355 Clutch Master Cylinder | FerrariChat
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355 Clutch Master Cylinder

Discussion in '348/355' started by mwhitesell, Jan 27, 2014.

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  1. mwhitesell

    mwhitesell Formula 3

    Sep 17, 2006
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    #1 mwhitesell, Jan 27, 2014
    There have been tons of posts about the clutch seals and throwout bearing but very little about the master cylinder. I started with a small leak in the clutch and decided to take on this project since it's been so cold.
    The symptoms I saw were the obvious leaking clutch fluid and occasionally the clutch wouldn't engage until really close to the floor. The clutch would do this randomly. Sometime it worked great, other times I would only have an inch or so to work with up against the floor.

    I had expected this to be the throwout bearing but it turned out to be just one of the seals on the bearing.

    Once I had this fixed and put back together I realized that I was unable to bleed the clutch. This is when I realized that there was another issue. I traced it back up to the master cylinder.
    The process to get to the master cylinder is to take out the front carpets and it's right there.
    What happened was that the grease and grime from years of sitting around had started to gum up inside the piston until it was stuck.
    To get this piece out, there is two 10mm bolts in the front and one 13mm one up under the clutch. Then the two fluid lines. See pictures.
    Once I took it apart I realized that it was all gummed up and soaked it in degreaser. Then I banged it on a board and the piston came out. See pictures. After cleaning the cylinder and all the parts. I put it back together and back in and it works perfect.
    A couple things to note. The spring inside does not have the force to push out the piston unless there is fluid inside. So only push it in far enough to get the snap ring back in place and then install and bleed the air.
    Have rags nearby as clutch/brake fluid ruins paint.
    Then go enjoy your new smooth operating clutch. [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
     
    spaghetti_jet likes this.
  2. mwhitesell

    mwhitesell Formula 3

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    #2 mwhitesell, Jan 27, 2014
    One other thing I'll add. I think it's a bad design but my slightly leaking throwout bearing caused a fluid leak that made this worse. The brake fluid tank has three holes. Two for brakes and one for clutch. The brake ones are at the very bottom. The clutch one is halfway up on the side. So if your clutch is leaking and your brake light comes on, there is a good chance this piston will run dry in the master cylinder because this tube is the first to get above the fluid line.
     
  3. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    #3 yelcab, Jan 27, 2014
    And that is why you change your brake fluid once a year even if it sits ...
     
  4. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    #4 drbob101, Jan 27, 2014
    A Mitch said, my understanding is that if you do change yoru brake fluid regularly you can avoid this type of isse.

    In your ownership has it been changed every year? Do you know if before you it had fluids changed yearly?

    Thanks for the post.
     
  5. mwhitesell

    mwhitesell Formula 3

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    #5 mwhitesell, Jan 27, 2014
    The grease that gummed up was not on the fluid side. It was on the other side of the piston towards the clutch. All the fluid changes in the world would not have done anything about that grease that had dried up.
     
  6. mwhitesell

    mwhitesell Formula 3

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    #6 mwhitesell, Jan 27, 2014
    Also. Yes. I have changed the fluid often. With the Motiv bleader it takes 5 minutes. This is a must have tool for any F-car owner.
     
  7. roadracer311

    roadracer311 Formula 3

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    #7 roadracer311, Jan 29, 2014
    Actually this is a great design. It makes your car stop going, before it stops stopping!
     
  8. mwhitesell

    mwhitesell Formula 3

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    #8 mwhitesell, Jan 29, 2014
    Well. Yes. If you had to choose. :)
     
  9. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #9 fatbillybob, Jan 29, 2014
    LOL! Guys at Ferrari are pretty smart even if lunch comes with a bottle of vino.
     
  10. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    #10 Qavion, Oct 22, 2015
    Would anyone know if there is a seal kit for the clutch master cylinder? I noticed that the fluid in my '98 F355 5.2 RHD Spider (manual) brake/clutch reservoir was looking a little black (the brake side seemed ok).

