Will our 550's/575's Ever be Collectors?

Very entertaining debate, gents!

I think Papou is spot on - in the not too distant future we will be producing our spares ourselves...

Spot on also. I'm a very happy owner of a 456M GT, which in my view, is one of the most beautiful F designs and has all the nostalgic stuff I need - gated, tape-deck (1998 model) in which I'm playing my 1990s tapes...and I love it. I'm now getting my CD changer re-built. Spent the last year tracking down original Blaupunkt radios for my 1970s Alfa and my 1980s 911 - nostalgia pur. I'm sure in the future I and others will be hunting for original period-correct iPods to connect in our (then vintage) cars.

Would I buy an F12 if I could afford one? Immediately (keeping the 456). I think the F12 design (and technology) is as fantastic and personal. In fact, the technological aspect has always contributed to the aura of Ferraris, or perhaps the fascination of Ferraris. Indeed, it's all perspective. Watch Jeremy Clarkson test-driving a 456 in a 1990s edition of Top Gear - at the time the 456 technology was mind-blowing - it's been like this with every Ferrari.

I think the numbers issue is generally inflated. All Ferraris are low-production number cars (even in comparison to other classics like Etypes, 911s etc). Granted, the ultra rare cars like 275NART etc command the massive premium because of their rarity, but otherwise I'd claim that within the Ferrari world, the production numbers are not necessarily a big factor in the overall value package.

Two (cheap?) points:

First, the production number of F40s is around 1300; the combined production numbers of BB512 and BB512i are around 2000......the production number of my 456M GT is around 640.

Second: THe "higher" production number cars like the 550/75 may eventually be less available due to the fact that many will have been driven into the ground, so the cars on the market may well be a fraction of those originally produced. Will that effect value? Probably.

Point is, there are many other (more important) factors than production numbers that determine a Ferrari's value. One such factor is design, and while we're now back to "it's all perspective", I think design-wise, the 1990s cars (456/550/575) beat the 2000s (612/599) by miles. But the story might be different with the F12 again

 

Check out prices on 63-67 Corvettes, really good looking, of which 117,964 were built over five years. For the 550 and 575M, also really good looking, there were 3083 + 2064 (5147) built over 10 years. The oldest C2 Corvettes are 51 years old, so give the Maranellos a bit of time for everybody else to recognize their value. We owners already know.

 

The Skunkworks editions will appreciate, the rest......maybe......I dunno....hopefully yes

 

I agree that tasteful mods will enhance value. Barchetta wheels on coupes, gold kits, sunvisor mods, switchable steering ecu's, fuel system enhancements etc... These cars will also benefit from new technologies with 3d printers and user derived cnc parts if Ferrari leaves us high and dry.

 

With a certain number of Skunkwork modifications, to be determined by you Dave, a cloisonné badge should be provided.

 

Dave- At least I have the sunvisor fix.

 

Terry (Taz) nailed it with a "rear-view" look at C-2 Corvettes. Even with 117,xxx models made over 5-years, they "all" (1963-1967 C-2 Corvettes) are collectible cars.

Even more so, rare option cars with proven provenance are the first to find new owners - and at 75-150K, this equates to roughly 20-25 times price paid by the original owners.

Think for a minute - we own significantly fewer (and I mean significantly fewer 550/575M's) than the C-2 Corvette.

With that known, consider "prime" 550/575M cars that may exist later on ... time capsule cars / known cars that include low mileage / 1-or-2 owner cars / desirable optioned cars / FHP/HGTC packages / 6-speed manual.

Need I say more . . . ?

550/575M collectible? For sure - especially with items noted above.

All things considered, expect late cars, 575M's,to lead the pack in collector interest. Remember, the 575M is "high water" mark for the nine-year run. Even now, and in this forum, one can sense see a preference for the 575M model.

All is speculation of course - the car is not yet 10 years from the last units being produced.

That said, I present one opinion that believes the 550/575M will be indeed be collectible in the future.

 

Raising values will come down to supply and demand.

The minute the supply runs out, the prices will get higher as will demand.

