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Exhaust headers, To wrap or not to wrap? That is the question

Discussion in '308/328' started by Corsa308, Feb 15, 2014.

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  1. StephenCushing

    StephenCushing Karting

    May 23, 2012
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    Norway
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    Stephen Cushing
    #26 StephenCushing, Feb 20, 2014
    I’ve been wanting to wrap my headers for a while now, but looking under the car tonight I wonder how easy it is the get out the forward exhaust ? Any tips ?
     
  2. Jonny Law

    Jonny Law F1 Rookie
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    #27 Jonny Law, Feb 20, 2014
    The easy way is to pull both fuel tanks, then you can pull the exhaust off. Only way to get full access to either side.

    Take advantage of the moment to replace hoses, respray the fuel tanks and add ground wire when you re-install them.
     
  3. Sunracer

    Sunracer Formula Junior

    May 18, 2005
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    Pierre Beniston
    #28 Sunracer, Feb 20, 2014
    I wrapped a header once, and as the devil's advocate above mentioned, the retained head led to the headers disintegrating fairly quickly. Coated the replacement never had a problem.
     
  4. Rich S

    Rich S Formula Junior

    Nov 30, 2013
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    #29 Rich S, Feb 20, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2014
    If you don't already have one not a bad idea to investing in an infrared-sensing "thermometer" gun; that way you can read off the temperatures without reaching in & getting burnt in the process. More accurate too. Not particularly expensive. Good way to see if all cylinders are operating at the same temperature, as well. I wonder how increased temperatures will affect the catalytic converters, if you have them on your car.

    Cheers, Rich
     
  5. Corsa308

    Corsa308 Formula Junior

    Apr 22, 2007
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    Steve D
    #30 Corsa308, Feb 21, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I guess only time will tell. I know the wrap won't last forever and will start to get shabby and the ceramic will last longer. From my view I was just after what I reckon is the better insulator and not necessarily after aesthetics.
    Not sure about "they will get hotter" or "extreme heat changes" though. They in theory shouldn't be able to get hotter as such but yes they won't be cooling down as much just staying more constant. More of a constant temp should even work out better for cracking or fatiguing. Keeping in mind both products lay the claim to keep the heat in to offer better exhaust scavenging. So if they both offer great insulative properties then both alternatives will have the headers at a similar temp. The most extreme heat change is probably at start up.
    Not sure if the "keeps moisture against the pipes" theory sounds that believable unless you have been out in completely driving rain that has saturated the pipes, the engine is off and then you leave it. Of course most of the headers these days are stainless anyway.
    As I say time will tell.
    See attached of the final job and that of the end pipes. And yes that's the only mufflers I have on my car!

    Steve



     
  6. sltillim

    sltillim Formula 3
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    Nov 22, 2009
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    #31 sltillim, Feb 21, 2014
    Supertrapps? If so, please share your experience, tuning (discs), performance, sound levels, etc.. Any recording would be cool too. I think a couple guys run them on here.
     
  7. singletrack

    singletrack F1 Veteran

    Mar 16, 2011
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    #32 singletrack, Feb 22, 2014
    Those came out excellent! Great job. Goes well with the engine changes to black. Looks purposeful.
     
  8. Corsa308

    Corsa308 Formula Junior

    Apr 22, 2007
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    #33 Corsa308, Feb 22, 2014
    Yeah the cam covers have always been black but they were a bit tired so I stripped them back and painted them again with the black wrinkle.
    It worked out well.
    The black is a bit different so I thought leave it black rather than the red.

    Steve

     
  9. Corsa308

    Corsa308 Formula Junior

    Apr 22, 2007
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    Steve D
    #34 Corsa308, Feb 22, 2014
    Supertrapps indeed they are.
    I really like the theory of the technology behind them.
    See here if anyone is interested. Read the first couple of FAQ's that explain the rationale behind it all. SuperTrapp: Performance Exhaust

    In essence I haven't done much tuning with them but probably will over the next couple of months. Although that said the engine has just been dyno'd with them on.
    I reckon though if I go to a particular track near Sydney that is higher in altitude I would use the tuning capability of the Supertrapp to compensate for the altitude change.
    I have a LM-2 air/fuel ratio meter and plugs in both of those end pipes before the Supertrapps for measurement. You can see the plugs in those photos.

