On the contrary. You have simply out-qualified a slower car, which is nothing more than a time trial in clear air ! Race craft and overtaking is a different game altogether. Some drivers have it, others do not For those who are yet to enter the real and smelly world of wheel-to-wheel racing, Carroll Smith's book is a worthwhile investment: Drive To Win.
Not true at all. There is a lot more strategy that goes into qualifying. Not to mention, they started just behind you, why are they a whole lap down? Because they lost the pace in the race - not qualifying. LOL - Ok, let's add every top driver in F1 to the list then since every one of them has struggled with back markers this year at some point. There are actually several racers here that don't agree with you - from various periods of racing.
i.e. beaten. IMO when a driver approaches that is trying to get a meaningful place, do the gentlemanly thing and move over without interrupting any of them. The battle for 15th is not very important. If a driver is coming through with a 30 second lead or whatever, and sees 2 drivers battling for place 16, he'll be more understanding...but one defending the lead or trying to get a podium but repeatedly being blocked by backmarkers has nothing to do with overtaking or not. Since you race, you should know that you can't just overtake anywhere, even in much faster cars. Waiting half a lap or more to TRY and get a meaningful overtake in has nothing to do with real racing. Like I said, I don't race real cars yet but do race sims. Wouldn't this piss you off? http://youtu.be/HKBNMNZLZRM?t=437 The backmarker cutting the track was at least a lap down, and gets VERY clear blue flags. Cuts the chicane but instead of moving over or simply take the run off, he acts like he's racing. This time it worked out for me but there have been times it hasn't. Now imagine this several times a race, but you're racing for a meaningful place in formula 1.
+1 In endurance, during a 12 or 24 hours race, it's not uncommon to see cars unlaping themselves after having been previously overtaken (Offroad excursion, lengthy repairs in the pit, slower team member, etc..... But in F1, it's hardly the case; backmarkers are drivers who have fallen at the bottom of the ranking because they are too slow.
+1 That's why they could be eliminated from the race; not to interfere with other people's ding dong.
That's the thing. They have no place spoiling other people's race because they are too slow to participate in it. In F1, a driver who is about to be passed by the leader has no chance to climb back on the leaderboard, so why is it still allowed to drag his car on the track
I've never been pi$$ed off by a back marker who kept his foot in. Always enjoyed the psychological challenge of passing a slower car
Perhaps this is your view because you race in the series you do. No offence intended, just your mindset is fun intended.
In total honesty I do not believe you really mean this. Lets say you are coming second, having a fantastic multi-lap battle with the leader of the race. Your adrenaline is pumping and this is what racing is all about. Then you both come up to back markers, drivers/cars that are so slow you guys have put a whole lap on them. The guy leading gets through cleanly but you get hindered by a back marker who then decides he wants to "battle with you". You end up loosing 10 seconds to the guy leading and that great battle and great race and potential win has been lost. You are now battling with a nob, somebody way below your ability and simply just holding you up. Even worst the guy running third is now right behind you ... Think about it. Again I believe you are arguing for the sake of arguing but you surely cannot really agree with what you are saying, not as a racer, not as somebody who likes to challenge themselves, etc. Lastly, for those that wrongly think F1 is unique. The rules and flags for motor racing cover all track racing. F1 is just another track series. The blue, yellow, green, yellow and red, etc. flags were not invented for F1 but for all track racing. Best Pete
Lapped drivers piss me off even in computer simulators. I think that the need of blue flags is out of discussion.
In Indycar there is a big chance to come back though. So this is not universal is all I would highlight. There are still positions to be fought for and experienced to be gained. I like the outside the box thinking, but I would not eliminate them. Now the awful Manors last year that weren't even the current spec cars and got lapped twice or maybe more at some tracks? That was a joke. They do need to stick to cars within a percentage of the pace as the rules state.
Really? With P2 on your ass and the race on the line, you thought, "oh good thing P20 is racing me right now"? If true, more power to you but you lack the mentality of an F1 driver or any professional who is serious about winning in Motorsports.
Like I said (although I didn't make myself clear perhaps), eliminating backmarkers would only be applicable in F1, on long tracks, and short distance races like GPs. Yes, Indy is one of those races where you can come back in the lead having been one lap down: it's a relatively short track (2.5 mile), and a very long race. Jacques Villeneuve won Indy 500 having been 1 lap down at some point, I believe. You hardly ever see a lapped car coming back in F1, and it's more likely to trail and be overtaken by 2/3 of the field, and sometimes, several times by the leaders. A car that is 2 laps down in F1 should be removed from the race, IMO.
I've been running in the SCCA for the past 20 years in small bore formula cars, and it's unacceptable for back markers who are getting lapped to try and race those who are doing the lapping. They're lapping you for a reason and using your mirrors and getting off the racing line without slowing the leaders is the proper technique. I've had cars that are 3-4 laps down try to race with me and I've never intentionally tried to hold anyone else up who are lapping me as it's not very cool!!
Gotcha. I would still be against for the record because young drivers need seat time in crap cars. I meant all of Indycar, not just the 500. The way they open and close the pits etc. You can come back and win races with luck.
Yes, even for amateur races, I would expect a certain degree of proficiency and cars of the same lap speed, more or less. As for people who need some laps under their belt to gain experience and get up to speed, I suspect more private testing or even track days are more appropriate than races.
It really depends on the series and who runs it of course. Some of the best racing in the US is amateur racing, but the field and management can run the gamut. Yes and no IMHO. More testing in F1 - yes please! I would give up a part of the field if there was more testing for young drivers. However, there are some things you can only learn being uncomfortably close fighting for position/pace with someone that wants to be ahead of you. So practice only goes so far - especially in aero cars like these. But you have to ask yourself - why in the world is qualifying pace so far off race pace in F1? Why not let the back of the grid burn more fuel at a time penalty or some other arbitrary thing so they can compete on some level? Plus, you can be lapped for mechanicals etc, and still have the pace to make up places after repairs, etc. So I don't think it can be some blanket rule like that. Safety cars happen also, so there are plenty of reasons to keep fighting.
Racing is all about self challenge. There is plenty of challenge available in passing a slower car. The FFC is a fantastic series. Fantastic cars with real characters, but no spoon-feeding. Spoon-feeding is one of the reasons F1 is losing it's appeal to me.
Nope. Just someone with a different experience and framing than you. That's what these boards are for.
