The other day I drove an 812Superfast for about an hour... I will save you the reading: The 812 is not just a step above the F12b, it is a distinctive step. For the sake of discussion, it would be helpful to make some comparisons. Driving the 458 Italia and then the F12b back to back reveals the F12 feels faster than the 458 at almost all times. But now here comes the 488 GTB and it feels more potent than the F12 through the mid range. We will all have our opinions regarding atmospheric engines vs forced induction, but there is no denying each has its pros and one of the pros of forced induction is that mid range punch. The 488 GTB power is startling. It’s only at the top of the rev range where the F12 reasserts it’s superiority. I was really surprised the 488 makes the F12 mid range feel comparatively flat. And "flat" is not a word I ever thought I'd use when referring to the F12 power delivery! So then what does Ferrari do? Of course they have to restore the proper order. And the 812 does just that. I think the F12b is prettier but- my goodness- I didn’t think it possible for them to make such a marked improvement in the driving experience. The F12b is so good, its difficult to imagine they have really achieved such a new level with the 812. But they have. It's barely believable to me that I am writing these words: the 812Superfast just blows the F12berlinetta away. I know its a very common phrase, but it is accurate. It’s not quite the change from 599->F12 (as that was a whole platform); it feels not like F12 v1.5 but rather 2.0....... Two point "ohhhh my goodness"! Any slop in the F12 experience has been addressed. Going point by point as I can remember it. First there is the sound. It’s about half an octave higher in pitch. My sales guy says it sounds similar to the TDF when the flaps are open. The sound had more of a “siren” quality if that makes any sense. I would say it’s more raspy but I don’t think that does the quality of the sound justice. Its just fantastic. And the volume level is a little bit louder the F12 but it’s not so much more that I’d call it anti-social. It seems like it opens the flaps a bit earlier so you get more of the sound more of the time. Whether or not you think that is a good or bad thing depends on how discretely you wish to conduct your activities. The 812 sound quality is a 10- and I also think they got the volume level and when it opens up just right. It’s exactly what you’d want in a V12 super GT. Many had reported the ride is harder than the F12b. That is correct, but it's not quite the difference I was expecting. Maybe I misunderstood the reports. Its a little bit harder. It's still pretty comfortable, especially with the bumpy road mode button pressed. Please keep in mind I was driving someone else's car for this part. At sane speeds the handling doesn’t feel that much better than the F12 but maybe I need to drive my car again to be sure. The 4ws doesn’t really make itself felt, it just feels natural. Except on very tight radius turns, the car seems to tuck in to the turn a little quicker and with a little more verve. I’d say overall the cars handling is a little neater and better controlled than the F12b. The 812 feels a little more alert but at least to me it wasn’t a sea change. The power is a big step forward. You might think, gee the F12b is already really fast. And you would be right. And then you might think, well another about 70hp, that's nice but it can't feel THAT much faster? It must be apparent only at the top of the rev range where peak power lives. Not so. The difference is evident from what I can remember around 2000 RPM onward. Full throttle acceleration on to the highway caused me to simply exclaim “Holy ——“. This was pure honest reaction. A moment later I remarked: “wow that’s really fast!” And he just chuckled and said “superfast”! Indeed. Another 10. I am sure it is not "just" the extra power, it is the extra power plus the (I think ) ~6% shorter gears. From the drivers seat, under full throttle, it feels like they have another 120hp in this car vs the F12b. That is a pure opinion, but if you like a lot of power, this car will have you giggling any time you even tickle the go pedal. And the transmission is just what these DCT should be. It’s always fast. And it never jerks you around- yet especially in Race mode you feel the shifts. They impart the emotion of the best single clutch systems like in the 430 Scuderia (the Scud might be a bit more brutal). And in sport mode the shifts are still fast but smooth. The F12 sometimes can be a little clunky and even take a little too long to go into gear. Not so here. Simply put the gearbox is without fault. Another 10. Steering doesn’t feel quite as “organic” as the F12. But its close. It is just a tad bit more remote than the F12. It’s not so much as a step backward as just a tiny bit of compromise - only by comparison- I bet most won’t even notice. And this is clearly to get the benefits of the electric steering system. I’d say if the steering on the F12b is a 9/10 then this is an 8.5/10. And again, maybe with more familiarity, I might edge that score higher. Brakes. Fabulous. There seems to be more feel and they are just as strong (stronger?) as the F12b. I think they’ve finally sorted the sometimes touchy brake application you get with carbon material brakes. Another 10. Exterior. Purely subjective. I originally wrote "It's not beautiful but it is striking and different from the F12. It works." You know what, the more I look, the more I like! I think this car will grow on those of us who are unsure. Probably an 8/10 for me right now, but you might think its a 10 and we'd both be right. Its not a surprise to learn the car looks much better in person. I really like it. Interior. Again, much better in person. Materials are at least at the same level as the F12- somethings maybe they are even better. It looks, feels, and smells special. Everything works well and the new steering wheel is a nice step forward. I’d say 9/10. I remember when someone told me the F12 “murders” the 599. I love the 599, and I didn't believe that would be the case, but he was right. The 812 doesn’t quite murder the F12, but, from a driving perspective it definitely leaves it lying bloodied on the street.... I am really surprised as I was expecting an improvement. This is substantial step forward. The thing that keeps coming back to my mind is the drivetrain. The engine, transmission, e-diff, F1 trac and all the systems conspire to make 800hp feel natural and manageable with a soundtrack that makes you feel like a hero.
Nice write-up. And yet on the Fiorano Circuit, Wiki results show that the F12 is about one (1) second slower than the 812 on the lap. And the F12 is 3.5 seconds faster than the 599. So the 812 is definitely an improvement (as it better be) but the F12 is right there as well. When the successor to the 812 arrives with an even better lap time then we start this loop all over again.
