"New for '89...now comes equipped standard with electrical issues!" | FerrariChat

"New for '89...now comes equipped standard with electrical issues!"

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by qwazipsycho, Jan 9, 2015.

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  1. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Aloha. I haven't been here in quite a while. Life sucks you in sometimes even in paradise.

    So, anyway, I decided to put the b1tch on the ground for a while. She needed to have her annual safety inspection sticker replaced. She ran great for about 50 miles. I shut her down for a while and upon restart, only 1 fuel pump. I've had this problem before but it always cures itself before I can determine where the problem is. This time it is not self curing. In the past, I have even gone as far as running a temporary wire from the battery to the fuel pump just to get it going. Then, after removing the temporary wire, the problem had cured itself again.

    This time, I have determined that there is no voltage to the "front" fuel pump which feeds the left or drivers side bank. I don't care what the fuse box labels say. With the car running, if I pull the fuse or the relay labeled L.H. fuel pump, the car dies. When I pull either of the R.H. nothing happens. She keeps running. Therefore, it's backwards...but let's not focus on that.

    The fuses are good and the relays are good. I swapped them around just to make sure. If I plug the relay in while the car is running, I can hear and feel it switching. However, there is 0 volts at the fuel pump.

    Steve M this is your territory again my friend. But I'll gladly take answers from anyone who has had the experience.

    Hope everyone is doing well!

    Mahalo,

    Scott
     
  2. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Steve - found this so you don't have to repeat yourself:

    For fuel pump operation diagnosis, remove each fuel pump relay and apply a jumper wire from terminal 30 to terminal 87 in the relay socket as shown in this jpeg:
    Name: jumping a 113 relay.jpg


    the corresponding fuel pump should run (even with the key "off") -- and the labeling on the fuse-relay panel is a little confusing -- the fuel pump relay marked "RH side" is for the fuel pump mounted on the RH side of the chassis, but it actually serves the 7-12 LH bank, and vice-versa. Alternatively, you could (safely) unplug each fuel pump relay one at a time while the engine is running to (intentionally) disable each bank.
     
  3. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,661
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    If the jumper doesn't run the corresponding fuel pump = highest probability is a directly frazzled y white connector terminal and/or PCB damaged by a hot y white connector terminal.

    If the jumper does run the corresponding fuel pump = could just be a bad relay (but you should still have a look at your white connectors once in a while ;))

    Please let us know the true root cause when you find it.
     
  4. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    #4 qwazipsycho, Jan 9, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Crap, I thought I was going to be able to post the root cause before you replied. You are just toooo good SM.

    Many years ago I suffered a catastrophic fuse box melt down. This was my repair. 80 hours to trace and resolder every circuit in the PCB. It has worked flawlessly until now. The white connector with the fuel pump wire was making poor contact, overheated and it snapped my soldering job inside. You can see the missing contact in the second picture. The nice thing is, it was easy to see and fix. I also noted a couple other hot spots I'll have to work on. But at least I'm back on the road.

    I've owned this car so long and done so much to it, I forget all the things I've done till I see them again.

    NO LAUGHING AT MY PILE OF SPAGHETTI!!! It cost 1/1000th of a new fuse box and nobody ever sees it....until now....NO LAUGHING!
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  5. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 29, 2008
    5,487
    Madison Ohio
    Full Name:
    David A.
    Correct me if I'm wrong. But when you do the 6 relay bypass on the printed circuit fuse box, don't you eliminate the white plastic (problematic) connector? And run the hi-current wires from the relay and solder them direct to the wire going to the component?
    I was under the impression that the white connector looses tension with age and heat and multiplys the resistance that is hard on the printed circuit board.


    Ago
     
  6. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
    9,468
    southwest Germany, France ( Alsace ) and Thailand
    Full Name:
    romano schwabel
    nice to hear or read again from you scott :)
    the diff is still working fine I hope?

    to solder the connections in the fuse box is not a very good idea. some wires get so warm that the solder may get fluid and then there is no connection any more. so better would be to crimp always

    p.s.: nice spaghetti :)
     
  7. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Aloha Romano! Long time. Yes, the diff is fine. The clutch is still junk but Im driving it anyway.

    All I can say about my fusebox - It has worked flawlessly for about 10 years. I haven't opened it up again until now.
     
  8. Schulz308

    Schulz308 Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 21, 2014
    1,506
    STL USA
    I think we have the same washing machine! I did a belt service to it last year. Oh, and nice spaghetti ha ha
     
  9. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    LOL! Way to be A.D.D. and I said no laughing at my...oh look! Horsies!!!

    I hate that washing machine. At least a front loader makes a nice workbench :)
     
  10. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    How can such a beautiful car be built with such horrendous electrical problems?!?!

    OK, so I fixed the fuel pump issue. A new solder point and all is well. Put it all back together and then the right front turn signal stops working. The spread of the connector for the blue wire in the white plastic connector at the fuse box was too wide. Closed the gap, now that works. Next, the fog lights don't come on anymore ((sigh)). Oops! Didn't seat the white connector all the way in. Fixed.

    I had enough of the problem with the crank sensor 4 wire round connector below the expansion tank. You could touch it and the car would die. Cut it off and replaced the connector with an aftermarket. Fixed.

    I know, I know. I could buy the gold kit and fix all these problems but the kit is expensive and I've fixed almost all the other problems over the years with my own fixes. I'm never going to sell this car so I don't care if it's not a factory plug. The factory plugs SUCK anyway!

    I was searching the forum for answers to some of these questions and I stumbled across another answer. I was having the fuse blowing issue caused by the right rear hood strut rubbing on the deck lid many years ago. I replaced the strut with an F part. Still shorted. I never noticed the rubbing till I just read that post. I simply bypassed the strut with a short wire between the upper and lower connectors. Now I've removed that wire and placed a small sleeve around the strut. Fixed.

    I've never worked on 1 car so much. I've owned other cars this long (15 years) but nothing compares to the amount of brain damage this car has given me. If it wasn't the coolest car on earth I would have disposed of it long ago.

    Hey Steve M. - You're the GOD of F electronics!
     
  11. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Scott
    Aloha David,

    I had this problem 10 years ago and I had no idea there was an aftermarket fix for it. I did this all on my own by taking apart the PCB and tracing every circuit path and duplicating it with solid copper wire. Had I known which circuits were known for excessive heat, I would have done something to beef them up. But, as I said, this fix has worked flawlessly for over 10 years. So, I'm happy with it.
     

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