Odometer Rollback Scandal

No way to know exactly what is going on. My thought is that the roll back was done on the LaFerrari. I don't believe that a roll back on a Ferrari common makes sense to anyone. If you roll back a 458, it may increase the sales price 10k or so. If you roll back a LaFerrari it could be 500k or more. It takes a great customer and a great relationship to get a LaFerrari. Even if you bought 20 new Ferrari's of the garden variety, you will not get one. These are people that the factory knows and who are the very top dogs. If a owner of one of these cars is close buddies with the factory and drove the LaFerrari a lot and wanted to lower the milage, there is a way. Let the evidence come out and the chips fall where they fall.
I think most people believe Ferrari has told a few tales about production numbers on limited models. If they make 400 16M's but each is not numbered as , for example, 20/400, then they can produce 425 and put a plate on all of them that says one of 400. No number. Even Harley puts a number on limited models. You have 301 of 400 for example.
Bud has always been a straight shooter to me and I believe him to be one of the good ones. I'm sure that Bud or any one else in his shoes knows what he is dealing with. I didn't think Bud was sueing the LaFerrari owner but named him as part of the case and evidence.
I guess I am lucky to get a 488 and have no hope of ever being offered one of the supercars. This is just the system. Maybe there are a few of these super customers on this site but for sure most of us even with a spare 2 mil for a car will never get offered one. Ferrari wants these people to own these super cars and not just anyone.

 

There should absolutely be no surprise that a dealer can reset the mileage on any car especially now with them being cumputerized . The thing that should keep them from doing so is it is against the law. I will say that on one of my analog Ferraris it needed a new speedometer and the Ferrari dealer sent the old and the new speedometer to a certification center to show that it would come back with a certificate showing it was set to the same milaege ... They did that because they said that is the law...It made sense to me and I was fine with the delay.
I guess it comes down to a mechanic being willing to accept payment to break the law
and it could have been a lot of money.. we can only hope that all the dealers are this honest.
because it is as simple as ordering a new speedometer ..if the old one was "broken"

 

As someone who has known Bud Root for a very long time, I take offense at the snarky comments people who have never met the man have posted, and the notion that a potential scandal of this magnitude is nothing more than a "low level fight between management and a salesman" is naïve. Fifteen years ago, the top salespeople at virtually every Ferrari dealership in America were old hands, who knew a great deal about the cars, the company and taking ethical care of valuable customers. That changed when SpA and FNA decided to capitalize on their brand, forcing Maserati, Classiche, warranties, financing and resale prohibitions down the clients' throats. Deeply-committed individual dealers were systematically replaced with corporate heavy-hitters who absorbed numerous stores and hired inexperienced young salespeople who had no background, but were willing to play by the new rules. Men like Bud Root are a vanishing breed (I could name about a dozen more, but don't want to cause them discomfort) and the Ferrari clientele will miss them, when their new 'manager' can't explain how their cars' engineering works, but can put on a nice 'event.' Let's spin an earlier comment a different way: An apparently established customer of Palm Beach Ferrari and Bud's, found his new dealership contact unable to handle the order of his new car, so he cancelled the purchase--costing the dealership a half-million-dollar sale. Nepotism is always ugly, especially when tenure, experience and dedication is brushed away in favor of it. Do dealerships help clients minimize taxes? Of course, just like any financial advisor does and it's been going on forever. If the 'advice' steps over a line, that's another story. Can Ferrari's software alter mileage? Sure--it's been able to do that for eight years that I know of, but the idea of 'zeroing' an odometer is silly. As another member commented, every new Ferrari arrives with 80-100 miles on it. The capability has occasional, legitimate uses, but could be abused. Some of the story was poorly researched (there is an elevator to the second floor in Palm Beach Ferrari), but there's enough stink in the air that a good look is in order. Like it or not, it's a different world with Ferrari these days.

 

The article reads more like a tale of an opportunistic owner, an unscrupulous mechanic, a disgruntled ex-employee and a local dealer with a libido based business model.

All non stories in my view.

Factory involvement at the highest level?? That part is called 'Click Bait.' Without Click Bait, fewer would've read it all.

 

While I agree with the observation that this is about money and a settlement....I'm not sure that Florida State Attorney General is going to give the odometer rollback a pass. It has all the makings of a perfect storm combining politics/rich people/breaking the law. Politicians love to make their headlines and this one could get more attention if the dealership records or Ferrari's records are subpoenaed. Imagine if such a list was made public....


Florida law... 3rd Degree Felony .....not to exceed 5 years in jail. I'm struggling to see how any dealer could reset the odometer without violating it. Maybe you could get away with it on a brand new car but a car that has been titled and driven.....I just don't see a credible defense. Beyond the jail time....the worst part is they can seize and sell the car.

319.35 Unlawful acts in connection with motor vehicle odometer readings; penalties.—

(1)(a) 
It is unlawful for any person knowingly to tamper with, adjust, alter, set back, disconnect, or fail to connect an odometer of a motor vehicle, or to cause any of the foregoing to occur to an odometer of a motor vehicle, so as to reflect a lower mileage than the motor vehicle has actually been driven, or to supply any written odometer statement knowing such statement to be false or based on mileage figures reflected by an odometer that has been tampered with or altered, except as hereinafter provided. It is unlawful for any person to knowingly bring into this state a motor vehicle which has an odometer that has been illegally altered.

(b) It is unlawful for any person to knowingly provide false information on the odometer readings required pursuant to ss. 319.23(3) and 320.02(2)(b).

