NEW V8 MID ENGINED MODEL (BIG BROTHER)

Couldn't have said it any better.

 

Rigidity as a spider...

458 spider is a wobbly mess.
488 spider better than 458.
Mclaren Spider rock solid.
Performante spider rock solid.

I love the 458 and Perf best, regardless.

 

Ahaha I rest my case
(but I still want a CF chassis in a 1000+ car and while we're at it give some of awesome to open doors)

 

Then wait for McLaren's hybrid should be soon after Ferrari's BB

 

Everyone says 1000cv but..has that been somewhat confirmed or, at least, hinted at by someone? Or is It just guessing/wishful thinking?

 

Too Late. They have already found 106 as dcmetro would say 'suckers' for their new folly.

 

The problem with Li-ion batteries is that unlike with lead acid, they don't like to be stored fully charged for long periods. Like any battery technology they also don't like to be completely drained. This makes not using them for long periods a problem.

 

Mouahahah

 

I'm sure this is one of the many reasons Ferrari changed their public view on hybridization for the flagship V12 model and now says they will fight to keep the NA V12 unassisted as it represents the core of the brand. An LaF owner can drop $200K on an out of warrantee battery set replacement and maybe groan a little but on a $400K car it is unacceptable. These cars are mostly not driven due to fear of depreciation. IMO the weakest past of a current modern Ferrari is the battery. Batteries to assist propulsion makes it much worse of an issue all around.

 

A friend of mine has an F1 and for customers they remove kers completely because of complications like that.

 

Doesn't sound like a problem to me. If you don't drive your car, why buy it? Seems like a great way to get cars into the hands of people who want to actually drive them.

 

Why do you think it will be $200K to replace? If Tesla can sell entire cars with 50 kwh battery packs for $35K, I don't see why Ferrari will have trouble selling much smaller hybrid-sized packs for a heck of a lot less than $200K.

Anyone who pays $200K for a battery pack in a LF is just getting raped and Ferrari is just laughing all the way to the bank. The LF barely even has a battery to begin with LOL. What is that thing, like 2 kwh?

 

So if your $50k car needs a $2000 repair you just throw it away? I don’t think someone with a $5m car is going to care much about a $200k battery. That’s like one year of appreciation? I’d love to write a $200k check for my $5m super car.


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FChat member already posted cost of LaF replacement at that price. They are now out of warrantee. I posted previously the bare price of the battery pack at Scuderia. It was over $150K without tax, shipping, additional parts and labor. Now its listed bare at $167,612.73. The newer pack will likely be even more expensive since it will be higher power and more cooling. Putting Ferrari and Tesla in the same sentence is not advisable for a lot of reasons.

Enjoy your hybids.

See item #1 below:


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Actual battery:

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That price has nothing to do with how much it actually cost Ferrari. They rape you, plain and simple, because they know their customers don't care and will pay it.

Every single Ferrari will be hybrid in 5 years. If you think the Portofino is going to have a $200k battery, you're mistaken. Batteries are not expensive and only being cheaper. A battery pack on regular series Ferrari will be a small fraction of what they charge for the LF, just like every other Ferrari part compared to more or less the same part on the LF.

 

First you say no way. Then I post the absolute cheapest you can get any Ferrari hybrid battery as the dealer will be MUCH more. Then you say that's not what it cost Ferrari. No kidding! They make a lot on each car - more than anyone. You should just admit that you were dead wrong with the pricing.

And we're talking about just the BB here that will need a battery to drive three times as many electric motors as the current LaF with the base cost of the new car being debated on this site somewhere between $600K and $1M if I'm following correctly. Pony up for that battery boy!

 

On the LF, they charged 50k for a black painted battery charger. 150k for a new battery.
Remeber - the LF had a base price below 1 million.

So yes - It will be ‘cheaper’ on a 600k car.
But - as the battery will become an issue on some cars, they surely know how to make additional money on them. Just because of the simple fact that you’re forced to buy a new one or your 600k supercar stops working.

 

Even though I agree with a lot of things you say, you are dead wrong on this one. The set up of the LaFerrari is unique. You are not paying for the battery component only, but for their packaging and the bespoke design. The cells are the same design as the KERS cells in the F1 cars from the early 2010s. Do you really think that this design has anything to do with a Tesla or a Portofino replacement?

 

Any have info about the rumor of the electric turbos in the BB? Electric turbos probably improve the sound. At least in theory.
I don't figure a 600k ''flagship'' model, LaF-like shape, with a turbo sound similar to 488.

 

Yes, but they aren't going to use some ancient 2010 battery technology in a 2020 car. I'd also be surprised if Ferrari didn't update the LF to use more modern battery technology as well.

Tesla even sells upgraded battery packs for the original roadster. Super low production volume, hand-built. Only $30K. So they used modern cells in a 10 year old car.

"Upgrade your Roadster to a battery that stores roughly 40% more energy than the original battery. There is a slight increase in the battery weight but the total range increases over 35% from the original Roadster.

The price of the battery upgrade is $29,000, including all labor and logistics, which is equal to Tesla's expected cost. It is not our intention to make a profit on the battery pack. The reason the cost per kWh is higher than a Model S battery is due to the almost entirely hand-built, low-volume (only 2 or 3 per week) nature of Roadster battery packs. It also includes additional work to remove, upgrade, and reinstall the power electronics module (PEM.)"

 

We'll find out in a few months I guess. There is no way they are going to make a modern hybrid with a relatively tiny battery pack that costs that much. Remember, LF was limited and rare. They can only get away charging what they do because the car is worth millions more than it cost new. This new model is going to depreciate massively like normal models. They aren't going to try charging $200K for a car that's going to be worth $300K by the time it needs to be replaced.

 

Exhaust will still drive a turbine (with turbine driving a generator instead of the compressor directly) so sound will probably be the same.

 

Sound is important to Ferrari with each new turbo edition I believe they will improve sound.
So I expect BB to sound better than any preceding turbo V8

 

Don't forget that the guy McLaren recruited to do their carbon fiber chassis is an Italian ex-Ferrari guy (and ex-A.T.R. Group; they made the Carrera GT chassis, I believe) so it's not like Ferrari don't know how to do carbon.

Ferraris have always been a bit conservative with design and construction and have always been less extreme at the benefit of comfort compared to the extreme shapes of Lambos and the difficult ingress of some carbon cars with high door sills and scissor doors.

The BB will almost certainly have regular doors (as evidenced by the shape of the door leading edge) which are the most practical but unfortunately limit the design options around the door leading edge and behind the front wheels.

Also, the new concept of aluminum chassis will certainly be up to the task otherwise they wouldn't bother making this car.

One more comment on the CF vs aluminum debate: Porsche seems to be making some pretty good cars in... steel! ;-)

 

I'll try to put some sketches together for discussion and debate here. Will help the 2 long months go by more quickly ;-)