I play, too, but not jazz and certainly not at George's level. Just early Shadows and Ventures. Too early for the average 308 owner to relate to!
Good point but its dependent on perception of quality and demand. The Lamborghini Jalpa, and Urraco were made is super low numbers. And only a few sadist value them, as the market certainly does not. Very early Lotus Esprit's are starting to go up, and they were made in very small numbers as well. Perhaps the 308's will go up. But I want to drive my cars and don't want to worry about every little thing. There are lots of nice cars, guns and guitars out there in that $25-$45k range. I don't see 308's as worth it as they were more fun when they were cheap and the wine and cheese crowd thumbed their noses at them.
70's wedge versus 60's curves ... no contest. I really like the 308 GT4 and respect the GTB but the wedge shape IMO will never age as well as proper curves. All the real classics come from the 60's or earlier. Pete
I love the classics too but how about F40, 288 GTO (very similar) or other marques, Mclaren F1 etc. There are lots of +$1m cars in the current market with sharp angles.
Yes I understand what you are saying ... Well let's remember that the 206 was Ferraris first mid-engined road car. I'm ignoring the 250 LM which was not really a road car. Anyway the first of a series always becomes the greater classic. The 308 was just a revised Dino and designed/made in the FIAT period. The F40 is awesome because it looks like a race car and it's performance, etc. Heck I don't know but the 206/246 is definitely higher up my list than a 308 GTB/S, in fact so is the GT4, because what Bertone designed there is far more impressive than Pininfarina's effort because he made an awesome looking 2+2 on the same chassis ... considerably harder and I think it will age better. In fact I reckon in 25 years time the GT4 will command higher prices than a GTS. Rarer and as time goes buy is slowly becoming more interesting looking ... even though it really is a wedge. Is the only better looking production wedge arguably the original Countach? Pete
I completely disagree. It's amazing we're even talking about the same cars. Funny (and confusing) how we see things so differently. Oh well.
You sir are a man of fine judgement and rare discernment. The original 308 GTB is an authentically beautiful car. The 246 is an iconic car. The GT/4 looks particularly good in blue.
You chose the stand-out "post-historic'' cars, Mark. l love those , too. Plus the early Countach and the Stratos. But they are the rare collectibles post 1973. Andy
I guess the fact that I have seen so many 308GTB/GTS's could be one of the reasons. To me they are relatively common. I've seen a few 246's too, even raced against one and lost ... and I've raced against 308's and beaten a few. I don't know. A very personal thing I guess. Pete ps: I do idolise Vittorio Jano so the connection via the 246 would be cool. When I look at a 308 engine I see two FIAT 124 engines connected in a V ... not that there is anything wrong with that.
I'm not so sure of that. Taste is both cyclical and evolutionary. I was around in the 60's, and there was what I call, "curve overload." After twenty-plus years of curves, folks were ready for something else. Combine that with the post-war era known as, "the 60's," and things were ripe for a radical change. Along came the wedge. I loved it. The original Countach blew me away (And who can forget the Lancia Stratos concept car?), though I grew to hate it with the body-cladded later versions. By the time I got my driver's license - December of '73 - I was excited about the X1/9's debut. I ended up getting a '74 X1/9 when I was a senior (Had a '69 VW as my first ride), and I still think it is an awesomely beautiful little car (The first year - '74 in the US - with the small bumpers being best, IMO). Then, after the wedge was <i>passé</i> curves started to come back, but in an entirely new way (I think the 456 exemplifies that very well). So, I could easily envision a curvy wedge coming back (They're already sort of here since the McLaren F1, IMO), and for classic wedgies - LOL! - to become desirable. But I'm no Nostradamus. Cheers, George
We're the same, George. The first edition of the Countach blew me away, too (I love the rear wheel cut-out), and think the fender flares and additions of the later models spoiled the lines. Strangely, one of my younger friends prefers the later versions. A question of age I think. The 246 did evolve somewhat indirectly into a wedge - Image Unavailable, Please Login
Well, I'm not so sure. First, I quoted Dale when he said something like curves beat straight lines in regards to the 275 GTB vs. the Daytona. OK, fine. But also let's be clear, the 308/Boxer/288 GTO "wedges" that came from Pininfarina are not like the wedges that came from Bertone (Countach, 308 GT4). They are more like Coke bottles than wedges. And to that point, I don't know of anyone who doesn't think the 288 GTO is one of the best looking Ferrari's ever made. Even by those of the older generation. I contend the 288 GTO is one of the best looking post-war sports cars made, along with the Miura, maybe the E-Type and the Dino. And the 308 shares some of that appeal. -F
They're all beautiful cars, rapidly becoming unaffordable (if they haven't already!) for most people. I think that for that reason- rampant speculation- plus a long history of reasonable reliability- will push the later Dino types up (meaning the 308/328's)- way up- too. But that's for the future; if anyone wants one buy it because you really want to; let the market do what it will. When the car of your "dreams" is in your garage, paid for, who cares what the market does? Cheers, Rich
Thanks, thecarreaper. When I bought the Stratos decades ago they were cheaper than a 308/328. However, it makes a good companion car to the 246, a study in contrasts. This photo emphasizes that the Dino belongs to a different era - below the magic 1973 cut-off - which explains in part the difference in the current values between the Dinos and the 308s. Andres Nice Les Pauls, by the way. Plenty of guitarists here. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Am I the only one who finds the 2x6 Dinos very feminine. A pretty car no doubt, but I always think there should be a Sophia Lauren behind the wheel, not a dude. The GT4 seems much more a man's car, as does the 308 GTB, which is IMO the nicest of them all.
Back to the original topic: why aren't 308's as valuable as 246's? I read an article on Forza about this very topic "While were on the topic of investment: Although their prices gently rise and fall with the market at large, 308s are not collectible cars. Part of the problem is the aforementioned high production numbers; note that the relatively rare, fiberglass-bodied cars command a significant premium over their more plentiful steel brethren. Another issue is that the later 328 and 348 dont cost significantly more than the 308, meaning theres no price gap for the earlier car to rise into."
That wasn't exactly my original question. I still don't understand why 246s command their current prices, considering what they are. How can those cars be eight to ten times, on average, more? The Forza piece doesn't explain it either in my opinion. In fact, they lost me when they said 308s aren't collectible. By any measurement, including Ferrari, 12,000 cars made over a decade isn't a whole lot, not to mention their "celebrity" status, as evident by "Magnum P.I." and countless movies they've starred in. While most of us here are blessed to have one in their "collection", there are many, many more who would love to own a 308. What about a beautiful, exotic, and yes, rare Italian car with such a iconic history and heritage is not collectable? I get it that they were entry level Ferraris, but so were the 246s, which didn't even have "Ferrari" any where on the car. The 308 is arguably the most recognized Ferrari (general public) ever made.
With $300K for its predecessor, I'd say there is quite a significant price gap to rise into!!! I'm holding on to my GT4 and will in fact strive to make it more original than it is now...
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