The Swiss Thread

Already been done by Basel Border Patrol as they learned you would be crossing there....good luck and safe driving!

 

....thanks to Mr. Leuenberger

 

Absolutely agree.

Marcel Massini

 

Utter BS. Leuenberger had nothing to do with the genesis and passing of the Via Sicura bill. We can hash out the details if you want to talk about facts rather than myths.

And there is no such thing as swiss police when it comes to road enforcement. If you are going to rant, be at least accurate in your rants. Police is cantonal in Switzerland, not federal.

It is not a distinction without a difference. The strategies of cantonal police vary wildly between cantons in terms of enforcement targets and means, and they are not coordinated. If you don't like Valais, don't go to Valais.

There is a lot of autophobia out there, people in general are scared by aggressive behaviours, and making outlandish claims does not help in any way. It just reinforces the general feeling that severe punishment is the only way. And we should all here remember that the stigma associated with the brand of the cars we drive means that the average Joe thinks we are even more deserving of severe punishment.

 

I guess we know that there is no "Swiss Police" responsible for the road enforcement, however, I allow myself very well to throw the police in this regard in "one pot". This con artist behavior is established across all cantons.

To many speed controls not on really dangerous hotspots, it is quite obvious that the selection criteria in the most cases is driven by financial aspects. My last ticket I had to pay on the open meadow between trees and cows. Far and wide no house, no people, no children - just nothing - only a few nice boys in blue playing with their laser gun.

All my political force is focused on headcount reduction in the police force in order to save costs there. Maybe that helps to lower theire speed ticket fine budgets...

 

I am not with you that all cantons are the same. Easy to tell by the rate and nature of highway controls, where lethality is close to zero in Switzerland.

We, sports cars enthusiasts, demand implicitly variable speed limits based on our wise assessment of conditions/risks/skills.
Authorities have the law on their side, and are tasked to ensure that prescriptions are respected everywhere and all the time. And given the number of idiots that get caught at 100+ km/h in villages where lives are really at risk, it is hard to argue that sports cars enthusiasts always choose adequately the location where they take some license with the law.

There is surely a duplicitous discourse from some, but the bottom line remains that:
- people who want less severity for road offenses are a tiny minority
- an extremist discourse does not help in any way - it just reinforces the cliché of the irresponsible sports car driver

And I would add that bragging about how pitifully cheap speed fines are for our well lined wallets is begging for a broadening of the system where fines are proportional to income. Be careful what you wish for.

We are constantly playing a hypocritical cat and mouse game. Laws in effect have been democratically voted (nobody, not even UDC/SVP, dared to propose a referendum against Via Sicura when it was voted with a comfortable majority because it is a popular measure), so we are supposed to respect them, go live somewhere else, or own our indiscretions.

If 5 brits are stupid enough to get caught that fast at that location, that's darwinism at work. Nothing to be ashamed of.

 

I'm sorry, but you seem to be wrong - the present situation is a result of Leuenberger's activities and somewhat "his baby". See here his own statements on the issue:
20 Minuten - «Es war ein langes Bohren» - News

 

I did not say he was against it.

But the article on the books did not come from the federal council. It is a counter-project of the parliament to a popular initiative launched by an organization called Roadcross. They got the 100'000 signatures for a constitutional amendment, and parliament proposed instead an amendment of article 90 of the law on road circulation (LCR in french). Was approved on 15.6.2012 by every member of the national council except SVP (132 to 59). No referendum, lost cause.

Leuenberger had nothing to do with it.

Sent from my Nexus 10 using Tapatalk

 

well, this is probably not the place for detailed Swiss history ...anyway, you are right that Roadcross was co-responsible for the specific amendment of the "Raserartikel" to the Via secura legislation. However, the entire Via secura project was a baby of Leuenberger, and if it hadn't been at this stage in 2012, there wouldn't have been the possibility for just adding rapidly an amendment, the soil for doing it wouldn't have been prepared. Saying that Leuenberger had nothing to do with it is wrong - it's a fruit of a tree that has been planted by Leuenberger.
http://www.roadcross.ch/downloads/Medienmitteilungen/111220_Medienmitteilung_via%20sicura.pdf

 

I voted for Via Sicura, and I would vote again for Via Sicura, this is not the point, I support the idea of the "Legislative". But with approx. 40k km driven per year as normal traffic participants and not in the mode as "sports cars enthusiasts" (I don't like your definition of sports cars enthusiasts: "We, sports cars enthusiasts, demand implicitly variable speed limits based on our wise assessment of conditions/risks/skills", IMO a stupid elitist thinking) there are simply too many more than questionable actions of our friends in blue recognizable how they think they must push through this law, I criticize the "Executive".

