348 ts idle issue | FerrariChat

348 ts idle issue

Discussion in '348/355' started by snowsports1, Dec 1, 2016.

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  1. snowsports1

    snowsports1 Formula Junior

    Jan 31, 2013
    918
    UK
    Full Name:
    Brian
    Hi my new 348 has an idle issue whether cold or hot. It hunts, seems to be generally idling a bit fast and it's missing occasionally at idle, i have also noticed the water temperature gauge seems to stay lower than I expected and it even seemed to be getting colder as I was driving it! I have read discussions about this being caused by faulty temperature sensors, does that sound probable? does the gauge share the water temperature sensor with the ecus? Thanks really enjoying the 348 otherwise!


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  2. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,613
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    After full warm up coolant temp should be consistently above 84ºC. Cold coolant temp, and even colder coolant temp while drive = bad thermostat. Here is the DIY t-stat removal http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/technical-q/385608-348-thermostat-removal.html

    As for the hunting at idle try this:

    1) Disconnect the battery, let car sit overnight.
    Reconnect battery in the morning when engine is cold
    Let engine idle with all accessories turns off, do not touch throttle
    what at least 15 minutes, or until fans come on
    take car for 30 minute drive

    2) Check the resistance of the throttle position sensors http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/technical-q/453969-348-throttle-position-sensor-adjustment.html

    3) Check all vacuum lines to make sure they are not leaking and properly attached

    4) Clean out idle air control valves http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355-sponsored-bradan/376281-idle-control-valve-fix-sort.html

    5) Check resistant of Mass Air flow sensors http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/technical-q/20378-mass-air-flow-sensor-adjustment.html and http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355-sponsored-bradan/167575-348-maf-adjustment.html#post137074650

    6) Check crank position sensors http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/348-355-sponsored-bradan/236698-kia-fiat-crank-position-sensors-cps-work-348-a.html

    7) check coolant temp sensors
     
  3. ///Mike

    ///Mike F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2003
    6,097
    Bugtussle
    It's possible that the thermostat is stuck open, causing the engine to run cooler than it should. But that may not be the cause of the idle issue. You didn't mention trouble codes-- are there any stored on either ECU?

    I would tend to suspect plugs and/or plug wires first if there aren't any codes stored, but there are a number of potential causes.
     
  4. cmnho

    cmnho Karting

    Jan 4, 2006
    166
    Singapore
    Full Name:
    CM
    If what Ernie and Mike have suggested do not work, check the fuel pressure regulators as well (it comes in a pair). I had a hunting issue at idle as well and tried everything, including what Ernie has suggested. To no avail.

    Finally, my mechanic found the issue to be a leaking fuel pressure regulator. Changed them and the hunting problem went away. One more thing, the original Ferrari fuel pressure regulators are very expensive. It's a standard part that is used in other cars. Got it for about USD 70-80. The original part costs about 3-4 times more.
     
  5. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
    U.S.A.
    Full Name:
    goth
    In addition to what was mentioned above ..... verify all vacuum hoses are in good shape and in place. Also check your throttle adjustments are in sync.
     
  6. 4rePhill

    4rePhill F1 Veteran

    Oct 18, 2009
    8,246
    Worcester, England
    Full Name:
    Phill J
    How fast is the idle speed?

    The reason for asking is because when it comes to the idle speed, even once fully warmed up these cars idle faster than most everyday cars.

    My BMW once fully warmed up idles @ 600rpm, My 348 on the other hand, under the same conditions, idles @ 1050rpm as standard (Ferrari specifies the warm idle to be 950rpm + or - 100rpm).

    When I first got the car, it seemed as though the Idle speed was incorrect as the engine seemed to be racing at idle, but then I found out it was as it should be and I've got used to it (saying that though, when I'm sat stationary in traffic in the middle of a city with pedestrians around, I do still become a bit self-aware of the fast idle speed!)
     
  7. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,613
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    Mine idles right around 950
     
  8. 4rePhill

    4rePhill F1 Veteran

    Oct 18, 2009
    8,246
    Worcester, England
    Full Name:
    Phill J
    As other threads on idle speeds have shown, they vary all over the place between 850~1100rpm - There doesn't seem to be a single standard setting for all cars, in the way that you tend to find on other mainstream cars such as BMW's.

    When you're not used to the cars, they do sound as if the idle has been set too fast, but it is normal.

    The OP's car might have an even higher idle than normal due to having an issue (amongst others), but I just thought it would be a good idea to make them aware that these cars do idle comparatively high normally.

    (It would be interesting to hear just how high the OP's car is idling).
     
  9. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,613
    The Brickyard
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    I have found that it is important to keep the throttle bodies balanced. You can have one throttle body with the bypass/bleed screw open more than the other. That can cause the idle to hunt because one side will want to idle lower/higher than the other. Especially since the f119 is run with two separate ECUs.
     
  10. snowsports1

    snowsports1 Formula Junior

    Jan 31, 2013
    918
    UK
    Full Name:
    Brian
    Thanks guys I haven't had a chance to do these checks yet but have noticed the hunting only occurs when warm. Cold is ok, I haven't got the engine really hot yet. The idle is 1000 rpm but although that seemed high having read the other posts maybe that's ok.


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  11. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
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    goth
    How old are the o2 sensors? Do they have the external ground wire?
     
  12. snowsports1

    snowsports1 Formula Junior

    Jan 31, 2013
    918
    UK
    Full Name:
    Brian
    Hi pretty old I have only just bought the car but it's been laid up since 2006, just recommissioning it now


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  13. gothspeed

    gothspeed F1 World Champ

    May 26, 2006
    10,244
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    goth
    Was the old fuel flushed out and injectors cleaned yet? ....glad to hear this car will be back on the road where it belongs ... :)
     
  14. 4rePhill

    4rePhill F1 Veteran

    Oct 18, 2009
    8,246
    Worcester, England
    Full Name:
    Phill J
    Yes - @ 1000 rpm is just about spot on!

    (As I have posted, when I first had My 348 the cold idle seemed too high, and like you I had concerns, but on checking on the internet and contacting The Ferrari Centre who sold Me the car, I was reassured that it was correct and normal).
     
  15. dapper

    dapper Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2003
    711
    Bristol, UK
    Full Name:
    Dave
    #15 dapper, Dec 5, 2016
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2016
    If laid up that long get all traces of old fuel out and fit a new pair of fuel filters soonest. Also, long shot but worth thinking about, rubber components in the fuel tank breaking down, so fine debris. Plus one or more injectors gummed up?
     
  16. Gatorguy

    Gatorguy Rookie

    Apr 16, 2021
    6
    Full Name:
    Matt potasky
    Just wanted to chime in and say thanks to Ernie. This thread helped me find that it was the throttle position sensor and now it’s back to golden.
     

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