Ferrari “Puro” SUV announced

I may be unfair in the comparison to an FF or California but a 275GTB or 250 SWB is still way better looking to me than a 488 or F12. Do not get me wrong they are good looking cars as well but not timeless in design.
Just my opinion nothing more .
One of the other factors that goes along with making more cars is that when
they are more commonplace, they do not seem as special or unique.
No desire for further debate as just opinions and everyone has their own.

 

aesthetics and romanticism. often practicality is at direct odds with both.

the best flannel pajamas in the world may be fine for staying warm (and bought happily for such), but people do not dream of cozy fires and beautiful women in flannel.

but do we care if Victorias secret makes both lingerie and flannel pajamas?

should the brand dictate?

taking different brands, I know which one my wife and I would rather take for a road trip across the country... (not the 'suv')
Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

The thing that has allowed Porsche to keep making those hyper-cool 911 variants is the profit made from Cayennes and Macans.

 

Ach! We ageee!
if the hyper cool rare 911 variant driver sees a Porsche suv next to them does it ruin their driving experience? If so was it ever about the individual car they’re driving or about more than that.

 

In regards to uncompromising, hand made cars that aren't driven by marketing and stock prices I think they are. I agree about the engines and racing/F1 though. I won't get into how I think they should forego F1 for a factory Lemans/Sportscar effort.

IMO the most dangerous thing an automaker can do is to listen to the bean counters and focus groups when it comes to future product planning. Ask member John, a retired professional car designer, about focus groups. I sat through a few and it is complete, utter BS. They NEVER work. I understand the need for additional revenue but given the fact that they could use the same resources, time, and money to invest in a future product that is more in line with the brand's DNA makes more sense to me.

Trying to lure new buyers into the brand shouldn't come at the cost of changing the company's soul to accommodate them. If you do you'll end up having to keep coercing owners into getting an FF or California so that they can get in line for the next 488/whatever. They are forcing a situation where they either placate the "new" owners by changing the rest of their product line to appease them or they make their loyal customers bear the financial brunt by carrying the weak models to be "eligible" to buy the popular ones.

It will be interesting to see how this pans out. I think Ferrari is at a major crossroads for the future. It's fascinating to see how they will handle being profitable while maintaining their heritage and focus.

 

Is it safe to assume the FF/Lusso breadvan-like concept will be killed off in 2022? Not that we won't have a GT car, but it will be more in line in design with the traditional coupe the 612 was like. It seems the FUV will in part fill that void, so there's no need to continue what we have now.

 

Well said HotShoe.

 

Ferrari is a publicly traded auto mnfr, They will build and sell anything that adds to the bottom line. Both the FF and Lusso are magnificent cars and I personally like the looks but they are way over priced - by at least $100K. IMO this is the primary reason they drop so hard and fast. I canceled my Lusso order after enjoying an FF for a while and ordered a Urus instead. $230K loaded out the door. When Ferrari builds their SUV I imagine it will be great but likely overpriced in comparison with fewer features and less performance but they will sell. I wont be surprised to see dealers start discounting though.

 

This goes for most businesses, the bean counters are generally not in touch with the real world.

This is the main reason I canceled my Lusso order for the right to purchase a Pista. I am buying other brands instead right now.

 

This has certainly been the case but the dealers are now required to have demo's, they are now taking extra cars so Ferrari can meet their numbers. The SUV will likely be produced in higher numbers and I bet dealers will have a few on the floor to move. Time will tell but this is certainly a different Ferrari that we are seeing.

 

If they sell LE vehicles at "market price" (meaning values similar to what resell market was getting to), there is no point loosing 100k on a Lusso to get the LE or desirable one.
Like paying 500k for a Pista...I mean come on. And to get there you add insult to the injury forcing even long time buyers get a Lusso they don't want on which they'll loose easily 100k.

If that goes a few rounds, Ferrari P&L will look certainly better, and it will be real hard for them to come back. But I don't think the market will take it as for it to work, basically you'd need pista's to sell at 650k on secondary market which I don't see happen.

 

Go to the only exotic car maker that is really limiting production and just making sports cars...... McLaren. I did and couldn't be happier. I still have the CS, but I am pretty much done with the dancing pony.

 

How about "my other car is a proper ferrari" ?

 

My concern and the thing I find so off-putting is that a SUV is so off-brand for Ferrari. They have made concessions to the market before, of course, going back decades. Some more understandable for a sports car company than others. I've always defended the decision to eliminate the gated shifter (even though I prefer it) in lieu of the F1 transmission because that goes along with making a car that utilizes the best drivers technology available. But a SUV is a move away from making only the best cars possible to also making what are essentially trucks, albeit expensive and comfortable ones. That moves them away from being purely a car company and into a "vehicle" company, and that is a pretty fundamental shift, in my opinion.