    I assume the master cylinder seals are wearing on the plunger.

    ref above picture http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/01/27/ada8yjyr.jpg

    Motiv power bleeder already ordered :)

    Thanks!
    Cheers
    Ian.
     
  11. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    #11 m.stojanovic, Oct 22, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Alfa Romeo GTV (1974), and probably some other models, used the same Clutch Master so you can look for a rebuild kit for Alfa clutch master (I bought one on Ebay some time ago). Make sure it is for 19mm diameter and that the shapes of the two seals are as shown on the picture.
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  12. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    #12 Qavion, Oct 23, 2015
    Thanks, Miroljub! Sounds like a great find (and a bargain)

    1975? I had a look on eBay for early GTV kits. The '75 wasn't listed, but I found some 19mm types. Unfortunately, it's hard to make out the shape in the photographs.

    e.g. "FRENKIT 419016 Repair Kit clutch master cylinder". A likely candidate???

    Thanks

    Cheers
    Ian
     
  13. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    #13 m.stojanovic, Oct 23, 2015
  14. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    #14 m.stojanovic, Oct 23, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Yes, I bought the same kit as at Repair KIT Clutch Master Cylinder Bendix Bosch Autofren FOR Alfa Romeo 33 905 | eBay

    The only difference is that the rubber in the new kit (which is the right rubber shown on the attached sketch of the original piston) does not have that small lip at the centre hole of the rubber seen on the sketch. I have not used the new kit, just bought it for spare, but I don't think absence of the small lip matters; the main (lipped) rubber seal is the left one anyway, the right one is just like a doughnut.

    Otherwise, I also bought a complete "Centric" clutch master for Alfa at Clutch Master Cylinder Premium Clutch Master Cylinder Preferred Fits Milano | eBay
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  15. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    #15 Qavion, Oct 23, 2015
    Thanks, Miroljub, I'll keep that in mind... and what happened to the Space Shuttle with their seals/o-rings :D

    Anyway, the OEM Ferrari master is not too expensive if I run out of options. It might be a good idea for me to inspect the bore for scratches and other internal components before making a decision. I pulled apart my Lotus Esprit master last year and found a broken spring.

    Cheers
    Ian.
     
  16. Ritter Rost

    Ritter Rost Rookie

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    #16 Ritter Rost, Aug 19, 2021
  17. Targatime

    Targatime Formula 3

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    #17 Targatime, Aug 19, 2021
    Anyone ever try a high-end aftermarket MC like a Wilwood? I wonder if there's any improvement in clutch feel.
     
  18. freccia75

    freccia75 Rookie

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    #18 freccia75, Aug 22, 2021
    Great post, my doubt is just about the piston diameter as my original MC (on Mondial 3.2) has D=11/16" = 17.46mm and the Marelli D=19.05mm
     
  19. Ritter Rost

    Ritter Rost Rookie

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    #19 Ritter Rost, Aug 23, 2021
    The Mondial master cylinder does not have the part number 175211. The master cylinder that we discuss here fits to:
    • 348 TB (1993)
    • 348 TS (1993)
    • 575 Superamerica
    • 575M Maranello
    • 550 Maranello
    • 550 Barchetta
    • 512 TR
    • 456 M GT/GTA
    • 456 GT/GTA
    • 288 GTO
    • 348 (2.7 Motronic)
    • 512 M
    • F50
    • 355 (2.7 Motronic)
    • 355 (5.2 Motronic)
     
  20. freccia75

    freccia75 Rookie

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    #20 freccia75, Aug 31, 2021
    Thanks for your feedback.
    Although spare part list from superperformance stated that it can be used on the 3.2 Mondial as well.
    Anyhow will not trust as bore diameter is bigger.

    Will share the MC with diameter 19.05 in the hope this information can be used by some 355 driver.

    By the way, there are M8 threads in, but can be drilled in case you have studs on the 355.

    Regards from Switzerland Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login

    Sent from my MAR-LX1A using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  21. Ritter Rost

    Ritter Rost Rookie

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    #21 Ritter Rost, Aug 31, 2021
    f355spider, Targatime and freccia75 like this.

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