California Emissions Testing | FerrariChat

California Emissions Testing

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by BucksTifoso, Nov 19, 2018.

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  1. BucksTifoso

    BucksTifoso Karting

    Nov 24, 2013
    91
    Furlong, PA
    Full Name:
    Randy Crownover
    Please help! I recently sold my 1998 355 Spider, 6 speed manual, from where I live in Pennsylvania, to a buyer in California, via BringaTrailer.com. The buyer emailed me today saying that the car failed emissions testing, so he will be unable to register the car in California. The problem was NO emissions. At 25 mph the car passed: Max: 692, Ave: 62. Meas: 541. However, at 15 mph it failed: Max: 405, Ave: 67, Meas: 1599. In Pennsylvania, the car was exempt from emissions testing. I maintained the car well. I made no changes to the exhaust system. I feel as a car buyer in California, the onus is on him to know his state’s requirements. I represented the car honestly and didn’t even think about this as a possible issue. I still find the results a little odd, that the numbers are so different between the 15 mph test and the 25 mph test. And that California doesn’t make an exemption for a 20 year old car, even with their stricter standards. Any insights would be appreciated. Thanks!
     
  2. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    5,942
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    Tell him to replace the post cat o2 sensors and as long as it has working catalytic converters it will pass easy.
     
  3. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    5,942
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    There are some tricks as well. Need to take the car for a drive and heat up system good then pull in and smog it.

    These things are not as critical if it still has stock cats
     
  4. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    5,942
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    My car usually is better than half the max. The 25 mph is the worst because by then the system has cooled off.
    When warm i believe mine was under 50.
     
  5. APA#1

    APA#1 Formula 3

    Nov 5, 2003
    1,311
    Central Florida
    In addition to the above, here are 4 of the most important things you need to do when selling a car.

    1. Write an AS-IS statement and get the buyer to sign.
    2. Write an AS-IS statement and get the buyer to sign.
    3. Did I mention write an AS-IS statement and get the buyer to sign.
    4. Do all of the above with no exceptions!!
     
  6. APA#1

    APA#1 Formula 3

    Nov 5, 2003
    1,311
    Central Florida
    PS: even if your car is perfect
     
  7. cls

    cls Formula 3

    Jun 12, 2007
    1,663
    Los Angeles/Montreal
    Full Name:
    Chris
    He needs to take it to a mechanic in CA to diagnose. It's his responsibility, not yours. California has warnings all over the DMV site about buying cars from out of state. Also from the DMV "Unless your purchase agreement states otherwise, a private sale is on an “as is" basis."
     
  8. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    5,942
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    I dont see anywhere that Randy has said its his responsibility he is just trying to help the guy out I believe.
     
  9. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    5,942
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    The car will pass just needs to be setup correct.
     
  10. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    277
    Southern California
    Driving the car hard a couple days for at least 50 miles is critical. Fresh premium gas, Shell has always been best for me and only 1/2 tank.
    Here in the Los Angeles area I use a smog shop that is right off the freeway with an appointment and pull right in after a 40 mile freeway drive with the car really hot. Higher gear to keep the engine up will also help but the computer might limit the revs. Works for my Porsche as well as my Ferrari. There is also a test at the end of the sniffer for the gas cap seal.... Apply some rubber rejuvenation dressing a couple times the week before the test. If he's in So Calif fell free to have him pm me and I'll try and help.
     
  11. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    277
    Southern California
    And the California rule is "Model year 1975 and earlier" are exempt.... And even that can't be trusted.....
    I brought over 2 70's vintage Lancia's.... Because they hadn't ever been sold new in the US, California said they had to meet Federal Standards.
    There aren't any shops to do that work and it would be more costly than the car if there were. It's California keeping grey market cars out unlessthey are 1965 and older.
     
  12. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    12,661
    San Carlos, CA
    Full Name:
    Mitchell Le
    Ask the buyer to sign up for Fchat and have him post his location. One of us will help him. There are thousands of Fchat members here in California, Norcal and Socal braintrust is deep.
     
