Challenge car for tracking | FerrariChat

Challenge car for tracking

Discussion in 'Tracking & Driver Education' started by Scott Archibald, Mar 9, 2019.

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  1. Scott Archibald

    Jan 22, 2019
    6
    Full Name:
    Scott Archibald
    Have any of you had experience in purchasing a challenge car for recreational tracking?
    What are the pitfalls, what technical support is needed if any?
     
  2. gatorgreg

    gatorgreg Formula 3

    Dec 13, 2004
    1,863
    NAPLES
    You need the VCI computer, air tank to lift the car and tools to remove the tires. It is to much car for a track day. You need support.
     
  3. Scott Archibald

    Jan 22, 2019
    6
    Full Name:
    Scott Archibald
    Gatorgreg thank you for responding,
    I found Sears Point Racing Club online, located at Sonoma Raceway, they have mechanic support, garaging facility etc.
    for club type tracking. Is that adequate support for a challenge car?
     
  4. carguyjohn350

    carguyjohn350 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 7, 2007
    3,826
    Houston, TX
    Full Name:
    John P
    *** I am not a Challenge Car expert by any stretch of the imagination***
    However, from what I have read and owners I have spoken to, it seems there is a difference between models in terms of useability by the average Joe. Are you looking more on the 348/355 end or the 458/488 end of the spectrum? A more specific question might elicit a more helpful answer. There are Challenge owners on this site.
     
  5. Scott Archibald

    Jan 22, 2019
    6
    Full Name:
    Scott Archibald
    My interest is in a 458 Challenge car, not necessarily the EVO.
     
  6. gatorgreg

    gatorgreg Formula 3

    Dec 13, 2004
    1,863
    NAPLES
    Trust me. You need to find someone qualified,to run the car. You will pay for it one way another. I know from experience. Find a good independent shop racing Ferrari’s not Porsche’s with the VCI computer.
    I am sure someone will post that you can run the car without the computer, but to be honest with you the car is dangerous without it.
     
  7. gatorgreg

    gatorgreg Formula 3

    Dec 13, 2004
    1,863
    NAPLES
    The Evo kit is safer. It’s more stable at speed. Another tip run the factory tires. The 458 is an incredibly fast machine which was design around the factory tires.
     
  8. JAM1

    JAM1 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 22, 2004
    7,186
    FL, NY, and MA
    Full Name:
    Joe
    Greg, who's helping you run your car? I'm up the coast in Tampa and I'd like a good recommendation for a shop familiar with 458 Evo...
     
  9. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,292
    socal
    What a s the Vci computer?
     
  10. gatorgreg

    gatorgreg Formula 3

    Dec 13, 2004
    1,863
    NAPLES
    The System Diagnosis SDX is an apparatus able to enclose in a single system the three diagnostic systems produced by Ferrari SpA (SD1 + SD2 SD3 +) for the electronic assistance of the cars (equipped with a diagnostic system) to the model 430 Scuderia.
     
  11. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,292
    socal
    Oh SDx...never heard it called vci
     
    NbyNW likes this.
  12. rlips

    rlips Formula Junior

    Jul 29, 2011
    959
    New Jersey, USA
    VCi is the version for the Challenge car. I run a car, primarily for track days. You will need to have a race shop or dealer that can help with the occasional odd thing, but it is doable for a mechanically adept owner.


    I have nitrogen tanks, a lift in my garage, a closed trailer and dry break cans to fuel the car. The car is more work than a typical track car, but certainly doable.

    I’m running the car on race gas and ceramic brakes. The car is very fast, and the costs are commensurate with the speed.

    Your biggest issue is that you will most likely be the fastest car out there on a track day, so finding people to play with is hard...look for GT3 cup cars and the like...

    Best,

    Ron
     
    Manda racing, Makuono and JAM1 like this.
  13. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,292
    socal
    Is VCI a box like an SD2? Is it software on a laptop? Used SD's are like $20k. Can a normal person buy the VCI for the challenge car at normal people prices? Why VCI instead of SD? Does VCI have limited function like no CAN line HVAC parameters? Or does VCI allow ECU "tuning" for say different race class intake inlet restrictors?
     
