Slight steering wheel shimmy above 80mph? | FerrariChat

Slight steering wheel shimmy above 80mph?

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by EricJF, Apr 13, 2017.

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  1. EricJF

    EricJF Rookie

    Aug 3, 2015
    23
    Manhattan, NY
    Full Name:
    Eric Friedman
    Greetings,

    I have an '88 triple black TR with 33K miles, in generally excellent condition. One thing I've noticed is that when I go past 80mph, the steering wheel starts to shimmy clockwise-counterclockwise at a high frequency. Just a few mm arc of rotation vibration, it feels.

    I've had the tires/wheels re-balanced twice, which helped a bit, but it makes me nervous to have the wheel be shimmying like that well-short of the car's high-speed potential.

    Does anyone have any ideas about what else besides an unbalanced front wheel might cause the steering wheel to shimmy at higher speeds? Is this normal?

    Thanks,
    Eric
     
  2. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Sep 3, 2002
    6,411
    Toronto / SoCal
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    Rob C.
    Look for a tire that is out of round. The tire shop really should check for this but few do as the wheel will balance even out of round.

    I can only assume that your car sat for a while and this can cause the tires to flat spot. Some driving will normally bring the tires back but if they are old and hard they may never return.

    Outside of that you will want to make sure the suspension is all ok but what you describe is almost always something rotating like wheels, brakes, or even drive shafts.
     
  3. EricJF

    EricJF Rookie

    Aug 3, 2015
    23
    Manhattan, NY
    Full Name:
    Eric Friedman
    Thanks Rob for the quick reply. The car's going in for an oil service and check-up soon (JSS Performance in Long Island, NY), and I'll ask if they can examine these components.

    The tires are only two years old, and have perhaps 2K miles on them...so indeed the car does a lot of sitting. I don't feel any rotational steering vibration though until 80 mph.
     
  4. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
    8,929
    southwest germany and thailand
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    romano schwabel
    may I read it right? 80 mph, not km/h?
    if miles then it is not a question of balancing the wheels. it is more from standing long time with low air pressure.
    you may test some: raise the pressure up to 50 to 55 psi ans test again, but don´t drive too long and avoid hard braking.
    what happens when you go faster? getting this vibrations more and then less again or it is getting always more so that you may get afraid?
     
  5. EricJF

    EricJF Rookie

    Aug 3, 2015
    23
    Manhattan, NY
    Full Name:
    Eric Friedman
    The steering wheel vibrations start at 80mph, correct.

    I'll have to see if the vibration goes down after a couple of hours of driving. It's noticeable after at least an hour of mixed driving...if that suggests it's NOT flat spots on the tire.

    I've never had the car north of 110mph...the vibrations don't get worse above 80mph, but I do get nervous that something will fail or wear out quickly due to them.
     
  6. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,095
    Austin TX
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    Brian Crall
    As already said it can be a bent wheel but it can also be a bad tire. No mention made of the brand. Some do this more often than others. Big high volume tire shops are not always the best place to resolve this. You want someone who has good equipment to measure run out both axially and radially and has a Hunter road force balancer.

    Take the car to a steak house, not a hamburger stand.
     
  7. kartboy1234

    kartboy1234 Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2014
    694
    Palos Verdes, CA
    Full Name:
    Michael L
    I would bet on a bent wheel. I get some vibration starting at 80. The tire store showed me that the wheel was slightly bent while in the balancing machine.
     
  8. rpissm

    rpissm Formula 3

    Aug 11, 2013
    1,620
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Full Name:
    Joe
    What about a bad tie rod end? Or sticking brake rotor?
     
  9. qwazipsycho

    qwazipsycho Formula 3

    Oct 30, 2004
    1,176
    Utah
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    Scott
    #9 qwazipsycho, Apr 14, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
    Neither of those would exhibit that behavior at 80mph unless something else was wrong.

    Mine had a rim that was out of round and it did the same thing. The F shop tried to balance match it but it didn't resolve it. I bought new rims. Problem solved. No vibrations up to 150mph. I'm too chicken to go faster.
     
  10. Prova85

    Prova85 Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2003
    1,993
    So. Shore MA.
    Full Name:
    Kenny K
    Also get the front end off the ground. Grab wheels at 9:00 and 3:00 check for play by trying to rock the wheel back and forth. Do the same at 12:00 and 6:00. If any cluncking/play is felt or heard investigate the source.
     
  11. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    Sep 3, 2002
    6,411
    Toronto / SoCal
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    Rob C.
    I agree with taking the car to a knowledgeable professional but that pro does not always need to run a steak house. A few years back I had a Porsche with a vibration that I was sure was a tire issue. I took it to the Porsche dealer with their fancy road force machine, state of the art building, and factory trained techs. I was then charged over $250 to balance all 4 wheels and was assured that the car was road tested and all was ok. Needless to say I got 100 yards down the road and the car was the same. I pulled a U turn and demanded a refund which I got.

    I then went to a hole in the wall tire store where the guy REALLY knew what he was doing. Immediately he diagnosed an out of round tire and even processed a warranty claim with free replacement (it was a very odd manufacturing defect on a brand name tire). Total bill was $60 and the car was PERFECT.

    Getting back to the TR in question on this thread I lay convinced that the answer is in tires and wheels. A good inspection should reveal the issue but again I stress don't rely on the wheels 'balancing' to address you problem.
     
  12. EricJF

    EricJF Rookie

    Aug 3, 2015
    23
    Manhattan, NY
    Full Name:
    Eric Friedman
    Thanks everyone for your useful input. I'll show this thread to the mech who will inspect the car.
     
  13. lear60man

    lear60man Formula 3

    May 29, 2004
    1,829
    Los Angeles
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    Christian
    Get the wheels balanced under load IE 'Road balancing'. Next is to check if there is a bent rim. Both of which can be checked by a good shop. Im also betting on a bent rim.

    Question for the collective, can this be fixed? Or is this a replace only option.
     
  14. enzo52

    enzo52 Karting

    Aug 14, 2008
    131
    France, Paris
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    Depensadie Seraphin
  15. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
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    when you feel vibrations in the steering wheel it comes from the front axle
    if it comes from rear you feel it in your seat by your body
     
  16. lear60man

    lear60man Formula 3

    May 29, 2004
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    I agree with Turbojoe.
     
  17. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
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  18. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
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    Brian Crall

    I guess you completely miss the point.
     
  19. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    34,095
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    I strongly suggest against it. Don't tell a shoemaker how to make shoes. Just pick a good shoemaker.

    If you go to a business telling them how to do their job expect to get shown the door.
     
  20. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
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    I agree with brain 100%

    so go to your mechanic and sugegst some things what you have read here. you may ask on a stupid way abou thtings he has done and then you may bring some points you have read here in. but don´t give him a printout of this all here. otherwise you may be kicked out of his shop/garage if you don´t know him very well and have also friendship with him.

    I kicked more than one customer out of my garage when this one things he knows all better.

    one once told me in the internet one part is much cheaper than I would charge him. so I told him he may order it in the interent and just make an appointment also in the internet to put it in. about 5 weeks later he has been at me again and let the work with my material done. I never asked him what happened that he came back to me. but since then he never told me some about cheaper at other place or how I have to do something on his cars, only what has to be done
     

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