Fixing the Mondial sunroof for less than $150...

If you have a stuck sunroof and hear a clicking sound wen you operate the control switch then this is the post for you. What's better is that you can fix it with parts from a Porsche 944 of the same era. Funny that! and these parts not only are plentiful but also cheap, eg. less than $150 for the cable and motor on ebay. I will not post links for fear of another ban, but you will need to buy a sunroof motor and a sunroof cable (about 6 ft long).

Ferrari charges a gazillion for the Mondial sunroof cable - what a joke!

Before buying anything test the switch, and wiring harness to see that power is actually delivered to the motor with the key in the start position (steps 1,3 and 4 below).

So to take the roof apart you need to do the following:

1) open the boot and pull back the lining on the left corner (you will need to take the internal light cluster liner off first - pic 1). When you do that you will expose the motor and guide tube (brass or copper).

2) the tube has an end cap that is basically a plumbing bolt with an olive inside it. You need to remove the end cap. This will allow the cable to come out, moving the mechanism over a hold point releasing the roof assembly (see later).

3) if the motor turns, you will probably have a stripped cable (pic 8), complicating things (jump to step 6). If the motor doesn't turn, make sure the electric cable did not disconnect itself. If it is plugged in, stick a volt meter on it and have someone push the control button, you may have a wiring problem and not a mechanical one....

4) after all the electrics test OK (12V when pushing button forward, -12V when backward) when tested at the motor plug and the motor still doesn't turn, then you probably have a seized/blocked motor - this is the easiest thing to fix, after the following test:
a) remove the little black cone shaped cap on the motor hub to expose a bolt (pic 13). Put a sprocket wrench on it and start turning it counterclockwise. This should start moving the sunroof. If it does then stop and go to the next step. If it turns, but does not move the roof, then go to step 6.

5) if the roof moves then you need to remove the motor bracket and replace the motor itself. The bracket has three fastening bolts, two visible against the boot firewall and one which is directly above the motor assembly and in fact holds the black rubber trim that lines the rear edge of the roof and buttresses in place. If you remove all three of them, you may also have some that hold the brass cable drive in place which need to be removed. With that done, then you need to find the second bolt mating the motor assembly to the cable tube going to the roof. It is just next to the upper surface of the bracket holding the motor assembly. Loosen the bolt further forward completely. Then as you turn the exposed motor hub bolt clockwise with a sprocket, you can start moving the whole assembly backwards and outwards, until the whole cable has passed the motor sprocket and comes free. See the picture below for the assembly. You can then unbolt the motor (part no. on motor on pic 9) and swap it out with a known good one or have yours refurbished (I used one from a Porsche 944 costing me $60 off ebay). For the sake of thoroughness, hook it up to the wiring harness and test it, then reverse the above instructions and you'll have wind in your hair...

6) you're here because the motor works and you still have no movement. So we know it is a mechanical problem and not electric. Do the disassembly listed in 5 above. Then with the exposed cable, inspect it about a foot from the end and I think you will see it damaged/stripped (Pic 8). If this is the case, you will need to disassemble the whole roof assembly and replace the cable, and PROBABLY the motor as the little drive cog will have been damaged too (pic 14). Leave the sunroof as is if you want to use the car while you wait for your spare to arrive. I bought min on ebay for $50. I'm sure you can get one from any Porsche spares store, though at a premium. You will need the sunroof drive cable for a 944 (part no. is the yellow label on Pic 9, part number of motor on Pic 15).

7) get a pair of pliers (and this is the hard work) start pulling at that cable bit by bit. If you need to have someone "slap" (put some chamois on the rear edges of the sunroof and a piece of pine wood the size of your hand on top of it, then slap is with an open hand) the roof while you pull. This will help unseize it. Keep puling the cable until the sunroof is fully retracted (you will need help in pushing it as you pull the cable, but don't put too much pressure when pushing the roof). When it has fully retracted (about 2" of the lip are still visible), you will then be able to pull the sunroof forward manually. If you can't then you need to keep pulling the cable.

8) at this point you will need to remove the wind deflector assembly (2 screws holding the rudimantary spring arms and wiggle it out of the guide links. Then look at the rails inside the roof cut out. They each have a screw at the front end. Remove them and take the rails out (pic 2). Be careful not to scratch the paint whle doing this.

9) get someone to help you - move the roof forward until you mate the roof sliders with the cut outs of the rails (pic 3), then lift just enough to slide the front of the roof out of the rail. Keep pulling it gently and then repeat for the rear sliders. Beware of the trailing unit which also needs its sliders freed through the same gap. The roof should now be completely out.

10) check the condition of the sliders (made of nylon Pics 4&5) and the lifting springs and arms. Clean them and grease them. Also clean the rails inside the roof. At this point, you can start pushing the cable back in from the boot (I would apply a good bit of grease on it as you do that to then grease the tube. Before the end gets pushed through, wind some rope so it can be pulled through the tube when you pull the cable out). As you do this, a slider will start to move up an arm inside the roof lining. Loosen the bolt that holds the mechanism in place (close to the middle of the whole thing) and take the mechanism out, except for said arm. Keep pushing the cable and eventually you should be able to pull it from the slider on the inside. I threaded some rope at the end of the cable so when the cable came out I could use that rope to clean the tube (wrap it with some tissue soaked in solvent, then the same with some covered in grease).