 

Ferrari has always been purely a manufacturrer of exclusive high performance sports and GT cars. As a small manufacturer it's always had a sharp focus on certain types of cars and has done that exceedingly well and that is why Ferrari is still around after 70 years and has incredible brand loyalty and recognition.
There are many business ways to justify an SUV - it's a public company and it would be negligent not to leverage the brand, our competitors are also doing it and it provides economies of scale in production.
But broadening the product to SUV's changes what Ferrari has stood for over the past 70 years and that takes Ferrari to a different place in terms of who it's competitors are and how Ferrari is perceived by consumers in the market. There is a good chance that the SUV will see Ferrari becoming like Porsche, simply an SUV manufacturer that also happens to build sport cars. I don't think that's a desirable outcome for Ferrari as that leaves Mclaren as the only (volume) pure sportscar manufacturer.
M

 

Excellent post!!!

 

Ferrari spent decades establishing their Brand as a pinnacle of excellence in sports car performance. But it's now blurred into a social media statement of status, and they're drinking their own Koolaid.

 

One point I haven’t seen mentioned is Ferrari may regret going after nontraditional buyers, the luxury SUV market. Simply said, these buyers are not likely to put up with Ferrari’s ********, e.g., sticky knobs and piss poor paint jobs. These buyers expect excellence when they pay top dollar. Moreover, they have enough money to sue when they discover a Toyota Corolla is better built than their new Ferrari. To play in this sandbox, Ferrari will need to step up their game.


Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat

 

I'm not going to rend my garments and don sackcloth and ashes just because Ferrari is building an SUV. I'm actually rather interested in what they come up with.

 

I am with you on this one. As long as they build the best and most exciting SUV in the world, who really cares? Don't buy it if you don't like it. What skin is it off anyone's nose?

Damage the brand? Exactly how? Believe me Ferrari over the years has made cars that could have well have damaged the brand -- but didn't.

I remember hearing this same yelling at the sky when they introduced the California. It's a Maserati! Its not a true sports car! Its high volume! Its for WOMEN!!!!

The CA has proven to be one of their most popular cars they have made. Has the brand been damaged? Nope.

If anything it may force Ferrari to do a better job in quality control and engineering to match their rivals in this area.

Would I buy one? Probably not. But go to China and that's all you see are SUV's everywhere. I can see their point. Merc, Porsche, BMW, Lambo and now RR are going there. I don't see the issue with Ferrari to make a great cross over.

If Enzo was alive, he probably would have said years ago: shut up already and go make some money!

 

You all make great points. I thank you for a stimulating discussion about something we really care about: Ferrari.

My take is, what if its fairly different from a typical SUV that we don't end up thinking of it as such. How do they get there? I don't know. I have a pretty good imagination, but it is only so good! Ferrari must know the challenge: make a SUV that is not a SUV and it must be a real Ferrari. It must be authentic. It cannot simply be a rebranded Levante or Stelvio (as nice as those vehicles are).

So I say let's give them the benefit of the doubt. They now say we won't see such a vehicle into later into the game plan they just announced. It runs through 2022. So I would imagine that means we might see something in late 2021 or sometime 2022. And likely that's the show car. They have time to get it right. And get it right they must.

 

I'm looking forward to all the test mules and spy shots starting next year.

 

I think Ferrari knows its existing customer base is aging fast and youngsters who have money dont see the brand as special the way us old farts do.

The move into vehicles other than sports cars is for survival.

 

a few comments:

a. for survival [move to vehicles other than sports cars] ? I think more to please their masters (stock market), I think Ferrari should go back to being private where they can make the best decisions

b. earlier in thread mentioned China, all annual Ferrari sales are less than 700 units, and if the Chinese continue to lock out additional ICE powered vehicles that number will fall quite a bit [as in zero]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/sap/2018/09/06/seven-reasons-why-the-internal-combustion-engine-is-a-dead-man-walking-updated/

c. the Bentayga is not much considering it "owns" the high-end market in 2016/2017:

http://carsalesbase.com/us-car-sales-data/bentley/bentley-bentayga/
http://carsalesbase.com/european-car-sales-data/bentley/bentley-bentayga/

now consider the new "same class" SUVs by Lamborghini+ Rolls Royce, well, that pie gets really small

if the total global market for such is somewhere around 2,500 units per year, well, that doesn't seem like much

Maybe, just maybe Ferrari is waiting till 2022 to see what the market is, and, maybe, if too small, will forget about it