Cavallino event and have attended many times, usually just entering a car for "display only".

 

First year I took my car I got a Platinum.
this year I took my car I got a Gold.

No OEM floor mats and aftermarket exhaust.

I got caught with the valve caps on the year I got the Platinum.

I think it depends on the judges honestly. While I'm obviously biased, I feel my car was as good if not better than some of the Platinum winners at the event I attended.

I'm probably going to the FCA event at Landsdowne in 2014 and I think I'm putting a sign on my car saying Look but don't judge.

Gonna detail her but leaving the 360 wheels on it.

I'll admire the true Platinum winners!

 

The entire effort in recent years and many of the changes is to try and create an environment that allows use and showing. No one wants it to be dominated by trailered hanger queens. We want to reward people who are driving and keeping the car up and representative of what Maranello built. Local events still often get judges who are unaware or only partially aware of that.

Also take into consideration anything that is judged by humans. When is any football game or any Olympic event have total agreement of the judging pool?
It will never happen.

Muffler only is either 1/2 or one point max. Much discussion on exhausts. Last year at Cavillino I petitioned IAC/PFA for an exemption for aftermarket manifolds for 355 but it has so far been turned down. A couple of us are still trying for that. I am also trying to get an exemption for non standard F1 pumps.

Very hard to budge the vintage 12 cyl power structure. I do have a couple on my side but it is an uphill battle.

 

Ha they will have no choice in 10 years when all our f1 pumps are not original. Well I guess they will just deduct everyone.

 

While I'm not a fan of massive modifications, I'm not a purist either. My car is fairly stock with the exception of Yoshi Shields, chrome valve caps, custom exhaust, Alpine stereo (no amp) and soon to be yellow calipers.

In summary, I'd rather enjoy my car than win awards. I do have a second place award from the only event I've attended and while that's pretty cool, it's much cooler having the smile on my face every time I take a ride.

 

Hi Brian and thanks for chiming in on this thread. Always good to have someone like yourself who has been around all this stuff contribute.


I had to do my headers a few months ago and part if my decision process was based on maintaining originality to your point regarding manifolds. No real idea if I made the perfect decision but I went with new OEM. Maintaining original design parts was a significant consideration for me

In looking at the older Ferraris and the judging standards for them, there doesn't seem to be much debate as to original vs aftermarket. If it is not original it is deducted.

The 355 is almost 20 years old ( as I have been so keenly educated) and maybe approaching that classic designation in another 20 years. In my opinion, having those OEM parts so close to the beast will in the end be the right choice.

Concours judging serves a valuable purpose in keeping a standard of originality alive. There are tons of aftermarket alternatives but your car left Maranello only one way and for concours judging purposes alone, maintaining that standard is in the end the right thing to do

 

My F355 is certainly not a garage queen and has won 1st place in class 2 years in a row at Bella Italia and 4 second places in class at 2 Concours events two years in a row. She didn't make the cut this year. Guess her winning steak is over for now. It is pretty much stock. I recently pulled the subwoofer from behind the seats and removed the head unit and amp. Only visible mods are tubi exhaust, shields and radar detector remote display where the head unit was. Hope she does well at the desert concours, but if not, no biggie. it will be great to see the awesome cars.

 

Thanks Brian, if I go to a show this year, I will do my best to detail her and actually enter the car. It makes sense to get a judging form even for no other reason to know what to fix for next time.

Keep after those judges, I understand the old guard's commitment to originality, but perhaps there needs to be a "driver" class that celebrates the cars that are used, without diluting the appreciation of the trailer queen "virgins". I agree that these are two different disciplines.