Why so many sellers of f1 360's calling them 6 speed manuals?

And yet another one not reading the post and getting the point. The point is, if a website only gives a seller the choice between manual and automatic, F1 owners are going to choose manual almost every time because it's not an automatic. Period.

 

I'm not even sure I understand the angst from the OP when all you have to do is look at the pictures to find out if it's a stick shift manual or an F1 manual.

 

Deceptive advertising. It makes search engines worthless.

 

I have no interest in getting into a F1 v stick debate. Don't care and the hour is late. The ONLY F360 I would buy is a stick. So, pretty please with a cherry on top, don't waste my time.

 

As above what is the purpose of even listing the transmission type? The "Auto" button by the reverse lever is usually a giveaway. But like many Ferrari owners who never read the owners manual, I'm sure many don't know that button is there to push. The key is, it is.

 

From a buyers point of view, I think the criteras for manual vs automatic should be connected to what the car can do and what the driver must do. It doesn't have to be connected to the technical details but to the driver experience.
Manual: you HAVE TO shift manually
Automatic: the car CAN shift automatically
These criterias would put a 360 with stick in the manual category (of course) and a 360 F1 in the automatic category. These criterias can even fit such strange specification as a Mondial Valeo where you have two pedals and a stick shift! Thats in the manual category since you need to shift manually. But the clutch is automatic.
I could see the benefit of a third category, "automated manual" but to be honest that's only needed where you have both the traditional type of automatic gearbox and the robotized manual availible in the same car model. The only one I know is the Maserati QP where both configurations of exists depending on model year.


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I may be mistaken, but it seems to me that few if any of the people who actually own and drive an F1 consider it an automatic transmission.

 

Cars.com does the same thing. Many of them are car DEALERS.

 

What’s the point of having search critera for what color it is or whether it’s a Honda or a Ferrari? You can just look at the pictures to find out what it is.

 

oh comon, not this again. it is what it is. It is an automated manual transmission, officially.

 

The problem is, when you’re in the market for a car that isn’t super common, like a TDF blue gated 360 with black roll bars, you set up your cars.com alert and EVERY SINGLE blue F1 that comes on the market for SIX MONTHS you have to click on and scroll to the very LAST PICTURE which is the one that shows the interior with no stick. I don’t care if they list them instead as “the faster transmission” and “the slower transmission”, I just want a way to set up the filters to what I want so I don’t waste hundreds of hours like I did last year looking at cars that aren’t what I’m looking for.

 

I kind of know the feeling... Most of my car 'shopping' is done on a site called auto scout 24 (here in Switzerland). And whilst many of the 360's (and 430's for that matter) are marked as "automatic", many are also marked as "manual".

From the website, you get to filter cars by criteria, and if you look at the gearbox type (translated from French in my case), it gives the following options:

Automatic Gearbox:
- Automatic
- Automatic sequential
- Automatic variable
- Automatic variable, sequential
- Manual automatic
Manual Gearbox:
- Manual
- Sequential manual

Ideally, what they should add (hey, maybe I'll send them a mail about it?), is to add an option under Manual Gearbox for "Boire manuelle robotisée", i.e. what the 360/430 has in the F1 package (a manual which is deployed as a sort of automated, and thus clutch pedal-less system).

It took me two years to find a 360 with a manual gearbox that fit my wishes (red chassis being one of them), and I constantly fell upon offers stating that it's a manual vehicle, until I looked at the pictures and saw that it's actually packing the F1 levers... It was annoying, but in the end, that's life.

I still look at this info on the site, and I still find many F1 packed cars marked as manual. There's no proper choice to be honest, but most important is to check the photos or to see the vehicle in person I guess :\

 

p.s. usually they use the wording "manual automatic" for the F1 packages, but as I mentioned above, sometimes they still state manual.

 

Agree totally

 

Wow, I got tired out just reading this thread, I never trust any listing, when I went searching for another Abarth manuals were listed as autos and autos as manuals.

 

I guess if you have nothing better to do and you have all the time in the world to waste, this would work out perfectly. As recent of a buyer as I am (~2 yrs) I can tell you from personal experience how frustrating and a waste of time it is to filter everything down to manual and have to spend hours sorting through pictures of cars that you have no interest in.

Exactly.

 

The CONCERN is not the seller's perspective or opinion. The CONCERN is the BUYER's perspective and opinion. That is the topic here.

Buyers don't care what sellers feel and their scientific (I mean mechanical) explanation about the powertrain.

All they care about is when they select "Manual" in their search filter / criteria, is they see a stick between the seats and not a lever.

Sellers should advertise their cars for the viewers (buyer) not for themselves. Nuff said.

 

Most are dealers use the same software to advertise their cars. You have 2 choices for transmission type. Automatic or standard. There is nothing left to choose from.

As old school as we are, manual, means three pedals. Requires your left foot to be involved in the operation of the car. No left foot..no go.

Automatic only needs the right foot to operate the car. Regardless of the fact it is technically a manual gearbox with clutch, you as the driver have almost zero input on how that clutch is modulated. It's all done through the tcu, and ecms talking to each other. Sure you can control slippage if you are very attentive, but not like in a true manual.

With that said, I have NEVER seen a real 3 pedal car with an automatic mode. Now..how would you guys classify a 458 etc..transmission? Manual or automatic? Its doesn't really have a clutch system as we know it.. to me a 458 as an automatic.

 

+1. We are talking about ads, not giving a tech dissertation. Buyers only want to distinguish sticks from the flappy paddles. Looking at ads for cars that have flappy paddles when you want a stick, just wastes buyers’ time and frustrates them. I know, because I wanted and bought a stick, but only after many wasted cycles looking at cars with F1s. And for those buyers really looking for an F1, they will overlook cars advertised as manuals, so you as a seller lose, too, by smugly listing your F1 car as a manual.


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Because you often have to click through several screens to see the pic showing the console. Sometimes there is no pic that shows definitively the view that reveals if it’s a stick or not. If you’re looking for a stick, it’s maddening and more of a waste of time than you’d think.


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EVERYTHING is manual (apparently). See the "manual" transmission below.. it has a "+" and "-" that lets you "manually" select gears.

When they rent a car in Europe with a stick and 3-pedals "Oh I don't know how to drive THAT kind of manual transmission.."
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Murciélagos are the worst in that respect because you do a seach and you’re like “ooh! These are only $150k now!” Then you click on the pictures and it’s flappy paddle, the gated ones start at like $300k and you go “I guess no Murciélago for me “

 

For the people who have posted that only a three pedal car should be called a manual, I agree with you. The point made about the buyer's perspective, I think, is the correct one. I had an F1 360 Spider that I sold a few years ago. I bought another 360 Spider this year and I wanted a three pedal car. I found myself opening up the files (on Autotrader) one at a time and looking at the interior pictures to see if there was a stick or not. Generally, the asking price told the tale but not always. So, to conclude, I would ask people that post a car for sale to stick with a manual description for three pedal cars only. My two cents.

 

Whether it's a stick shift or paddles, if it's not what you are looking for, move on to the next 360 ad. Not all salespersons are Ferrari enthusiasts and able to distinguish the diffrence in their ads. Don't sweat it...