car design thread

Its gorgeous and not derivative

 

Supposed to be a joke... as in funny...

There was a company that put LS1 engines in Fieros, even did a Northstar.

 

In another area of FChat is a discussion relating to cars and technology overload. As I am one of those who want a return or at least an option of a very simple car, bereft of all "niceities" I have been working on a concept I called "Project X-Scape". As you can read-it is a very, very simple concept car. But with some pretty cleaver concepts built into/around it. Just figured I would take a very random and unscientific "poll" on what people think of the idea.


Program is called “Project X-Scape”. It is a very simple “step in” car concept. Salient points are:


1.) Low cost. $30-40K build cost for baseline vehicle.

2.) Low mass: 600kg (1320 lbs) for baseline vehicle.

3.) Very simple/low cost chassis. Steel tube chassis or alt ideas.

4.) No/little amenities.

5.) No doors.

6.) No roof.

7.) No dash structure. Steering wheel with digital dash built in. All basic controls (turn signals, horn, lights, etc.) built into steering wheel.

8.) Removeable steering wheel for security.

9.) I-Pod/I-Phone mount/plug in only for “entertainment center”

10.) Helmet to helmet talk/listen system. Wired.

11.) No adjustable seats. No seats per se. Molded glass shell for seat back with velcro mounted wet suit neoprene foam pads for comfort/support. Removable for cleaning.

12.) Entire interior waterproof. Scuttle plugs in floor. Remove and use hose and spray nozzle to clean interior. Like jetski in weatherability.

13.) Seatbacks attached to seat back bulkhead with hinge(s) by thighs and Q/R mounts around periphery. Allows access under/inside seat. Passenger side acts as “glovebox”. Cubbyholes/netting/plastic compartments in this side. Driver side contains fusebox, relays, fuel pumps (??) etc on this side.

14.) General footprint no bigger than Lotus Elise.

15.) Motorcycle powered. 1.3 liter Hayabusa or similar.

16.) Chain Drive to diff assembly. Similar to Stohr DSR.

17.) Need reverse mechanism that WORKS.

18.) Separate roll hoops behind each person. Separate bodywork enclosure around each hoop. Each enclosure hinged at low rear apex. Q/R mounts around enclosures. Enclosures open to plastic cubbyhole that is sized to hold helmet. So in car luggage for helmets.

19.) No other in car luggage space.

20.) Body shape very unusual and different from any current car. But not like X-Bow or Ariel Atom. Body shall have separate L/R front bumper/light housings. Likewise for rear.

21.) Also will have a separate windscreen-need varying styles-One wrap around of reasonable height, one wrap around at very low height and 2 separate screens. All easily removeable.

22.) Need to work out windshield wiper concepts for all of these. Motors on windscreens and wire/plug in concept?

23.) Engine/drivetrain will be visible from top and rear. Can be covered (or mostly covered) from side view.

24.) Look at running exhaust over top of engine.

25.) Tire/wheel sizes to be matched to car mass. So 16-17” dia. 6-7 inch width. 195-225 series widths.

26.) Fuel capacity around 10 gallons.

27.) Wheelbase somewhere around 2100-2300 mm

28.) Car plan area shape has distinct “wasp waisted” between front and rear tires.

29.) Basic car body will have mount points in wasp waisted area. Mount points are for removable hard luggage boxes/bins. One each side. So similar concept to motorcycle hard luggage. Luggage has handles so can be carried like travel luggage.

30.) Pushrod suspension front and rear.

31.) Rocker to have 2 distinct pickup points for pushrod and dampers.

32.) Car to have mount structure on rear to accept trailer hitch.

33.) Additional cost item to be a trailer. Trailer styled to match car styling. Will have large (full width and length) hinged cover panel. Interior of trailer will have a variety of removable blown plastic inserts-each designed for a specific purpose.

34.) Main purpose of trailer will be to carry 4 race tires, tools, jack, front and rear wings for car, etc race car components.

35.) Concept is to have basic car that can tow “race component” package behind it in trailer, personal gear in side luggage bins. At track car is jacked up, tires and brake pads swapped. Pickup points on dampers and pushrods swapped over. (Maybe Q/R mounts on these items?) Swapping points increases spring and damper rates and lowers car. Set up for race spec but keeps street spec available otherwise. Front L/R bumper/light housings removed. Protects bodywork and lights. Replace with L/R front wings. Remove rear bumper/light housings. Protects those items. Install rear nerf bar. Rear wing swapped from trailer to rear of car. (Rear wing should be carried externally on trailer as part of styling cue.)