  13. cls

    cls Formula 3

    Jun 12, 2007
    1,663
    Los Angeles/Montreal
    Full Name:
    Chris
    " I feel as a car buyer in California, the onus is on him to know his state’s requirements."
     
  14. Enzojr

    Enzojr F1 World Champ

    Dec 12, 2013
    14,001
    West of PDX
    Full Name:
    Tomy
    EXACTLY THIS ;)
    Situations like this is why Fchat rocks, so tell him to sign up and post up his issues and location.
    I did O2 sensors on my 355, and finally bought another set of Nouvalari cats and that fixed the CEL lights.
    Not certain if my car would pass the CA standards.
     
  15. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    277
    Southern California
    One thing for California sellers (ONLY) to keep in mind if selling to a California buyer (ONLY) and it's pasted from the DMV regulations:

    "The seller is required to provide the buyer with a valid smog inspection certification at the time of the sale or transfer. Smog certifications are good for 90 days from the date of issuance"
     
  16. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    5,942
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    I had my car in california for almost 10 years and i can tell you first hand that a proper running 355 passes easily.
    I would also like to think we all really want a proper running car.

    I passes many times and failed twice. Once you understand the car its usually very easy to fix it too run properly.

    I do have a 99 obd2 car but my guess is the others would be similar
     
  17. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
    Professional Ferrari Technician

    Nov 11, 2003
    2,238
    Frederick, Maryland
    Full Name:
    Brian Brown
    The car is an OBDII car. There should be no Dyno/ tailpipe testing on this car, only checking the the monitors to see if they are set and if there are any fault codes stored. Why are they performing a tailpipe test?
     
  18. JSBMD

    JSBMD Formula Junior

    Mar 17, 2007
    437
    The OC
    Full Name:
    John
    Anything 1975 to 2000 must have a tailpipe test, OBD 2 or not. Sport cats are hard to get hot enough to pass the test, stock cats will easily pass if the car is running well.
     
  19. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    277
    Southern California
    There is also a requirement for the tailpipe / sniffer test for cars first entering / re-entering California. Not required for bi annual tests thereafter ....
     
  20. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    12,661
    San Carlos, CA
    Full Name:
    Mitchell Le
    I remember a car with … 13 engine codes and we finally got it to pass.....
    Ketel, where are you?
     
  21. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    5,942
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    Thats interesting bcause atleast 4 occations over the years and everytime it had an idle test, 15 and 25 rolling road.

    I extra failure was the result of idle being check d in wrong exhaust but I caught that. Some smog stations are less that good
     
  22. Solid State

    Solid State F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 4, 2014
    9,582
    Full Name:
    Maximus Decimus Meridius
    Glad you asked this. I haven't seen a tail pipe test in 20 years but then I don't live in that state anymore. I don't like it when chubby at the MVA gets in to do the OBD test every two years let alone drive it on the rollers.
     
  23. BucksTifoso

    BucksTifoso Karting

    Nov 24, 2013
    91
    Furlong, PA
    Full Name:
    Randy Crownover
    Yes, I was just trying to help him (my buyer) out. I HAVE suggested he sign up for this forum. This group has been very helpful to me, allowing me to troubleshoot several small problems. I don’t feel responsible for the car not passing the test in California. The car was exempt in Pennsylvania, so how could I be expected to know that the car wouldn’t pass in California. I also think it will be a simple fix. The car had its major last year, I maintained it well, the car had an annual inspection at the local Ferrari dealer just a few months ago. It ran so great and smoothly, that as I was shooting driving videos for the ad, I was almost questioning whether I should sell it. I think the buyer just panicked a little, thinking he had bought this car, paid to have it shipped across the country, then thought he wasn’t going to be able to register the car. I even looked up the price for oxygen sensors, which are only $175.00 each from Ricambi. But I told him not even waste his time and money, trying this or that, but rather as one member said on this thread, take it to a shop that knows these cars and it should be an easy fix. Thanks again to all of you for your comments and assistance.
     

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