Rebuilt AEC 103A and tachometer | FerrariChat

Rebuilt AEC 103A and tachometer

Discussion in '206/246' started by sowest, Oct 1, 2018.

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  1. sowest

    sowest Formula Junior

    Aug 18, 2006
    899
    HI

    I have a Superformance rebuilt AEC 103A ignition unit. The wiring diagram in the instructions show the tachometer connected to the points terminal on the distributor. The original AEC 103A has a dedicated output for the tach. I had always been under the impression that the tach needed this dedicated input. Is the original tach compatible with being connected to the distributor?? (246 GT 1972)

    Thank you.
     
  2. Ken Ivey

    Ken Ivey Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 6, 2013
    228
    Portland, OR, USA
    Full Name:
    Ken Ivey
    Here's my experience, which doesn't include the Superformance unit: When the "emergency" wiring was used to take the AEC 103A out of the circuit, it dropped the tachometer. Using the negative terminal of the coil doesn't work on these tachometers. For a time I had a Bosch unit and the tachometer didn't work properly. There is a thread on how to add a resister to make the Bosch unit work, but I was never brave enough to change the wiring. I changed to an MSD unit because it has a dedicated tachometer output and works great.
     
  3. sowest

    sowest Formula Junior

    Aug 18, 2006
    899
    Ken

    Thanks very much for your input. Your experience lends support to my supposition. I know that when everything is original and the ignition is changed over to the "emergency" hookup the tach is not even connected. I assumed there was a reason for this. It was a long time ago, and I don't remember the specific module I was working with, but an oscilloscope showed the tach output to be a square wave with about 5V peaks. I am very reluctant to feed the original tach the 12V pulses at the distributor.

    I have messaged both Superformance and the US supplier of this unit. I don't have replies yet.

    You are right. The MSD works great. The owner of this car wanted the original look. It has been running fine with just the normal points and coil, but the whole reason for this exercise is to get a working tach. I will lobby again for the MSD!!

    Thanks and Aloha
    Larry
     
  4. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 15, 2012
    7,718
    Newbury, Berkshire, England
    Full Name:
    John
    I do have the Superformance unit (fitted this year, so a current one) and I had exactly the same experience - when I connected the emergency coil, everything worked fine, but the tacho stopped completely.
     
  5. Ken Ivey

    Ken Ivey Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 6, 2013
    228
    Portland, OR, USA
    Full Name:
    Ken Ivey
    I purchased the MSD unit after reading a thread by Nuvolari, (don't you just love the talented people in this chat room!). A programmable unit inserted into an original case. It comes at 0 degrees program, so I'm still using the distributor advance, but my tachometer is back and healthy :) If you the installation, just make sure nothing grounds out - it is an expensive lesson. If the link doesn't work, just search on Dino and MDS.

    https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/msd-ignition-in-a-dinoplex-case-no-points-fully-laptop-programable.533860/#post-144951989
     
  6. Stefan Elshout

    Stefan Elshout Karting

    Dec 1, 2011
    166
    Holland
    These tacho's work with a relatively low signal voltage of between 5 to 12v generated by the Dinoplex unit.
    It will not work with the high voltage pulse that comes off a coil - terminal from a normal inductive ignition setup like the superformance one. It can damage the tacho because the voltage spike is somewhere in the range of 200 - 400V (the voltage in the primary side of the coil at the time the points open and the magnetic field collapses).
    I would also go for an MSD ignition instead. It has the correct tacho output signal and it seems to be a better ignition system for a Dino engine in terms of power / easy starting. I've also heard of very positive reactions on Winterburns CD-Ignition.

    I had to repair one of these tacho's a while ago for a Fiat Dino. There is a very good page on a tacho replacement board for the Dino over here:
    http://dinoplex.org/tachoconversion/index.html
    There is all the info you'll need to make a new tacho circuit board. There is even a file that you can download to have the circuit board remanufactured.
    I made the circuit board and it works perfectly! And you can use it for both a signal from the coil - as well as a signal like from the Dinoplex.
    So if you want to keep the current ignition setup you can still decide to change the tacho circuit board.
     
    sturrisi likes this.
  7. TonyL

    TonyL F1 Rookie

    Sep 27, 2007
    3,838
    Norfolk - UK
    Full Name:
    Tony
    I have been running the SF super 4 (S4) ignition system on my car for several months now and don't have any problems whatsoever.
    The tacho is driven from the black wire on the S4 box, not the neg terminal on the coil.
    the existing loom should have three wires, yellow(ignition) black (points) and brown (tacho)
    The yellow (ignition Switch) wire is for the 12v supply to the S4 box and the Ballast resistor, the brown and blue wires are joined together for the points signal and connected to the black wire from the S4 box.
    One thing I would say is that the Distributor needs to be set up perfectly on a specialist machine otherwise you will get problems.
    Starting is instant, hot or cold and runs to 7000rpm with no problems at all (dyno tested)
    Best
    tony
     
  8. sowest

    sowest Formula Junior

    Aug 18, 2006
    899
    John, Ken, Stefan, Tony

    Thank you all for your time and helpful input. I am going to talk to the car owner and I think he will agree that the MSD is a good solution. I have not had a reply from Superformance or the USA supplier of the unit I have.

    Thanks and Aloha
    Larry
     

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