36.) Bodywork fiberglass or SMC type plastic panels.

37.) Adjustable pedal package.

38.) Adjustable (height) steering wheel. Add/remove spacers for length.

39.) Car to be sold as a component/self build car. No attempt at making street legal as mfg.



Hope this gives a basic understanding of concept. Main issues right now are:



1.) Chassis design. Have 3 or 4 concepts. Not sure which is best/cheapest, etc. But always ready to look at other designs.

2.) Suspension corners: Would prefer to buy a production car package. At least upright, hub and brake package. Suspension arms are cheap enough we can make but if I can use production car bits there then all the better. Not sure what to use. Mazda Miata? Not overly impressed by those bits. Corvette bits way too expensive. Need or at least prefer upper/lower wishbone bits over Mac strut. Any suggestions welcomed.

3.) Steering rack: Can be an expensive part if not careful. Area with little research done.

4.) Body shape: Main issue. I have a concept in my head that is a derivative of a Hot Wheels car! (Really) Pictures are in the zipped file called “Original Concept Start”. My car is much smaller, with much smaller tires required and is an open top car. But I like the overall shape/direction gone with this toy. Another shape I like is the Pinifarina Maserati Birdcage concept car (Goggle it.). Again, way too big and too big tires and need open top car. But like the shape a lot. There is a certain similarity to the two cars. (At least I think so). One item I want is to have the upper 20-30% of the tire exposed from the top. So say from 11 to 1 O’Clock when viewed from side. Not worried about legality. We can insert a clear lexan bit as required. But want a bit of that open wheel feel/look for car in this area. Has not been done yet. And 100% opposite from nasty cycle fender designs.
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I wanna like it but just doesn't do it for me.

Shape is not wow and sitting a bit too high on its wheels--the impression of this accentuated by the flat top wheel openings that make it look like the car can't be lowered any more.

 

Some other shapes that are being played with. Ignore narrow tire!

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And some more:
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Brian you have the motor in the right place! Maybe more than 10 gal in the tank...
Interesting concept showcasing some innovative ideas. I like the quad exhaust to.
Forgot, the quoted weight is amazing, it could fly almost.

 

Nothing has been fixed yet on car-chassis, engine, suspension, etc. What you see are all 2d and 3d sketches of varying ideas.
But basic concept is maintained thru all of the options:

Low cost
no doors
MC engined
no roof
unique body shape
really a 4 wheel motorcycle like car.

 

Range is driven by size of center section round tube. It is main chassis member (gives me torsional rigidity) but making it bigger in dia makes car wider (hence heavier and more frontal area) . Making it longer adds car length and hence weight.

Range is driven by other car ranges I have looked at. 200-225-250 miles is the "sweet spot"

With a MC engine I should be in the 20 mpg range. So 10 gallons gets me 200 miles.

I do my homework!

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The 'engineer' is showing!

 

Giugiaro(s) at it again......
https://www.designboom.com/technology/techrules-ren-rs-supercar-02-19-2018/?utm_source=designboom+daily&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=techrules+grows+global
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BTW: BrianW; check out their powerplant! Interesting idea to incorporate into your design above?

 

I did a proposal for a gas turbine powered generator driving electric traction motors and charging up batteries for an LMP car 3-4 year ago. And I included a very clever power take off system that captured the high energy exhaust gas from the turbine in a way still not "discovered" by others.

Problem of course is ideas (even good ones) are worth nothing.... Need money to make world (and racing) go round.

 

Yes, agree. But also compared to the 'Vette, with its round wheel openings, it looks not as hunkered down.

 

Never was a big Arial fan.
Hate "cycle" fenders on cars. Shows a lack of thought on how to solve that design issue. "Lazy"
And always thought car lacked an "integrated look". But very much a B2B type car. And for that I can applaud the effort. And more importantly-they have a car they are selling, versus me, who has nothing other than an idea. So need to respect what they have done and I haven't!

As far as other cars that are what are similar to what I am after:

Lotus 2-Eleven: Still one of my fav cars.
Vuhl 05 I think a really nicely done, good looking car. Too bad so expensive!!
Elemental RP1 Another B2B car. Not as pretty (to me) as the Vuhl but not bad at all. (Better in person). But again-expensive!!

 

I really like that!

 

For sure, plus the design was ahead of it's time>

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Have you checked out Palatov? He's done quite a bit of what you're proposing for awhile now.
might be worth a look -
https://www.palatov.com/