I remember reading that ferrari was either testing or researching electric superchargers/ turbochargers for their cars. Does anyone know if that would that still use exhaust gases or would the engine still be technically a N/A screamer if they went that route?
I agree with you noone1. It's not like the baggage you have to deal with for an all-electric car (the weight of the batteries). You look at what Ferrari was able to achieve on the torque curve on the La Ferrari and that, to me, says it all. Granted, you could have incremental reliability issues with a hybrid approach, but those will be addressed like all other engineering issues have been: with experience and volume they will cease to be significant. (Unlike the issues besetting pure electrics, which are fundamental issues of physics)
Because its a much, much better looking car. That does count for something! I'm a 12-cylinder person, there's nothing yet to replace that particular rush, and, as impressed as I am with the 488 GTB as an incremental development, it doesn't change the type of car I'm going to prefer (as long as it remains available!)
Ferrari should adopt the Porsche approach and offer a na 488 and a higher hp turbo 488...a la 991 and 991 turbo. na for true driving enthusiast and turbo for those seeking more hp and technology. Problem solved.
I hoped ferrari would come with something like a turbo/supercharger which could be driven by electricity so it won't affect the exhaust. A mini Kers system like in F1 where the turbo lag is eliminated by "kickstart" the turbine by electricity.
My post was intended to be an assurance that the turbos won't be a problem for most Ferrari Owners. When will you see a 488 with 75-100k mi?? I think we agree on that part. You say you have seen oem turbos with Zero issues on cars with over 100k. Ok.. We're definitely close on my guestimate because i said between 75k-100k. How much more confidence do you havd in those turbos operating like new over 100k miles? 125k? 150k? What OEM manufacturer right now has a car producing 660 hp with turbos peak boosting at 19 lbs? You really think those IHI turbos are going to be performing at optimum after 125k miles? Sure... If you've been babying it the whole time. It won't be catastrophic if it doesnt perform at optimum either, so it is unnecessary for a manufacturer to mention it. Turbo problems have been mentioned across the automotive industry for decades. That didn't really stop people from buying them because it is well known at some point, you will have to deal with them. Mazda never mentioned the twin turbos on my rx7 was a wear and tear item either. Yet everytime I've took them out for inspection around 80k miles, they showed signs of oil leak, some shaft play and needed to be rebuilt. Big deal? No, not really. Could i have used the turbos as is longer? Probably. Will the car still drive? Yes. For racing, will it be performing at optimum? I'd rather the address the minor issues every 80k mi than find out the hard way.
In general, I agree with your post and conclusions; however, just to share, I have had 2 X5M's, my friends have had X5M's and M5's with the twin turbo V8s....between us, we've all had significant turbo, turbo-related and fuel injector issues, including replacements, between 60-90K. Caveat - yes, it's a BMW engine, it's a different design, a lot of DFI injection systems have issues. For the 488, I'm curious to see how it runs. People complain about "lag" - if you want to feel lag, you should have tried my old Porsche turbo race car or a Saab 900 Turbo. Porsche has done a decent job of mitigating the "irregularities" in the RPM vs. HP/Torque curves via their turbo designs and software. Interesting to note that in the 488, they moved the turbos outboard quite a bit. Long runners may not be good, but dealing with the heat is going to be the issue to contend with (hence the mega large side vents?). As for durability, I think the next-fen 488 Challenge car will provide an early indication. Aside from the early 458 gearbox issues, the 458C race cars (and engines) are proving to be very reliable engine-wise. If you believe 1 track mile = 10-20 road miles, the first season will tell us a lot about what's going to break on the road versions.
I'd just wish they'd stick the V12's from the FF or F12 into the car and leave it at that... Now THAT would get me really excited about the 488! As it is now, meh....458 already too fast as is; the entertainment value is all in the throttle response and sound, as well as the handling....not feeling it too much for the 3.9L turbo....
That's what they do in F1. The electric motor spins up the turbo and the exhaust gases take over from there. Nothing of the sort in their road cars though.
488 might be the link between NA engines and F1 derived MGU engine in the next generation. Back in the old days even F1 moved from front engines to mid engines with difficulty.
One of the issues in adapting electric assist to turbos in road cars is the need for high voltage (typically 48V) to drive the turbos. This means a fairly complicated and expensive set of electricals. It can be done though.
Except for the GT3 and GT3rs, they will keep their drivers cars non-turbo and pure (although you could argue that they have already spoiled the purity of the GT3 by making it paddle shift only).
Do you still ride this boring "turbo-sound-is-bad" wave? Open your eyes, the 488 GTB is already an absolute direct hit - more attractive, significantly stronger and much faster - the new star of the sports car world, amen.
Guys, I am preparing renders for more hardcore version of 488 that I will post on forum. I thought it could be called 488 Maranello. What do you think?
Yes, seals will eventually leak. If they do, you have to tow the car unless you want to risk fouling the cats (not to mention possibly starting a fire and at the very least blowing lots of smoke out the exhaust). But turbo rebuilds should not be that difficult. Just very expensive as are all things Ferrari. If it happens within the 100k mile emissions warranty, you might get Ferrari to pay but I wouldn't count on it.
Don't know about that. Since the LaFerrari can power its wheels via an electric motor, I would assume that this would be possible for a turbo as well. I am no expert though.
.5s on a 1 and a half minute track is considered "much" faster? Considering the slight improvements in downforce and improved active suspension, .5s isn't worth bragging about. You could probably put the Speciale motor in the 488 chassis and get the same improvement.
The LaF can do it only because it has an enormously expensive and heavy high voltage battery to start with. Noblesse Oblige was referring to producing high voltage from a car with a standard +12V battery and system. The only high voltage in that system that I know of is with the spark plug coils which is not compatible with running electric motors. I think its a valid concern.
