83958 Major - 2016 - Fuse Board

Guido, I applaude your efforts. Your boards represent a lot of intricate man-hours and attention to detail. Your task however is nearly impossible to execute perfectly. The reasons are the same that drove the EEs to design circuit boards in the first place.

Soldering the multitude of connections with ‘just enough’ heat, but not too much, is essentially impossible. Have a close look.... cold soldered joints and overheated connections & wires abound.



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The GT Parts board replacement does nothing to stop this:


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Or does it? There’s plenty of probably cause suggesting the burnt up connectors are due to board delamination issues.

Dont forget a user just posted on this thread that he had to switch out the the Helms modified OEM board before some electrical gremlins went away.

 

What you see is the Plastic vernis layer I put on every board to protect for external influences and moisture. So no overheated connections.Yes sometimes the plastic wire protection is to shrink a little bit close to the solder points, that is unavoidable. Solder temperature is 285 °C (I use high melt temperature solder) and plastic melts at 70 °C or less.
You can even wash my motherboards in water with detergent if needed and dry it with a hair dryer or leave it in the sun. There are 97 boards installed for the moment and a waiting list of 10 that will be delivered after my return in may.
Guido

 

How does your logic jump from delaminating boards to burned connectors? I would think that delamination would cause higher resistance through the circuit board and higher temperatures in the circuit board and thereby LESS current and temperatures flowing through the white connectors.

Hopefully v4ngo will add some specific data.... like: The wire connection in Dave’s board at XYZ was not properly soldered and the wire had a high resistance which cause gremlin XYZ. Not much I can learn from “all kinds of electrical problems”. What specific gremlins were seen and how were they caused by the SR modifications? As I see it, the basic design of Dave’s modifications are sound from an engineering perspective..... likewise, the GT Parts board is likely an improvement over the OEM board, BUT it does not resolve the ancillary problems.

 

Guido - one thing I can say for sure.... your soldering skills are WAY better than mine!

 

Because the delamination occurs where the connector is soldered to the board.

 

So then... you propose that the heat travels from the delaminated board, with little effect, until it reaches the spade connector and the heat then dissapates into and burns the white connector housing.

Seems plausable, but doubtful. I am open to the theory.

Does anybody have a pic of a burned white connector which also shows the circuit board’s corresponding male spade?

I included the female, OEM spade connector so folks can see what is inside Steve’s burned, white connector.

Then, another question arises.... what is the primary cause of delamination? I would suggest that the spade connection’s heat travels INTO the board and causes the delamination.

Hmmmmmm......


Which came first..... delamination or an overheated spade? Maybe both?

Even then - I come back to Dave’s solution - Get the high amperage circuits completely OFF the OEM board.


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I can’t speak to that level of specificity because all diagnosis and replacement work was performed by a Ferrari tech who described things in layman’s terms. As such, I also can’t speak with precision as to what degree the DH/SR board caused problems. What I can say with certainty is that as soon as that board was taken out and the GT board put in, all of the following issues immediately went away: starting problems, fuel pump shutting off, battery dash light flickering, headlamps working intermittently, and door lights not working at all. For what it’s worth...wish I could be more helpful on this topic.

 

Were the problems there before the SR modifications, or did they appear after the modifications were made?

Any chance you still have the old, OEM board?

 

Thanks Vincenzo....after soldering about 200 solder point at more then 100 boards (97 + 10 in stock), yes my skills are improving.
And saying it all started with only 1 board, for my own car...because DH kits did not satisfy my expectations and $$$$ for a few wires and relais, GT parts also $$$$, Zertec did not get it sorted out with his boards and there where no others on the market with a solution. Then a friend wanted one for his car, then an other and so on...and it is still a hobby for me. Counting the man hours I cannot otherwise my boards are much to $$$$.
So I'm happy to help many others to keep their car on the road. Even 3 X F40's are provided with my boards (same price for a board like all the others ! No extra F-taxes).
Guido
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The DH/SR board was installed by the prior owner, and I don’t know what issues prompted the change.

I don’t have the old OEM board.

 

Connector looks fine to me. Suggests an issue between the board and other end of connector whose heat travels out and burns the plastic connector housing. What do you think?

 

My board and connectors are undamaged. These SR modifications are proactive.

Can’t say for sure.

Thinking out loud....
there are two theories;
1) Age causes delamination which creates high resistance and heat
2) High amperage from aging accessories causes connections and circuit board to overheat and then delaminate

Or the most likely result.... a combination of both 1&2

One thing intuitively obvious - heat will accelerate delamination. So then, get the heat producing circuits off the board and it will last longer or indefinately.

I think we both agree that getting SR to modify a GT Parts board would offer a bulletproof solution... but wait! Then the wiring harness will melt from aging accessories drawing too much amperage.

Thank God for fuses.

 

Manipulating fuses, relais and the wire plugs, makes the single solder points break slowly....lesser contact, more resistance so more heat building. The use of WD40 and other sprays are helping delamination of plastic layers. Its a mix of conditions that fuseboards are melting down.
Guido

 

We’re on the same page. The only thing I would add is this: the original board has already received numerous heat cycles and the effects of time/oxidation, plus being made from older materials/methods. Removing high current circuits is a good thing, but the board is still old.

The original board has lasted dozens of years and thousands of miles with those high-current items run through it. Because od this, if I was going to replace anything first, it would be the old board. It worked well enough for a long time and the newer board should only work better. Just seems to make the most sense.

 

is the original then still available?
the ricambiamerica side says: no

 

What type of concerns were u experiencing

 

The TR fuse box is a very well known issue. The board its self is crap-o-la. They do split and separate causing all kinds of issues other then in the high draw circuits. The GT board is a good unit regardless. It eliminates the separation issues.

That said. The burned connections are a result of high current draw. Sometimes related to the connections, other times directly relating to the parts drawing the current. The cooling fans, fuel pumps, starter circuit etc are all high draw items. As these parts get older, they will pull more amps and as a result create more draw which makes heat.

Check the components on the circuit. If they are drawing excessive amps, then all you have installed is a band aid. Fix the problem. Dont just address the symptoms.

 

Not only TR boards...all boards of that kind : All mondials, 328, 400i, 412, F40, 288GTO, TR, testarossa, 512TR old model board, and recently starting to melt down the models 456, 550 and 512TR new model board. Luckely I have the internal diagrams for all those boards.
Guido

 

Thanks to Joe from the US FYI I managed to get the new style 512 TR internal Fuseboard diagram. Here is a copy of this diagram ( this is the backside and split in 2 for more clearness). As from now on I will produce this board for who is in the need for one.
Guido

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Do you still make these boards? I need one for a 1993 512tr

 

I started a cio

I started a conversation....upper right corner, click on your name...

 

Hi Guido @theunissenguido, how do the old and new 512TR boards differ? How do you know which you need? I wasn't aware that GTCP at least made more than one version, or that you did either until this thread just popped up (have read numerous other threads on this subject).. haven't really looked into SR/DH option. I have a 1994 Swiss model 512TR, #97504 which is having some electrical gremlins and I am hoping soon to find a little time to take a close look at the fuse board and go from there.

 

To my knowledge all 512TR have the same boards. Testarossa and TR have a different board....
This is how a TR/Testarossa board is looking ...white plugs on the left side are vertical and you have 2 lines (of 4 white plugs) horizontal lines lower side



And this is how a model 512TR board is looking (I think picture is from a 456...but its the same layout)
The colored plugs left side and lower side are all horizontal...
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Best thing when you are looking for an other board is making a picture and send it to the seller.