BELGIUM & VINTAGE FERRARI HISTORY | Page 2 | FerrariChat

BELGIUM & VINTAGE FERRARI HISTORY

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Dino2010, Jan 18, 2019.

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  1. Timmmmmmmmmmy

    Timmmmmmmmmmy F1 Rookie

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    #26 Timmmmmmmmmmy, Feb 1, 2019
    I would rather hear from independent experts about whether #0856 is indeed #0858, or not.
     
  2. Dino2010

    Dino2010 F1 Rookie
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    #27 Dino2010, Feb 2, 2019
    Well, this is an excerpt of the list of Award winning Ferrari's at the FERRARI CLASSICHE CONCOURS, DAYTONA, WORLD FINALS 2016
    as reported by Keith Bluemel (definitely an expert) on Anamera.

    http://www.anamera.com/en/editorial/article/news/ferrari-finali-mondiali-1/index.html?no_cache=1&tx_ttnews[backPid]=226&cHash=b97c0b2036



    All Awards Ferrari Classiche Concours, 3 December 2016
    ...
    *Most Historically Significant Ferrari – most significant in Ferrari history
    ...
    1967 330 P4 0856 Lawrence Stroll
    ...

    Note:     The names of the cars used in the awards list are based on the commercial names for a particular model as defined in period and used by the Classiche Department to write and issue Classiche Certification Certificates.

    Keith Bluemel
    12/2016
     
  3. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #28 miurasv, Feb 2, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2019
    I think you and Timmmy are getting confused here. Nobody is saying Lawrence Stroll's P4 is not 0856 or that it is 0858, but that the revised history is that the number 24 car at LM 1967 that came 3rd, was actually 0858 and the number 21 car at LM 1967 that came 2nd, driven by Parkes and Scarfiotti, was 0856.
     
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  4. Dino2010

    Dino2010 F1 Rookie
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    #29 Dino2010, Feb 2, 2019
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 2, 2019
    In that case, can you tell when the "swop" of numbers 0856 and 0858 actually would have happened?
    Or in other words, from what date (for both cars) is www.barchetta.cc wrong?

    http://www.barchetta.cc/english/All.Ferraris/Detail/0856.330P4.htm

    http://www.barchetta.cc/english/All.Ferraris/Detail/0858.330P4.htm
     
  5. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #30 miurasv, Feb 2, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2019
    I don't know. I know what barchetta says who have not revised the site details in line with Ferrari. The www.racingsportscars.com site says the same as barchetta.

    Le Mans 1967: http://www.racingsportscars.com/photo/Le_Mans-1967-06-11.html

    Monza 1000KM 1967: http://www.racingsportscars.com/photo/Monza-1967-04-25.html
     
  6. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #31 miurasv, Feb 2, 2019
    ...and actually it may not have been a revision or a number swap at all by Ferrari at all as far as I know. The details they placed in 0858's Classiche Red Book may be the details they have always had which could agree with the ACO records and the previously thought info as on barchetta/racingsportscars could just be repeatedly copied and published mistakes.

    See thread about 0856 here: https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/ferrari-330-p4-0856.552457/
     
  7. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #32 Marcel Massini, Feb 2, 2019
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  8. Dino2010

    Dino2010 F1 Rookie
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    #33 Dino2010, Feb 2, 2019
  9. Dino2010

    Dino2010 F1 Rookie
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    #34 Dino2010, Feb 2, 2019
    So, with the documents Mr. Massini posted today, it's clear that:

    0858 was carrying number "21", driven by Parkes/Scarfiotti at the 1967 24h Le Mans. It won 2nd place at that race.
    By logic deduction:
    0856 was carrying number "24", driven by Mairesse/Beurlys at the 1967 24h Le Mans. It won 3rd place at that race.

    I have read any possible thread on Ferrarichat, regarding these cars. There seems to have been enormous confusion about these 2 cars.
    Now, the question is: was there a revision (swap) of these respective Chassis Nrs? If yes, why and when was it done, by who and is there proof it?
    Thanks a lot in advance.
     
  10. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #35 miurasv, Feb 2, 2019
  11. Dino2010

    Dino2010 F1 Rookie
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    #36 Dino2010, Feb 2, 2019
    Thank you for this.
    These 330 P4 #0856 and #0858 are real mysteries! The discussion is apparently continued on the appropriate 330 P4 #0856 thread.
    So, next post here, we'll come back to Belgium and it's exciting Ferrari past.
     
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  12. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

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    #37 miurasv, Feb 2, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2019
    P4 Raced by Ecurie Francorchamps at Le Mans, 1967.

    The story of how Ecurie Francorchamps raced the P4 at Le Mans 1967 is that Jacques Swaters had sent the wreck of 412P 0850 that his driver Willy Mairesse had just crashed at the 1000 KM of Spa, 1967 back to Modena for repair and preparation for Le Mans, 1967, but about a week after Swaters was told it would not be ready in time. It was suggested that he negotiate a swap with a P4, which Enzo Ferrari agreed to. Moneys were not discussed at this point, but after Ecurie Francorchamps had finished 3rd at Le Mans with the car he wanted to settle the account, and was staggered by the amount of the bill and he realised that Ecurie Francorchamps could not afford it so he instead paid for the repair of 412P 0850, and got that back, and returned the P4 to Enzo Ferrari.
     
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