Excellent write-up Jerry and a very objective and independent analysis of the 812 vs the F12 Berlinetta. It's extremely rewarding to see how Ferrari engineers, model after model, have that ability of improving further and further what seemed before to be already the state-of-the-art not improvable. I believe much of the technology which enables that to be done continuously is certainly coming from Formula 1 racing. No doubt Ferrari continuous being the absolute leader on the market segment of super GT road cars and the 812 is miles ahead from any car made by the competition. The only thing I regret about the 812 is the fact that despite having such a fabulous drive-train and performance has some exterior design aspects that I don't like but, obviously, that's not an issue at all because is just my personal taste.
Thanks everyone for your kind words. I figured you might appreciate the thoughts. Mario, if you drive an 812, I think you will almost be forced to look at it a little bit more favorably. The design really does work. I think the FDC under the leadership of Mr. Manzoni has done an excellent job across the board. Of course there will be those designs that one likes more than others. My theory is after the elegant beauty of the F12b, they wanted to go more aggressive with the 812SF.
Great write up Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts I wanted the 812 before it was released, when it was an abstraction. After the reveal, I felt a bit meh. Reading your impression has got me thinking again. I guess I really just need to drive one (easier said than done)
Great write-up - I was really interested in that. I have my 812 about 10 months away and I’m really looking forward to it. I did a TM and put a lot of focus on that. It’s easy to forget that the whole point is that the 812 is such a great car in the first place! Thanks for taking the time.
I appreciate the time to do the write-up and can feel your excitement! Still not sold on the looks though and it didn't get any better for me in person inside or out. Taking too long to grow on me but excited for others getting a brand new beastly V12. One of the best parts of life for sure.
What I can tell you, purely subjective, purely just 0ne man's opinion: it feels like it would be a greater advantage. And yes, for anyone who has an F12 and loves it, the 812 didn't instantly make your car totally obsolete, its just the latest one and it should be better. They've done it again! (I've been driving my F12 the past few days and I can reaffirm my report. The things that really stand out are 1- the brakes on the F12b don't feel as powerful; 2- the engine doesn't feel as powerful (Im working the F12b harder to gain the same sense of speed I had with the 812); 3- I would never call the handling of the F12b as "loose" but by comparison, it does feel just a little bit loose or not quite as tied down. ) Basically the 812 is even more of a sports car and the GTC4 is even more of a GT than the prior F12/FF pairing.
It's very clever how they have differentiated the 812 and Lusso more than the F12 and FF. Now you're back in your F12, have you noticed any ride quality differences? I have read conflicting comments. Some say the 812 is firmer, others the same as the F12. What is your opinion? I know a few PSI in tyre pressures can make a difference but hopefully fundamentally the ride of the 812 isn't too much firmer?
Just to add to the great write up, I have put some more miles on my 812 to add to input. The 812 is so well planted on the ground turns just seem to happen like watching F1 race cars make those short turns. As to ride quality, they are both great in my mind. I don't notice much of a difference in ride quality. The 812 does feel bigger than the F12. It may be due to the air vents on the hood that you see when driving. The 812 clearly pushes the RPM's faster and always wants to run. One big difference I have noticed is on the F12 when approaching a stop light and taking my foot off the gas, the car seems to almost immediately stop or in other words feels like the gas has shut off to the engine. On the 812, not at all. Still running to the stop light. On the 12 I can take my foot off the gas and the car would come to a complete stop after going forward for X number of yards, not true on the 812. More to come as the miles keep coming. I am glad I still have my F12 as both cars are just amazing.
Nice Gary! I love that you have both. I might end up in the same boat. The 812 is a little bigger than the F12 but I didn't think it felt bigger. I also enjoyed being able to see those air vents from the drivers seat- it helps you better get a sense of where the front wheels are. On the F12b you can use visible parts of the Aero Bridge but its not quite as obvious. Justin, my opinion on ride quality is the F12b hasn't changed either. As I remember it, the 812 does ride a little bit firmer. To try to explain that. Imagine the ride quality difference between sport mode and race mode on the F12. Now imagine a ½ step of that. No matter the mode, the 812 seems to ride that ½ step more firmly than the F12b. One important note: the 812 I drove was fitted with Pirelli PZero and my car is fitted with Michelin Pilot Super Sports. I prefer the Michelin tires- though the new Pirelli P Zero (not sure which version) did drive very well on the 812! I tend to prefer the Michelin ride quality. Historically, Pirelli PZero tend to ride a bit firmer. And that could be a contributor to the difference in ride quality. I think the important take away is they have really increased the sport factor with the 812, whilst any detonation in ride quality is minimal- it might even be negligible.
Jerry I hadn't yet the privilege of driving the 812 but your great report has increased substantially my desire of doing that and now is just a question of opportunity. Relatively to what you mentioned about the Pirellis Pzero and the MichelinPSS that's absolutely true. When I changed from the former to the latter on my F12b, I noticed straight away that the Pirellis were harder in all surfaces, and noisier as well, than the Michelin PSS which apart from feeling softer reduced the level of vibration transmitted by the chassis.
When a new Ferrari model substituted an old one normally the latter became obsolete and that was clearly the case with the 599 and the F12b. The fact that there are several owners keeping their f12b's despite of having ordered the 812 may be is a sign that the new car hasn't made the old one as obsolete as was expectable. I understand that because in a certain way both models are complementary and if I could I would put the 812 drive-train on the F12b body and then I could announce that I had the last Pininfarina Ferrari with the most powerful natural aspirated V12 ever made by the brand before hybrid took over.
