Entry level Ferrari

I think the interior of the 360 looks very low rent with the big aluminum center console and the door panels with exposed hardware. Looks unfinished. I like the 430 6 speed gate. Reminiscent of the gear lever and gates on GTO

 

I just saw this thread....Back when I started collecting Ferrari cars...I remember the Dino as being Ferraris' entry level car...... how times do change.... I bought my first Ferrari in 1976... a 1972 365GTC/4.... still own that car today....
.... and in ref. the 360 Modena...
I own a 2002 360 Coupe with manual trans and love it (It's maroon in color with black interior) ... a great car (IMHO) and really enjoy that manual trans.

 

Totally agree. Thats why I say if they go the VW route, they will stop selling dreams and just be selling cars. This won't happen immediately and in the short run it might work. SM says he's out around 2018 so my guess is- they juice everything, the market elevates their shares, they depart and sell out and what's left is a mess circa 2020.

Of course I'm just being jaded and cynical.

FWIW I agree the 360 interior seems like its more suited to the stick but I also prefer the more refined looks of the 430 interior and the stick still looks good there. I really love both cars and to me the 430 stick is about as good as it gets for a sports car.

 

Speaking of manual transmissions and boost 4c cars, I just got the last of the issues checked on my Miata this morning. The piggy back ecu harness was loose and not properly seated after my supercharger install last year. I chased ground and fault issues the whole time. Just put a new egr valve and front O2 sensor on it (14 years old anyway) and still had troubles. Not anymore, and I have less than 100K miles on the car, full SS exhaust with 4-2-1 header-hi-flow cat, 16 inch alloy summer wheels, VMaxx suspension with 1 inch drop, and 200+ hp at the rear wheels. With the ss exhaust probably more and need to get to a dyno. Car is paid for and so is the supercharger. I wonder how it would do against the 4C?

 

From what I've heard the current gen is so systems integrated that a manual box doesn't work as well the F1 does.
With emissions dictating regenitive technology I doubt that a conventional box will be a possibility.

A shame. Thank goodness old tech is still available on the used market.

 

See my post #74

Sadly, I agree. The Luca di Montezemolo era cars will probably be the last of the real Ferraris.

I hope I'm wrong.

Joe

 

You got it.

 

Bingo! I've been reading half these post thinking this. Ferrari is spinning off to be a direct competitor, it's own business needing it's own models to compete. Not part of any comglomerant parent company. They need to take market for their own were ever they can find it profitably.

 

Ferrari if the business model that is currently on the table become reality, will be I luxury brand, spanning into the hotel, club, clothing, handbag market etc. the cars will be a small part of the overall picture. Sad.

 

Sounds like a situation suited to a corporate takeover.

Sadder yet.

 

Yes! It's a terrible change. The company will become a joke. Just like LV. You buy an LV when you want to appear rich. I know people who don't have 10 bucks in their bank account, yet have 2 or 3 LV hand bags.

Ferrari has been a poser car for the last 10 years, it's only gonna get worse.

 

Buy the old ones now.

 

Jaded and cynical? Oh no, I guess your comments are very sustainable.

In this discussion we must always have to remember, SM is responsible for the FCA group, he has to bring back the entire concern on the way of success. In this relevance I'm sure SM is totally aware about the extraordinary value of Ferrari and he is intelligent enough to use the Ferrari "brand power" with appropriate care inside the FCA group.

In 2020 I see a Ferrari shop at least combined with Maserati cars, maybe also with Alfa Romeo cars in a separate show room. And next to the "FCA Italien car shop" maybe you will also find Jeep cars from "the inventor of SUV's" - why not!? That a dealer is able to earn money by selling new cars he needs a wide portfolio with attractive and competitive models. Also a wide price range would help for being successful. For me it's clear that the entire Ferrari global sales structure must be transformed, the existing structure is already on its limits.

