How far behind is McLaren ?

Well, i think being customer for the Merc engines are working pretty well for Williams, Force India and even Lotus. Mclaren probably just needed a better chassis.

The current rules and regulations hardly encourage any improvements in the engine department. Which is why, i think if it's going to be same next year, Honda will probably pack it in in 2017.

 

Apparently they´re cutting off some cylinders to ease out the power delivery.

 

It´s good for those, but McLaren supposedly wants to win.

 

Give em some time fellas. They'll get there, although I expect it to take two more seasons when we're in the new regs for it to be a reality.

From what I've seen and heard, the mclaren chassis is pretty good. The car is lacking about a half second or so of downforce and another second due to the power unit. It's more driveable then it was but its still not at full power so my guess is they are 75bhp down from the Benz along with a lot less drive ability.

With Prodromou there I am not worried about the chassis being moved forward. Arai and Honda give me concerns as they've had a long long time to get this thing together before the season got going, yet they were nowhere near the mark of evening a running car for several races, and they still don't have a fully operational car. That all said, I have more confidence in them then I do Renault, who are just royaled.

 

Surely the electric engine provides most of the torque on early acceleration??? If not it appears to me that Honda have made the same mistake as BRM (v16 and Rolls Royce's fault) and built a compressor that only works at very high RPM. This means the engine is only of use at constant RPM in say an aeroplane ...

BUT with an electric engine driving the compressor there should be NO off boost periods and they should be able to easily and accurately control the boost at all RPMs!

Surely not a computer control issue? ... there are a couple of million teenage hackers/programmers that would probably love to help a F1 team ...
Pete

 

perhaps they should consider turning them back on for the straight bits...

 

that explains why they sound like they're backfiring a lot.

 

Here's my take on the whole McHonda situation. Hope you guys like it.
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LOL! That's really good.

All the best,
Andrew.

 

Ouch!

+1

You should send that in to Sniff - Right up their street!

Cheers,
Ian

 

Who knows where their problems really are? While I thought they'd struggle this year, I didn't expect them to be quite this bad.

As for "consistent" boost & the control thereof, I don't think that's where they're lacking; One thing they all seem to agree on is these things produce monster torque; It's hard for the poor darlings to control it - They'll break traction at the slightest "provocation" it seems. Cutting cylinders is exactly what TC used to do for them (and that sounded like **** too!)

As you say though, surely they've got some really clever guys working on the maps. And the jockeys should really be able to control the go pedal, surely?

As many have noted, they'll get it figured out. I can't see them slinking off with their tales between their legs.

Again, it's Renault that have really disappointed me this season. They weren't that far off last year, but seem to have regressed this term. No idea why....

Cheers,
Ian

 

Well I'd say McLaren and Honda definitely don't know!

I don't think anybody did! - Especially McLaren and Honda!

I have to be honest though, it's kind of fun to watch them struggle after all the years of the "We're better than all the rest" arrogance that we've had to put up with from the team and Ron Dennis!

McLaren couldn't figure the front pull-rod suspension out (to be fair, they didn't really give it enough time to get it to work - It took Ferrari 2 years!), they couldn't sort their chassis out in their last year with Mercedes power, and they're struggling to get this years car working.

As for Honda, they've got previous for: "slinking off with their tales between their legs"

 

Thanks Nero I plan on responding through doodles; they convey more eloquently than my usual gibberish.

 

Thanks Ian, I thought Fchat could use a poor man's Brockbank or Felix Petrol to help lighten up the mood.
I plan to scatter them through out Fchat forums.

 

McLaren was the fastest car at the end of 2012 - Then Whitmarsh took them into a different
design direction for 2013 instead of evolving the 2012 design like Red Bull.End result RB wins
McLaren becomes a turd.Plus Competing with your own engine suppier is not a good position - IMO

 

+1 to all!

I'm certainly not losing any sleep over their troubles. I also keep remembering Uncle Rons prognostications at last winters test; "We're way ahead of where we expected to be at this stage & fully expect to win next (this) season!"..... Oops!....

True, but surely this time round, as a PU supplier only, they'll stick with it?

I do also find it somewhat amusing that they continue to claim "the car is fundamentally good". Pretty much any car, at this level anyway, feels good when it's at 8-9/10ths. It's when pushed they turn into dogs.......

Cheers,
Ian

 

I'm pretty certain the McLaren F1 team wasn't Martin Whitmarsh's own personal pet project to do whatever he wanted with, and that nobody else within McLaren had any say whatsoever about changes to the design of the car.

There would have been loads of meetings at McLaren with all of their clever engineers and designers to discuss the pro's and cons of the design changes before they were allowed to happen, and even then it would not have come down to just what Martin Whitmarsh wanted.

However, if you can prove that Martin Whitmarsh, on his own, went in one day and said: "This is the new design concept we're going to be working on, I don't care what any of you say on whether it's right or wrong, we're doing it and that's an end to all discussions on the matter!", then I'll happily stand corrected.

(And I'll also look forward to Ron Dennis' resignation from McLaren as based on your theory, he must now be solely to blame for their current slump in form!)

 

Indeed!..... MW was a (pretty good IMO) team principal. But as with Flav, Marlboro Man, EJ and many others, he was a manager, not an engineer. Blaming him for their shortcomings is naive at best IMO.

Sure, the buck stops at the top, I get that, and it does seem he became the fall guy there, but blaming him for their struggles isn't at all fair to the guy, again, IMO.

Cheers,
Ian

 

Sorry I don't agree with your thoughts - Whitmarsh made a huge mistake and got fired

 

Exactly My point!

Martin Whitmarsh made decisions based on the information given to him by the designers and engineers, he didn't simply wake up one morning and say: "Pull-rod front suspension! - end of!"

He didn't sit down at his breakfast table and sketch out the next McLaren F1 car on the back of his cornflakes box saying: "I don't care what the engineers and designers come up with! - That's what we're building!"

Others let the team down and he paid the price for it!

The funny thing is, Ron Dennis made a big thing about how he was going to take control of McLaren F1 again in January 2014, because things had become far too slack and laid back under Martin Whitmarsh, and even stated that with himself at the helm again, McLaren would immediately become winners again.

However, in 2014 McLaren finished 5th in the constructors Championship, and currently they sit 9th out of 10 teams with only 4 points to show for their efforts so far!

Based on the "buck stops at the top" theory that certain people on here seem to think was suitably applied to Martin Whitmarsh, again I say, Ron Dennis has to go as he has overseen one of the most disastrous F1 seasons in McLaren's entire racing history!

 

Fair enough.

I beg to differ, and that's fine too.

This is a repost, but I'm still chuckling;

Love the "reports from Woking of a mild version of the same condition suffered by a Mr Magnussen."

Cheers,
Ian

 

So what was this huge mistake that Whitmarsh made exactly? - To listen to his designers and engineers?

Ron Dennis has made a huge mistake so far in choosing Honda, so based on your theory, he should he be fired too shouldn't he?

 

Love SniffPetrol and they sure have had lots of material to work with this year.

Whatever you think of Whitmarsh, the fact is he left the team with cars that finished 2nd and 3rd. The Ron led dream team has taken over, and, after a slight down-turn in form, they moved into a bit of a slump but have now progressed to full fledged free-fall

 

Hilarious

 

You made the statement!:

Now answer the question:

Back your statement up with the facts of the matter that prove the point you're making!