Miura, the original supercar

Agreed with all, THJ has a beautiful P400S, Cremonini whom I have high regard for does great work, and from what I have seen from images alone, probably better than Polo Storico, at this point.

However, my posts were focused on refuting any suggestion that the clips on the sills should be showing, as it was incorrect to have suggested "that's how they are".

People read this stuff, next thing you know the uninitiated accept a notion that is not correct, the clips should not be showing, and why Cremonini left them showing is a matter of pure speculation to all us who were not involved in the project of 4000. That they can be easily corrected is obvious as has already been stated.

Thanks for the estimate on 4863.

 

It could be that work contracted directly with Cremonini with an unlimited budget is better than work sublet to them via Polo Storico with a fixed budget.

 

Clips, spacers, mounting hardware, whatever you want to call them, we are all talking about the same thing.

Sorry, but I have literally dozens of images of new & unmodified Miuras at the factory without these items showing, for example, here is a new 1971 P400S

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Early P400, spacers not showing, underscoring that this was a constant from the beginning of production

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The same is true at the end of Miura production.

All unmodified SVs I have seen (I have observed one or two) did not have the spacers showing as assembled when new

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I have some factory P400S production literature that clarifies the consistency with which Miuras from P400 to SV were built by the works without the spacers showing.

This is true from when they were assembled @ Bertone SpA's Grugliasco plant, to when they were mated with their drivetrains & running gear @ Sant Agata, to when they were delivered.

In my book, this is proven with independent period images on pages 21, 23, 24, 28, 39, 40, 41, 43, 44, 45, 79, 122, 138, 170, 217, 218, 261 & 266.

I would say quite conclusively, if you can see the spacers the sills are no longer in the position in which they were originally mounted, and the panel gap has increased allowing them to be seen. There could be many reasons for this, routine maintenance, accident repair, repainting of the sills & wheels, repainting of the whole car, restoration of whole the car etc.

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Lel. The spacers were always there, nobody is disputing that, and regardless of whether they were closer or further apart as production went along, the sills were correctly fitted so that the spacers did not show when the cars were new, that much is conclusively proven by period images.

Rather than painting the spacers black on a car that has had them fitted incorrect, why not do the job properly and finesse the sills so the gap closes and and the spacers cannot be seen? We have done this a number of times, it's really not that difficult.

 

Aside from period images proving that the cars were built with the sills fitted snugly to the body-line so the spacers cannot be seen, thankfully, people are beginning to realize that this is the way the cars were born, and, sill fitment shown on a P400, P400S and P400SV restored in recent times reflects this

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5060 - another recent restoration with correct sill fitment, as shown @ Lamborghini's Museo

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Not a valid conclusion, in fact the opposite is proven to be true in many cases, although thankfully, more & more people associated with Miuras nowadays realize that the sills should be flush with the body as they started off at the point of production, and are making the correction for the better.

I did a little checking on the 2 cars you posted images of as examples, I believe the first one is 4950, and the second one is 4407, and I am aware that neither car exists as it did when it left the factory, as far as the sills are concerned.

Apparently, 4950 was restored years ago in Turin by Salvatore Diamante, so we know the car was taken apart, and I note from images over the years that the sills have not been flush with the body, as your image illustrates.

I was personally involved in the discovery of 4407 @ 15 years ago from it's hiding place of 2 decades, and I can tell you when it emerged from it's place of resting, the sills were more flush with the body than they are today. In fact, images exist online showing it in Harald's care years ago with the sills flush, however, in recent years, the sills are no longer flush with a larger gap showing the spacers, for whatever reason.

Correct.

Correct.

 

Lel.

Any coach-builder (such as Cremonini or many others around the world) skilled at gapping the aluminum body panels of a car will have no problem setting the panel gaps of the Miura's front & rear clamshell and doors so they function without impeding the sills, with the latter snug to the body-line. That said, I understand that if someone unskilled tries to do this they might encounter some problems, and, there are many who are oblivious to what is correct, so they ignore this issue. Furthermore, there are those who simply don't care one way or another, and then, there are those who are simply misinformed. The notion that having the sills snug with the body-line will automatically result in paint damage is false, as many of us who have owned Miuras with snugged sills know it to be.

Again, the sills were correctly fitted so that the spacers did not show when the cars were new, that much is conclusively proven by period images, it's not subjective or a matter of opinion, it's a matter of fact, and on this point you are wrong. A car is a tangible mechanical object with specific dimensions and you can clearly see the way the vast majority of Miuras left the factory as is plain to see in images by anyone with their own eyes. We are not speaking of an issue subject to conjecture such as, say, the 'Hand of God' goal by Maradona in the 1986 World Cup.

Also, please bear in mind there are literally thousands of images in contemporary times that prove that after 40-50 years of maintenance, repairs, repainting or restorations, the sills can still be kept snug with the body-line. It's really not that difficult, and to be honest, whenever we see a Miura with the sills hanging down to expose the spacers, it is not a point in favor of either the car or owner.

Speaking from personal experience, perhaps I can be be forgiven for saying (yet again) that I personally owned five (5) Miuras, fully-restored 2 of them and refurbished 2 others, and on that basis I humbly submit that not only should the sills be snugged, it's relatively easy to make sure they are.

Correct.

By the way, did you watch the movie Titanic? This discussion reminds me of the band continuing to play whilst the ship was sinking, still, there was beautiful music to be heard.

Lel. I'm not sure what part of the irrefutable archived photographic evidence from the Miura production period 1967 - 1973 that you are not understanding. Okay, perhaps a handful of cars snuck out with the sills not perfect, but the vast majority were supplied as new cars with them snug. However, if you'd like to erroneously feel that the factory typically left gaps between sills and body-line, that's up to you, meanwhile the point of all these responses supported by photographic evidence is to prevent the uninitiated from being misled by erroneous information being espoused here, and I think the point is now well-made.

Furthermore, I am certain that most people connected with these cars today already know that the sills were snug to begin with, and should still be so.

Thank you Jim, you are correct.

 

Lel. If you have owned six Miuras, you should know better than most people that your assertion that they came from the factory with gaps in the sills allowing the spacers to be visible is incorrect, and to come on here and suggest otherwise is not helpful to the uninitiated. Yes, let's leave it at that, as the correct illustrative point has been adequately proven.

Yes, we know that early Miuras only have the Miura script, and this has been discussed in the thread previously. Quite exactly where in the P400 production the 'Lamborghini' script was added is unclear though, as there doesn't appear to be a factory declaration on this. This tended to happen at Sant Agata, as production went along badges were added, for example early Countach LP500S do not have the bull badge, but late ones do, and we are not sure exactly when the change occurred.