The LdM-way, to increase the product margin by limiting the car production (at the end you have to pay more for the same product), is IMO extremely customer unfriendly. Therefore I prefer the forward strategy of SM. While looking on the latest product roadmap from Maserati I'm very relaxed about the future of Ferrari, I guess they know what they do. I have the impression that the "Italians" finally get more professional and more customer and market oriented and their high-handed posturing finally finds an end. I wanna buy primary a market leading high end product with an extraordinary design and not any dreams or stories based on average quality.

 

Ferrari of Washington just completed construction of their Alfa show room. It's smaller than a two car garage, but your prediction will come true by summer. I doubt they''ll ever commingle jeeps with the exotics, but maybe they'll eventually make good on the Maser SUV threat. I wouldn't mind seeing it.

 

How do you see Ferrari being sold with Maserati and Alfa when it won't be part of the Fiat group?

 

Who is telling you that Ferrari will no longer be part of the FCA group?

 

10 years? Try 20 years.

 

The company is being spun off

Sorry

 

Yup

 

A guy down the street is trying to unload one. Been for sale about a year now, sits in his front yard with a big Maserati for $3500 sign in front of it.

 

I thought regenerative technology had to do with braking?

Either way, performance (acceleration and fuel efficiency) levels now mean that an old school stick probably isn't viable for the top end of the market or in any serious competition setting. I'm sure we'll see dual-clutch manuals from now till the end of the internal combustion engine, at least in higher end cars. Probably three-pedal manuals in entry level pickups, etc., where costs are tight. (I was in a Tesla showroom two days ago, and I think the heavy old gearbox is looking a little long in the tooth [pun intended]...)

I'm glad I have the Speedster (and now 308) to drive, but also glad automakers have moved on. Definitely keeping the old stuff, though.

Glad to hear it. Alfa as the entry level Italian sports car makes a lot of sense, IMHO. It's a premium brand with lots of latitude to establish its market niche here in the US.

 

A few shares are sold to generate cash, that's all.

"FCA Chief Executive Officer Sergio Marchionne, who is also Ferrari’s chairman, plans to sell 10 percent of the unit on a stock market in the second or third quarter of 2015 and distribute Fiat Chrysler’s remaining 80 percent stake to its own investors. The move is intended to help raise $5 billion to cut debt and develop models as Marchionne melds regional carmakers Fiat and Chrysler into one entity to challenge the likes of General Motors Co., Volkswagen AG and Toyota Motor Corp".

 

We read this differently.
The reports I've read cited an IPO with 10% of the new stock being offered to the market the rest going to FCA shareholders.
If not a new issue what shares are they offering 10% of?

 

What you are saying is right except for the fact that Ferrari will be it's own company by them taking these steps.
Exactly what you said will happen. When they say they will sell 10% to the stock market you are right they will sell the newly formed Ferrari stock not fiat chrystler stock. And of course when it spins off current share holders of fiat Chrysler will have to be compensated for the loss of value to the company so they will be issued shares of the newly formed company to compensate for the loss of value to fiat Chrysler.
Ferrari in it's intererty will then be a separate business entity and a publicly traded company with no parent company.

 

And if I'm FCA shareholders I probably begin selling Ferrari shares as soon as I can. I probably don't sell the majority of those shares right away, but some. Because the markets can be quite fickle and this move seems to be popular with the markets so you might as well strike when the iron is hot.

As to making poser cars- name a company thats not Aerial or anyone else with small volume that doesn't make cars that you could criticize as poser cars.

Btw- I agree with the comment about systems being so integrated that it would be hard to make a manual- but if you had a platform that didn't have to have head line horsepower numbers, it might be doable.

I do agree that what SM says might lead to a more customer friendly Ferrari. But I predict in the long run it makes the cars more on par with what you see with Porsche- and I can tell you from personal experience with them and any other marque- going to the dealers is a hit or miss experience. For me the shame of it is Ferraris cars stand apart. I'm worried that will end. But who knows. I'm just one guy typing away here...

Let me wish you all happy new year! And thank you for the good discussion.