    Steve

     
  10. Corsa308

    Corsa308 Formula Junior

    Apr 22, 2007
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    #35 Corsa308, Feb 22, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Here's a pic of the full cam cover.
    I polished up the line and the Ferrari word with polish on a Dremel polishing pad.
    Love the Dremel!
    Then after each spray of the wrinkle I would wipe off the paint from the polished bits.
    Its pretty tedious and exacting and sometimes you stuff up but the end result is pretty good.
    The process is many coats with about 15mins in between.
    Steve
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  11. Jonny Law

    Jonny Law F1 Rookie
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    #36 Jonny Law, Mar 2, 2014
    Here is some thermal videos with the ceramic coat on the exhaust.

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ply78CK3FAw]Ferrari 308 GTBi - Thermal Video - Engine Compartment 1 - YouTube[/ame]

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ply78CK3FAw]Ferrari 308 GTBi - Thermal Video - Engine Compartment 1 - YouTube[/ame]
     
  12. Sean F.

    Sean F. F1 Rookie

    Feb 4, 2003
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    #37 Sean F., Mar 2, 2014
    Wrapping the headers puts the heat into the metal. Guys used to do that when I raced FF cars and after a few seasons they had no headers left b/c the heat destroyed the metal.

    Guys with ceramic coated exhaust systems did not have those issues.
     
  13. George Vosburgh

    George Vosburgh F1 Rookie
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    #38 George Vosburgh, Mar 2, 2014
    I do not believe these wraps are the way to go on a street machine.
     
  14. Sean308

    Sean308 Formula Junior

    Jan 12, 2011
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    #39 Sean308, Mar 3, 2014
    I had the rear headers ceramic coated but have not gotaround to doing the front ones, at some stage I will try and take a reading with an infrared device on the difference between them both.
     
  15. singletrack

    singletrack F1 Veteran

    Mar 16, 2011
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    #40 singletrack, Mar 3, 2014
    Just to clarify - one must coat outside and inside in ceramic. If you just coat the outside only, then it is basically the same issue as the wrap. That is what you are saying?

    I think he will get a lot of years out of these before they degrade. Race cars are being run at max EGT their entire life more or less.
     
  16. sltillim

    sltillim Formula 3
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    #41 sltillim, Mar 4, 2014
    Ceramic coating is different than wrapping. Ceramic coating will not create the same issues as wrapping at all. In my research of looking at ceramic coatings the application to existing systems can spray in the ends of open tubes but they do not dip them - from what I read....
     
  17. TedM

    TedM Karting

    Oct 30, 2010
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    Arlington, MA
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    Ted
    #42 TedM, Mar 5, 2014
    I did a port/polish/ceramic coat on the entire exhaust system of my WRX. The effect is probably a bit exaggerated because I had a top-mount intercooler (so extremely sensitive to engine bay heat) and turbos benefit even more from high exhaust gas velocity, but I gained dozens of HP on the dyno.

    I initially had the headers done (both porting and coating) and I did my own coating on the heat shields using a simple paint sprayer (media blasted and then used this stuff: Tech Line Coatings | Automotive ( Hi-Performance ) Coatings). I did this while doing a whole bunch of stuff -- bigger turbo/injectors/etc -- and had it tuned/dynoed, but the limiting factor was intercooler getting heat-soaked.

    A couple years later I move to AZ, so I did everything I could to tame engine heat -- upgraded radiator/thermostat/yaddayadda -- including ceramic coating the turbo, turbo heat shield, and exhaust. Net gain was ~60-75 hp, IIRC. Grain of salt: it was a different tuner, different dyno, BUT it was also lower octane gas. (I haven't measured the ambient temp in the engine bay, but my exhaust gas temps seemed to rise a bit, but it's hard to tell since EGT is always in flux.)

    So call me a believer in ceramic coating.... I'll do it in a heart beat next time I've got the 328's engine apart.

    For a while, I actually had the headers wrapped on top of the ceramic coating, but the wrap got incredibly manky and started to disintegrate (daily-driver car in New England... go figure).
     
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