  14. rlips

    rlips Formula Junior

    Jul 29, 2011
    959
    New Jersey, USA
    VCi is a device plus software on laptop. It gives access to the various ecus via the obd port, and allows maintenance, troubleshooting and logging etc. as far as prices....it’s a Ferrari product...somplan accordingly.
     
    cridom60 likes this.
  15. gatorgreg

    gatorgreg Formula 3

    Dec 13, 2004
    1,863
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    I paid $11K for the VCI. It requires Ferrari updates.
     
  16. Manda racing

    Manda racing Formula 3

    Feb 25, 2015
    1,245
    Bakersfield, Ca
    Full Name:
    Mark
    Image Unavailable, Please Login I would think you’d have to pick events with open passing not BS point by passing. You loose the flow.

    I’m not going to do hardly any events with my Scud due to not being able to keep the flow going.
     
  17. gatorgreg

    gatorgreg Formula 3

    Dec 13, 2004
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    Alan J's old car.
     
  18. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,292
    socal
    fraction of what SDx costs. What does VCI computer do VS. SDX ? Sounds like a bargin at 11K
     
  19. stokpro

    stokpro F1 Rookie
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jun 25, 2003
    4,383
    Himalayas
    love that livery!
     
  20. stokpro

    stokpro F1 Rookie
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jun 25, 2003
    4,383
    Himalayas
    I have support for my Challenge car but I know guys that run their own. As rlips said, it's doable with the right tools and equipment and a solid shop to support the car for things you can't do. Ping joeyung on here; he has lots of great info on self-supporting a 458 EVO. Where are you located? There are several shops out there that support Challenge cars.
     
  21. mb60

    mb60 Rookie

    Jan 23, 2013
    13
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Matt
    Carl,

    VCI stands for Vehicle Communication Interface, it is an interface that usually plugs into the OBDII connector and then communicates (usually via bluetooth) to a base station (many times a laptop) that runs the ecu diagnostic software. It is pretty much the standard now for diagnostic computers. The latest Ferrari diagnostic computer called the DEIS uses a VCI, Leonardo/Galileo uses a VCI, the SDX uses a VCI.

    What Greg is calling a VCI is really called a Challenge Tester and its uses a VCI setup. Ever since the 430, Challenge cars have had their own designated computer that Ferrari has made by Waycon. It only has software for doing that specific model, but its purpose is to allow Challenge teams to purchase a less expense tool for use only with specific model Challenge cars.

    Matt
     
    Modena_Michael likes this.
  22. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,292
    socal
    Ahhhh....makes so much more sense! So Ferrari is trying to basically do their own
    Kludged Bosch Motorsports integration? So the Vci is the link between laptop software like Bosch racecon and Windrab software to see manage Bosch Motorsports ecus. Can the Ferrari deis do things like the Bosch change tire diameters for traction control and see fuel consumption/lap and stuff like real Bosch Motorsports ecus?

    Does the 458 and later have switchable abs and traction control settings to refine on specific tracks or wet weather like Bosch? Is the waycon software free download like Bosch for challenge owners or another fee?
     
  23. 95spiderman

    95spiderman F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2003
    15,057
    ny
    #24 95spiderman, Apr 8, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2019
    why did Ferrari change the challenge car ethos from 348 and 355 that were stock and just lightened enough to make up for the extra safety equipment? idea was to prove how much performance the road cars have that they can actually be raced. got further afield with 360 and 430 while 458 and 488 are pure race cars that require a pro team to run. just go back to the beginning, strip out a tributo, add safety equip, race pads and align it to run on slicks. its not like anyone goes to spectate these races so don't need to put on a show. Ferrari has gt3 cars for the pros.
     
  24. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    9,252
    Challenge racing evolved into Rich Guy racing.

    Although I know F355 challenge drivers who had their engines rebuilt every race....

     

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