(c) It is unlawful for any person to knowingly possess, sell, or offer for sale, conceal, or dispose of in this state a motor vehicle with an odometer that has been tampered with so as to reflect a lower mileage than the motor vehicle has actually been driven, except as provided in paragraph (2)(a) and subsection (3).

(2)(a) This section does not prevent the service, repair, or replacement of an odometer if the mileage indicated thereon remains the same as before the service, repair, or replacement. If the odometer is incapable of registering the same mileage as before such service, repair, or replacement, the odometer must be adjusted to read zero and a notice in writing must be attached to the door frame of the vehicle by the owner or his or her agent specifying the mileage prior to repair or replacement of the odometer and the date on which it was repaired or replaced.
(b) A person may not fail to adjust an odometer or affix a notice regarding such adjustment as required by paragraph (a).
(c) A person may not, with intent to defraud, remove or alter any notice affixed to a motor vehicle under paragraph (a).

(3) Any motor vehicle with an odometer that has been tampered with so as to reflect a lower mileage than the motor vehicle has actually been driven may not be knowingly operated on the streets and highways of the state in such condition unless the certificate of title and registration certificate of the vehicle have been conspicuously stamped so as to indicate the displayed mileage is inaccurate and written notice has been placed on the vehicle as described in paragraph (2)(a).

(4) If any person, with intent to defraud, possesses, sells, or offers to sell any motor vehicle with an odometer that has been illegally adjusted, altered, set back, or tampered with so as to reflect a lower mileage than the vehicle has actually been driven, such motor vehicle is contraband and is subject to seizure and forfeiture by a law enforcement agency or the department pursuant to ss. 932.701-932.704.

(5) Any person who intentionally violates the provisions of this section is guilty of a felony of the third degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082, s. 775.083, or s. 775.084.

 

Here is how you tweak the mileage on a VW-defeating German engineering no less. Watch out guys. I am always amazed to see how many really low mileage 3 and 4 year old cars there are at Ferrari dealerships.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11MtfMqg4ko

J

 

Anyone who thinks the odometer on a modern car, including Ferrari's can't be "corrected" is naive.

This is simply an observation from a technical perspective and is not a comment about any specific matter.

M

 

Here is my dumb Ferrari question of the week. (It sort of has to do with this thread.)

Let's say a car is totaled... and the only salvageable part is the VIN plate and a couple of other ancillary parts (which I've been told here that you can basically build a new car around this VIN plate and the new vehicle inherits the old vehicle's provenance.)

What happens to the mileage? Does the rebuilt car also inherit the old car's mileage? Do they set the odometer to the last known mileage of the totaled car? Or does it restart at zero?

 

Thank you for the sermon on good journalism. The Daily Mail article put this story into the broader public domain which the chickens, as you refer to us here, find interesting to discuss (or flap around in your language).

 

It's a pleasure. Here's a marginally better piece of journalism on the subject.

Former Ferrari salesman alleges odometer rollbacks

There are more where that came from. Hopefully there will be a few competent news outlets on the case now, so we can discover some more facts and context. Although as usual any journalist working on the story will probably find the most informed people on this board. (As well as the others..)

 

From my reading of the Florida statutes, the intent behind the law is disclosure. I would think in the scenario you described, you would need to disclose the facts around the salvage and creation of a rebuilt vehicle with any odometer reading you choose. You would cross the line if you represented said vehicle without the proper disclosure. They did a decent job of crafting the law in Florida trying to address Seller fraud.

 

And here's an example of proper reporting on an actual automotive scandal.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/27/business/takata-airbags-automakers-class-action.html?_r=0

 

Since this may become a legal matter, I thought I would share a picture of the Attorney General of Florida....Pam Bondi
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that reminds me of this F12>
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2003 Ferrari Enzo Stock # 4594 for sale near Costa Mesa, CA | CA Ferrari Dealer

 

I've got a little side job for her....

 

You've tried to make this point at least 4 times in this thread, yet the masses don't seem to want to understand.

Brian, you know more than myself (and also more than anyone around here) that people will believe what they want to believe, and they will cherry-pick what they want to believe....look no further than the cambelt discussions - no matter how many times you tell someone, they will continue to pepper the members with questions until they get the answer they want (which is "It's okay to drive 20 years without dropping your engine to change the cambelt").

 

It seems that the Factory needs to approve any logon from the DEIS tool. But does it need to approve everything that is done once the tool is logged on?
If yes, then someone as the factory knew that one or some Ferraris were having their Odos rolled back.
And if they knew, did they know the real reason or were they told some story to make it legal to be adjusted.

I agree that it only makes sense $$$ wise to do so on the Laferrari/599SA/GTO/458SA (and i guess Enzos).

 

Here is another that gives a little more clarity: Report: Ferrari has device to roll back odometers to 0 | Fox News

 

This is a great example of one that should probably arouse suspicion. 140 miles in 13+ yrs.......really?

J

 

Is 10 miles a year so unbelievable

Recently serviced in the S Florida area.

 

For collectors, no.

 

The story here is that a salesman is accusing a rich guy (Sara Lee CEO) of doing an odometer rollback on a LaFerrari.

That, and only that, should be the story.

The rest of it is pure sensationalism - especially the fact that Ferrari has the power to do this - every manufacturer could technically do this - (resetting to zero) - and they could for years by simply replacing the odometer or DME.

 

Is that the Malibu "Dietrich" car?

 

I reckon the Ferris Bueller method doesn't work any more.