With Via Sicure we created an instrument which is abused merciless to print money. The biggest cheaters in the entire game are the blue ones from the Executive! Sorry to say that, what they allow themselves under the guise of Via Sicura is moving often between ridiculous and super stupid and has in the reality absolute nothing to do with more road safety, absolute nothing! Therefore, zero tolerance with respect to these guys.

 

Hi,

I know this is the Swiss thread, but as I too have received speeding tickets from Switzerland, I think I can contribute a bit. I did joke about it to my Swiss friends when I got it, but they said it is dead serious.

The ticket was Sfr 35,- and it was from Stadtspolizei Zürich as I had accelerated (with a rental car, an Opel Meriva) from a left turn and hit 53km/h in a 50 zone. the ticket was for 51km/h as they stated a +/-2km/h error margin. Of course I wired it immediately. The rental company charged €50,- on my card for givin my contact details.

Fortunately no tickets (so far) from Switzerland with the 456 GT, but I did get some from Germany and Italy! Lets see if I got some from France after Le Mans Classic (Burgundy, Bordeaux and back) I did notice a couple of flashes on the way.

I plan to have that 51km/h ticket framed. Although it does not have a nice photo like you get from Germany.

Cheers,

Pekka T.
Fin.

Ps. In my home country there was a debate and a court case as the bigger speeding tickets (more than +15km/h too fast) are always tied to the incomes of the driver. So a millionaire who had sold a business got a speeding ticket that was almost €200.000 euros (IIRC) but it was later changed in court to be just a few tens of thousands euros.

 

Here is a picture of Marcel and his friends doing 193km/h instead of 100km/h on a German Autobahn. ->1263.50 Euro
Blitzerfoto vom Irschenberg: Dümmer als die Polizei erlaubt - FOCUS Online

 

How so ? It was never put on the ballot.

The point i am trying to make with Leuenberger is both formal and substantive.

Formally, there was a constitutional initiative, they gathered 100'000+ signatures, parliament proposed a counter project, approved it, and the initiative was withdrawn. The amendment of article 90 LCR is largely but not fully inspired from the Road Cross text. The point is that Federal Councilman Leuenberger cannot and did not legislate. The bill was voted by the MPs, on their own, as a legislative body. So if you want to blame someone about the effect, blame the PS/SP, CVP/PDC and FDP/PLR, they all voted in favor of Via Sicura. The SVP/UDC postured by voting no, knowing their vote would have no consequence. No referendum, not a peep.

Link to the actual initiative: https://www.admin.ch/ch/f/pore/vi/vis384t.html
Link to the vote roll: http://www.asphalte.ch/pic/Vote-Final-Via-Sicura-Conseil-National.pdf

Which brings us to the substantive part: the law was voted because the measure is popular. The people want extreme severity for Raser/chauffards. Read the regional press clippings. Nobody has sympathy for the 5 "rich" dudes who got caught. Why is there such an autophobic sentiment, which causes such a law to be on the books and thoroughly applied in some cantons ? Because that's what the vast majority of people want. Why ? I think it is because of aggressive behaviors on the road.

And yes, @Fennicus, there is an undercurrent to tie fines to income, the finnish way. That's already the case with more severe offenses. We should be careful when we make light of affordable speeding tickets.

 

Drive fast in Germany and slow in Switzerland.

 

...it was a pleasure to park my car right next to your beautiful F12!
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On the way home I did 284 km/h for maybe one minute but then there was a Trabbi in the way. Oh well, such is life. That was in Germany, not in Switzerland, of course.

Marcel Massini

 

Rosso Mugello suits the 599 very well. Congratulations.

Marcel Massini
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Nice cars!

 

The next tour of the Ferrari Drivers Club (FDC) will be on Sunday, September 25th. See more information in the PDF file below.

I already asked the FDC-members. Anybody else wanting to join us?

Markus
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...Nice pic, thanks!
You also drove some laps on the track as I remember.
How is your feedback?
I felt the weight of the car compared to my Modena.
But it was a nice experience although the tyres went badly within 6 laps....


@Elsi

I'm unfortunately on vacation. Will try to join next time.

 

No, I didn't drive it on the track.
Must have been somebody else. There were several dark blue and black F12's in Hockenheim.
You cannot compare a Modena with a 599, totally different animals.
And yes, of course, a 599 has a phat ass. But that is the chocolate side of it (visually).
Here is my former #166676.

Marcel Massini
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Beauty...blu pozzi as well?
I really like this color...Very elegant. Fits also on my Modena with its cuoio interior 😉

 

👏👏 well done, was hoping to see 300++

 

Yes, Blu Pozzi with Cuoio as well.

Marcel Massini
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So was I, but then came that Trabbi..........

Marcel Massini