11) clean and grease all the rails inside the roof, and the guide tube. Clean and grease the whole mechanism etc. If there is rust in the roof cut-out area, treat it, repaint etc.

12) if the cable is stripped, you will need to replace it. Cut the cable a few inches before the slider that drove the sunroof mechanism. with a hack saw you can then cut the bit of cable remaining. Best place to cut it is at each edge of the cut out on the little slider. The slider is made of aluminum, so is very brittle and they are unobtanium.

13) on your spare cable cut off the one end that has a crimped bolt on it. Unwind a bit of the spiral around the core (really difficult) so that you have enough core exposed so it can be threaded through the slider. Get a small brass tube that fits the slot and use this as a crimp to hold the wire in place. This is a key part. Make sure that the crimp does not stick out past the guides you threaded the wire throug as these need to slide insde the aluminum arm (pic 11).

14) clean the rail in the aluminum arm and thread the drive wire (use moly grease on it before you start this part) in it so it is flush with the back end. put the arm back in ensuring the back end is lined up with the end of the tube at the back of the roof, and the bolt at the front is aligned. Push the cable assembly until the cable sticks out at the boot end of the guide tube and then pull it from there until the slider is close to the end of the arm in the roof assembly.

15) Reassembe the roof mechanism and tghten the bolt. Re-insert the sunroof doing the reverse of the above instructions and push it all the way back, then reinsert the rail liners and the screws holding them in place. Wait for the wind deflector.

16) Reverse the steps in number 5 above until you have refitted the motor and holding bracket. Then use the control button to move the roof all the way to the back stop. Push the roof back manually until it is all the way back, then press the forward button until the roof engages and moves forward 4/5ths of the way. Then fit the end cap to the guide tube in the boot. This will now prevent the cable from popping out at the back and therefore will prevent the disengagement of the roof from the mechanism, holding it in place.

17) move the roof all the way to the back, and then refit the wind deflector. Apply a tiny bit of grease to the top of the metal brakets holding it in place (I removed mine altogether, because it is a crap design and quite frankly useless) to help the roof movement.

18) you're done... (I hope) - I have a sunroof which wors like the day it left the factory AND does so from 0 to 155 mph!

Below are a bunch of pictures. Note the part nuber for the bosch motor, used in the Porsche 944 and many others. Costs relative peanuts compared to the Ferrari boxed part. Note the cable, how I broke the little aluminum slider and had to adapt a fix. Note how the nylon holder on the porsche assebly is the same one used on the Ferrari (Ferrari no longer makes them) and how the cable lengths are the same. All the parts came jut under $150... and would be over $2500 from Ferrari!

 

OMG,

Pure genius..


Grazzi,
Edwardo

 

Why would you be banned?

 

Marco
Thank you for that thread - it may come in handy one day.
One point I'd be interested to know: how is the headliner fixed onto the sunroof?
Mine is quite loose with the roof closed, then tensions nicely when it opens.
Urs

 

The liner is a pain. It is attached to the front of the sunroof with a bracket. The rear of it should be kept tight by a webbing material (looks like ladie's stockings which loose their stretch, hence the sagging.

Have a look at some of my other posts on the interior rebuild I did... http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?p=139544610#post139544610

I took the whole roof lining off and replaced the German trouser look with a nice black leather vinyl. You can cut a piece to fit the inside of the sunroof, and it look a million times better than the sagging piece...

The list of all the posts related to the work I put into my Mondi t is here...
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/search.php?searchid=3867878



Marco
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For trying to peddle these... Some mod in Switzerland got a little excited.

This was a project in plastic molding and I thought I could recoup my costs AND provide some cool replacement for the otherwise rather boring original keys in the mondial t/348/355/512M/Testarossa era. Probably for the 308/328, but have not tried them.

So peddling we don't and I'm keeping them all for myself, I have one for each day of the week ;-)
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awesome

 

Tahnks for the info Marco!

 

Thanks Marco
Great thread
I am planning to repair mine next winter

Frank

 

Can the motor be adjusted at all? My sun roof works OK (the cables have been replaced recently and it's all been greased etc) but it sticks at the point where it has to lower the deflector at the front.
When this happens you can hear the motor still running. To be honest there's not much torque on the motor, you can stop the roof easily with light hand pressure.

I assume there is some sort of clutch in the motor unit. Can this be adjusted/modified to give a bit more torque before it starts slipping?

 

Hi Guys,

I am looking for the two sunroof guide, left and right, and for the two screws. I have sent a lot of email to a lot of distributor, but all said that the parts are discontinued and hard to find. Do you have some advice? There is some other cars that have the same guide? Or do you have the exact size of the guides so that I can try to reproduce it?
On the schematic the parts number are:

60964700: right front guide
60964600: left front guide
60911900: screws x 2

Thank you for your help

Fabrice

 

Question

Does anyone know of a source for the sunroof switch?

Mine works, but one of the little tabs at the end is broken so the switch sort of hangs down now.

Thanks

ceb39

 

Does anyone know the part number for the 944 cable or a website I can order from ?


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Call Roger at 928sRUS and explain in as good a detail what you need from this thread, and I'll bet you even money he'll have it in your hand in 3 days.

817-430-2688

He does a lot of work with the Porsche 928, 968, 944, 924 and has serious resources avail.

 

Ok great, might take a bit longer then 3 days to get to Germany but thanks a million for the lead


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