 

There's an idea
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For the 575 I honestly fear the F1 gearbox and what that will do. One thing that keeps C2 values high is that they still make a street presence. People drive them! The 550 will be the same way. Technology has already abandon the F1 for DCT and Simple slushbox autos are nipping at the heels of DCT's and perform at the level of early F1's. Will slushbox tech evolve so well that DCT is just a waste of time in a streetcar? We can darn near near make any part for a 550. A clever guy like cribbJ can think and design around Maranello, and willing to lead the way for the rest of us. But who has shown any expertise in manipulating an F1 gearbox in the aftermarket? Will DCT and it's successor become so commonplace and free information disseminated that we lay people will be able to bridge the knowledge gap like we did from carbs to fuel injection? Or will these rare obscure systems remain obscure and unfixable because of knowledge lack, destroying value of cars with those obscure systems?

 

When it comes to electronic systems, especially early more simple electronic systems, I believe that they will be easier to fix as time goes on

 

FBB- The F1 system is just not that complicated. We already have hydraulic companies providing superior to OEM hoses at a fraction of the cost and others are overhauling and resealing the actuators. There are upgrade pump motors out there, and some of the relays are COTS Tycos. We already know how to duplicate the programming in the F1 ECU/TCU and Eric actually has a copy of a 575M HGTC TCU I sent him and I also have the file. Fairly simple EEPROM. Can be easily loaded into several Ferrari and Maserati Magnetti-Marrelli ECUs. Same clutch, flywheel, and transaxle as the 3 pedal 575M and similar to the 550 transaxle except with beefed up componentry found in the Enzo, 612, and even the 599.

So I just do not see much of a problem for F1 in the future, especially if the system is well maintained.

 

This is very interesting. I must admit to being scared to death of getting an early F1 car because of a couple of horror stories, one local to me (A 360 that needed the dreaded $12K actuator). I actually found a 360 that was exactly as I would have ordered it from the factory - yellow, shields, yellow calipers, and nero Daytona interior - but I passed because it wasn't a stick. Perhaps I should rethink this?

As to the OP's question, the Barchetta and Super America are givens to become collectable, but I really don't see how the three pedal 575M's won't become collectable as well. They have a very good mix of analog and digital features, and should be good for well over 100K miles if kept up with. Plus, they are relatively rare.

Cheers,

George

 

This is welcome news! I have read about others swapping F1 pumps without much success in other models and being held hostage by the SD2. Results seem kluggy at this time. I am sure they will improve. No one I know has used the consumer marconi at a reported $5k price target. So far the F1 is the only part of the car that seems to absolutely need the SD-like machine. Perhaps as these system evolve they will appear simple as fuel injection does today. Then there are no worries.

 

OK, what's the Sunvisor Fix ?

 

John- Passenger visor internal plastic pieces break and the visor flops down. Dave of the Skunkworks has a permanent solution not using plastic pieces.

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/456-550-575/285072-sunvisor-fix.html

 

And it works like a champ! Highly recommended if you have sunvisor ED.

 

Yes..they will become collector cars. Once more people realize what gems these cars are, the demand will increase dramatically. 550/575 six speed cars are amazing cars to drive in anger.

 

Interesting topic. I have been considering a 550/575 but want a proper gated shifter. I want the last of the gated V12 Ferraris partially because I too worry about the longevity and service of the F1 Tranny.

 

The last three pedal Ferraris were the 599 and a handful of Californias. None of the Californias made it to the States, IIRC. The last model that was all three pedals was the 550.

 

...and the 456MGT if you consider it independently of the GTA

 

I forgot about the 599. Good point! I remember seeing a 599 with a manual gearbox at the Houston dealership. It was Maroon colored(Rosso ??). Sat there for a long time and I kept thinking that car was a hidden gem. I just wasn't able to afford it at that time. Missed a golden opportunity.

 

Chris- Since the 456M was available with automatic or 6 speed and they were both covered by one owners manual, I do not think of it that way. Just like the 575M F1 and 575M three pedals were considered separate models, but again I do not think of it that way. 550s were all sticks and the last V8 all stick was the 348.

 

Taz, point taken. Rephrase: the 456M is the last 2+2 not available with F1....

 

Chris- It was also the last 2+2 available with an automatic transmission with a torque converter.