Lotsa braking problems after a major service | FerrariChat

Lotsa braking problems after a major service

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by stekkefun4, Apr 5, 2015.

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  1. stekkefun4

    stekkefun4 Formula 3
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    #1 stekkefun4, Apr 5, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Some weeks ago, I picked up my Mondial at the garage where it had its major service and now I finally had the chance to drive it (Mondial T of 1992).

    From the start, the brake warning light came on and did not go out. A couple of kms further, the car had lost about 90% of its braking power! I couldn't press the braking pedal at all because it was so hard! Pulled over, and noticed that the stup!d f*$!&r of the garage had filled the oil braking fluid in the reservoir up till the cap! Way over the maximum that is indicated on the reservoir! When I finally arrived home, I removed about 20cl from the reservoir and now the fluid is just below max...

    To my disappointment, the brake warning light stays on and I still feel it doesn't have its full braking power back. Nor does the pedal feel normal again, still too hard. ABS is not working either - that has something to do with the ECU the guy from the garage told me before. Anyhow, I wonder what needs to be done to get normal braking power back. Bleeding all nipples at the wheels and start a full brake fluid replacement procedure?

    Thanks for any advice,
    Stefan
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  2. davebdave

    davebdave Formula 3
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    Sounds like the electric brake pump isn't working. Is there a fuse for that? Possible the accumulator lost its charge?
     
  3. dfranzen

    dfranzen Formula 3
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    There are alot of threads search "hard brake pedal" in 328 section also 348 we have the TevesII system you can google that also to see other cars that had same system and issues.

    overfilling the reservoir will not give you an issue

    however it may not have been overfilled and its internally dumping into the reservoir from the accumulator

    try the tests here: (dont pay attention to the buick!)

    Accumulator Testing Instructions - Reatta Owners Journal
     
  4. Wade

    Wade Three Time F1 World Champ
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    I recall reading something about the ABS systems having additional steps for the bleeding process, especially the t.
     
  5. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido Formula 3
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    Before doing something wrong, I would consider to bring the car back to S. Power..or that they pick it up at your home.
    It cannot be, after a major, you have those issues without consulting them first.

    Guido
     
  6. stekkefun4

    stekkefun4 Formula 3
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    I had my foot on the brake pedal while starting the engine and I couldn't feel any movement in the pedal at all! When switching the key to the 'on' position I could hear the brake cilinder do 'phiew-phiew' for a second, so it runs a self-check.

    I'll get in touch with the garage tomorrow and have it fixed ASAP.
     
  7. stekkefun4

    stekkefun4 Formula 3
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    Apparently, from what the mechanic just told me, the level of the brake fluid has risen too high because the ABS system is not working. It's going to be transported to the garage later this week.
     
  8. stekkefun4

    stekkefun4 Formula 3
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    #8 stekkefun4, Apr 8, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Finally had it sent back to the garage thanks to the road assist people. Notice the guy taking a picture of the Mondial on his trailer.
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  9. MvT

    MvT F1 Rookie

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    You made his day! ;) hope it will be something simple though..!
     
  10. stekkefun4

    stekkefun4 Formula 3
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    Yeah, the guy looked happy. Image him driving by his house and calling his kids outside : "look what I've got on my truck today!"
     
  11. jfrazar

    jfrazar Karting
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    My hunch is they did not bleed the system correctly after the major. Not a big deal. If they did then the Master cyl is sending Fluid back into the resv. This is a classic sign of failed internal seals in the multi chamber master cyl. Take a look at the fluid flow on one. What a PITA. Good news is parts are all off the shelf stuff. PM if you need anything and I can give you the cheats.

    Joe Frazar
     
  12. stekkefun4

    stekkefun4 Formula 3
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    Thanks for the info, I'm waiting for an update from the garage. I'll keep that in mind .
     
  13. peterdavid911

    peterdavid911 Formula 3

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    Just a hunch, but when I had my 3.2 mondial (non abs) I would often find that upon start up the brake pedal would not move. It was so hard but after a few pumps up and down it would go to normal pedal feel. It ended up being the non return valve from the engine that creates the vacuum for the brake system to work. It's such a cheap part. The original is metal and fits between 2 hoses. They are no longer made in metal and are now plastic and is the same part as used in the 430.
    Like I said it's just a hunch but was my cheapest fix for under $10.
     
  14. dfranzen

    dfranzen Formula 3
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    Peter,

    ABS does not have the valve, its uses a motor to create pressure


     
  15. peterdavid911

    peterdavid911 Formula 3

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    So the valve is valid on non abs as in the mondial.
    I wonder what the function of that part is for on the 430 then as what's what they use?
     
  16. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Totally different ABS system.
     
  17. stekkefun4

    stekkefun4 Formula 3
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    Got my car back from yesterday. The guytold me there was a faulty connector at the brake cilinder that didn't give any contact so the accumulator could not work. Anyhow, I have it back and didn't have to pay a thing... Only fair after a service of 6000 euro.
     
  18. MvT

    MvT F1 Rookie

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    :) connectors and Mondials and you have more then one connector ;) bad connectors are generally an issue in old(er) cars. Good to hear it was something minor!
     
  19. theunissenguido

    theunissenguido Formula 3
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    It helps putting their name on a forum like this.....

    Guido
     
  20. dfranzen

    dfranzen Formula 3
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    CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN your connectors!
     
  21. Rapalyea

    Rapalyea Formula 3

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    #21 Rapalyea, Apr 25, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2015
    Meant to post a new thread....
     
  22. Rapalyea

    Rapalyea Formula 3

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    I have often wondered where the vacuum is tapped. Where is this $10 weak item? As for anti-lock they are a very mixed blessing. Mostly because they greatly increase stopping distance on hard packed snow or ice. Something like 25%. Car and Driver did a test decades ago. But I knew it the first time I used my first anti-locks on a downhill ice sheet. NO brakes.

    The reason for this is that locked-up brakes scrape a wedge of shavings in front of the tire which really helps. Anti-locks do not have that capability. I no longer live with such matters. However, when I lived in ChicagoLand I even disconnected anti-locks on certain days.
     
  23. Rapalyea

    Rapalyea Formula 3

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    #23 Rapalyea, Apr 25, 2015
    Last edited: Apr 25, 2015
    PS: I have two cars without anti-lock and three with anti-lock. The insurance companies at first offered a 15% discount for anti-locks. They have not done that for a very very long time. And then there is the rediculous assertion you can steer if you have anti-locks. On ice you can not steer whatever you are driving. And since I am a 'G' force sort of guy I practice max brakes almost every time I drive.

    My speculation is this: The average driver has never activated anti-lock which means he is in a panic stop the first time. As much as I have practiced braking there is no practical way to practice steering during an anti-lock panic stop. You would need a specialized course or an airport runway. I believe everyone should fully activate their anti-lock brakes at least once a week.

    Today, for instance, I did max brakes on the Mondi at least half a dozen times. They are not anti-lock and are a bit touchy. But after hundreds of practice stops I am getting better at it. And I will argue it is better for the brakes. Why? First, if you stop from 60mph in two seconds as I do or four seconds the brakes are used to transfer about the same amount of energy. If you do it in two seconds the brake calipers are well exercised over many fewer revolutions. Tires I can afford.
     

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