Come to think of it, there is a video of a stock 360 versus a 360 CS and the stock car was actually beating it in a roll on....I will try to find it. edit: no luck, but the video was of Rob Ferretti doing roll ons. He's in a stock 360 against a 360 CS on the freeway and they did multiple roll ons, and they beat the CS every time and he couldn't believe it.
So many variable its pointless to compare without a baseline of at least the following. 1. Kerb weight (measured on same scales back to back) with same level of fuel in each car (not relying on fuel gauge which can be waaay off). 2. Left and right bank timing differential (if the belts have been done and not aligned perfectly they can still be within tolerances of manuals but waaay down on power). 3. State of the maintenance, ignition coils, plugs, primary o2 sensors, afm's, air filters, oil, oil filter, etc. 4. State of the fuel, is it old poor octane or lower octane cheap stuff? 5. Current Mileage. Chances are if the car has less than 10k on the odo it will be waaay down on power vs a car with over 25k+... 6. Tires. On original rock hard rubber? 7. Euro vs US spec car? The eu cars made more power due to less emissions kit, no header cats, etc. 8. Driving style, current gear your in, point in the rev range, etc. when they started 9. Are you really sure it was stock (perhaps ecu was tuned...who'd know?)... I could go on and on. Makes for a great YouTube video though...
Interesting .... so #5, the more miles on the odo, the more power the car makes ???? Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
Yes, to the point where the engine is fully bedded in. Then it makes optimum power until it wears substantially (at very very high mileages if well serviced) or it gets deposits and needs cleaning.
Yeah but this isn't a one off unfortunately, I put my CS on a dyno and the results were not great and that's being generous vs my other cars on same dyno where they were
I had my CS, F430 Spider and Scuderia from new or 2k miles, I dont recall my F430 Spider or Scud lacking any power in the first 10k miles ....
They are bedded in to a point at factory these days on dyno machines before even fitted but peak power comes later in their mileage life. You'll make as much as 30hp more when fully bedded in vs a new tight engine.
Furthermore the CS apparently had a "blueprinted engine" so should need even less running in than any other car, I will look to see if I still have by CS dyno, reality is reality
I went to a dyno and we did over 25 cars which wasn't a bad sample.. Every stock car over 20k made more power than under. Just because an engine is blueprinted doesn't mean it doesn't need some bedding in. It just means it's better balanced so will rev more freely with less internal vibration etc. and absolutely yes less bedding in is required when tolerances are even better but unlike the race cars it still takes some time and quite some mileage to accomplish this. As for dynos since every one is calibrated a bit differently youd need to compare against other 360s done on the same one even on same day if its not temperature and humidity controlled, which most certainly aren't unless they are calibration dynos and then its done out of car on a Bench.
Understood, there are always variables to such unscientific tests. Both cars were supposedly stock...just found a piece of the clip in another of his videos (not the entire one where they did at least three runs) Starts at 1;14 and ends around 1:42
I am picking/leavings cars to keep until I get old. The SCUD would be one of them. The rest are all manual transmission cars. Havent owned a CS. Owned a Spec. Got a chance to get either a SCUD or a CS, I went to another SCUD. If I where to choose from a CS or a Spec, probably Ill pick a CS. Just me.
Meh. Something was wrong either in the"foot down" times or the SC's engine management. Common sense and physics will tell you a lighter faster shifting car with more horse power will be faster. Let's not kid ourselves.
Sorry, no disrespect here but I have to call bullsh*t on this. When I sold my CS I had 27k miles and a full tubi header, cat, muffler setup. I was still putting down way less power than advertised on the dyno. Ain’t gonna lie either, it was a big reason why I sold it, the other being getting smoked by a beat up but modded RX7 on the highway which for me was utterly embarassing.
so many cars, so little time. i love the cs. i like the scud. i love the speciale, i like the pista. i thunk there is always a blend of performance and romance that hits people differently. thankfully.
Nurburgring lap times CS 7:56 SCUD 7:39 Both way down the list below Corvettes and 911s. If you want to beat modded RX7s you should drive an even more modded RX7.
Corvette or 911 not necessary, just a stock scud was adequate to take it down, even when the rx7 had a headstart =) And interestingly, an 11-year old Scuderia driven by a non-pro still makes the cut for the top 100 Nurburgring lap times @ #57: https://nurburgringlaptimes.com/lap-times-top-100/ Not too shabby at all!
No bull. The engine and mapping on the 360 isn't setup out of the box for torque at cruising revs, it's all about delivery of its power high up in the rev range, you need to keep it over 7.5k rpm to make any decent lap times and it's hard work but can be quick. Just putting your foot down and dropping a gear isn't what it's about. It's torque curve and emission mapping doesn't allow it. Also if you did headers, cat and backbox without appropriate mapping you probably didn't gain much if anything over +5%, mostly noise from your investment. You need to remap correctly on a dyno and for best gains you would have had to swap to larger fuel injectors, throttle bodies and raise the artificial rev limiter to around 9k. I recall doing some even basic dyno testing years ago and I managed to tweak over 40ft pounds gain to 315ft pounds vs stock 275ft pounds and that was with stock eu cats and factory catless headers. So yes it can respond well but you need to decide what your after. More torque or more peak hp. Scud has 347ft pounds so I was only down by 32ft pounds. Tuning for torque makes a considerable difference vs tracks where your always near redline and peak power output. I posted these in another thread recently but useful to get your head around... 360 (non Cs) baseline map 360 Challenge race car map 430 Scuderia map These are driver demanded Lambda, air to fuel ratios. The Scud engine has also been mapped conservatively and especially for emissions. Neither road car makes its optimal power at all points in rev range, they tuned for fuel economy and emissions for a large part of the bands.
360 Modena Image Unavailable, Please Login 430 Scuderia Image Unavailable, Please Login 360 Challenge (race car) Image Unavailable, Please Login Looks like on the 360 they where doing emissions testing at 2200 rpm
none of this gets round the fact that the CS is significantly & probably more than official stats "significantly underpowered" vs the Scud