Heat exchanger 360 | FerrariChat

Heat exchanger 360

Discussion in '360/430' started by Ron8892, Jul 7, 2019.

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  1. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    Hey everyone, love all the info you guys post. I have a 2000 Modena which I’ve owned for about a year and the heat exchanger just went. Worked the last day getting the car all apart and finally got to the heat exchanger.

    I can’t for the life of me figure out how to get those banjo bolts loose to free the exchanger. I have no leverage which is making this impossible.

    What did you guys do here? I’m thinking of running to the store and buying a strap to secure it to the frame. I know someone people approach it from disconnecting the lines at the transmission and then securing the exchanger to a bench when it’s removed from the car. Any guidance would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!
     
  2. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    Never mind, took a much needed break and went back and realized there is a place for a wrench to grip below the bolt. Haha, I forgot how important it is to take a break every once in awhile.
     
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  3. basscase415

    basscase415 Karting

    Jun 10, 2017
    87
    CA
    Out of curiosity, how did you discover that it went bad? Always a little paranoid about this.
     
  4. fotostars

    fotostars Formula Junior

    Feb 6, 2015
    341
    Bay Area
    This ^^^^ !! A break is amazing when working on these cars... Oh and an impact gun works too (for undoing the banjo bolt), not for everything though.... Haha :)
    I'm assuming you're going at it from the top if you're not disconnecting the oil line from the transaxle?
     
  5. wbt

    wbt Karting

    Nov 28, 2014
    231
    New Zealand
    Full Name:
    Wayne
    I used a big breaker bar and they popped straight off. Quite a high torque spec on those banjo bolts.

    Can you cut open the old exchanger once the job is done? I replaced mine preventatively, 60,000km original part. Hadn't failed but the oil side was full of black crud with consistency of fine sand.
     
    mike01606 likes this.
  6. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    My first symptom was mild overheating when at idle. I checked the coolant level and noticed it was a bit low so I topped it off with about a quart of coolant. Drove the car again for a few miles and when I checked the level again I found contaminated coolant which looked like it had dirt floating in it. After sucking some out and putting it into a clear glass I noticed it was oil drops. (See picture below). Also was a very dark color.
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  7. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    I went at it from the top, which I’m glad I did. Was a total pain in the a$$ getting all those bolts off the plenum, but once you get that off it’s sitting right there.
     
  8. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    It’s definitely torqued on there nice and good. I used a 22mm wrench and with some old fashion muscle it came loose. It looked in fairly good shape except for when I peaked down the oil line hole I could see some crud. I then blew on one end of the oil opening and plugged the other with my finger and after giving it a couple of breaths I could hear a tiny tiny whisper. Must have a small leak somewhere which was just enough to cause the cross contamination. I can’t imagine that much coolant got into the gear oil, but I’m still going to change it out to be safe.
     
  9. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    Also, here is a picture of it from the top. I couldn’t get one of the hoses off the front of the plenum. It’s like permanently molded to the black metal tubing which I have no clue what it’s for. Decided ah well if I just move it over and tie it up it will be just fine to get access to the heat exchanger. Why make more work for myself?

    I also just repainted that dreaded peeling oil drum. Having all the tubing out of the way it was a perfect opportunity. Have a few days til my new exchanger and gaskets arrive.

    I’ll post some more pictures when I start putting things back together with the new exchanger on.
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  10. wbt

    wbt Karting

    Nov 28, 2014
    231
    New Zealand
    Full Name:
    Wayne
    Looks like you got lucky before any real damage happened. That black hose is the vacuum line running to the brake assist master cylinder. It holds a vacuum, and over time the rubber somewhat bonds to the steel tube making it hard to remove. My method to remove was a light grip on the rubber hose with pliers and gently twist the hose running down the length to slowly break the bond, the just a pull and it pops off. Good opportunity to then get into the plenum and clean out any accumulated oil (oil can build up in there from over filling and vapour condensation over time). Also a great opportunity to replace the 8 x intake gaskets which are also quite prone to failure.

    Everyone should do this as maintenance every 10 years. Great investment into the health of the gearbox and cooling system.
     
  11. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    I tried you method and it did break loose. Was on there pretty good but managed to wiggle it off and remove the plenum from the engine bay for further cleaning.

    One question I have is I noticed my right fuel line to the fuel injector rail has split in a couple of places.

    Can I cut this section out and use a barb fitting and steel clamps with new fuel line or would it be best to route a whole new line in? If so, any ideas on what size this fuel line is and how to access the other end of it?

    Thank you all for you help!
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  12. timwu12

    timwu12 Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2014
    919
    TX
    The fuel line is not the soft rubber hose. The fuel line is a hard plastic line that’s then wrapped with the soft rubber that you see is cracking


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  13. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    That makes a lot of sense now. I’ll put it all back together and check to see if there are any leaks. Thank you.
     
  14. vrsurgeon

    vrsurgeon F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 13, 2009
    15,918
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Curt
    I might have an old fuel line if you need it that isn't cracked all out.. Right side..will check tomorrow in my storage.. Those going to the injector rail are the high pressure lines. I wouldn't run mine with any nick or compromise in the line if I were you...
     
  15. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    That’s very generous of you. I thought the same thing so I went online earlier about bought one from California at an exotic salvage dealer. I’ll keep you posted if I suspect it won’t work. Thanks again for the offer.
     
  16. vrsurgeon

    vrsurgeon F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 13, 2009
    15,918
    Charleston, SC
    Full Name:
    Curt
    No prob! I bought new when I first bought my car and the outer rubber was retracting due to the heat and degredation.
     
  17. mike01606

    mike01606 Formula Junior

    Feb 21, 2012
    794
    Cheshire UK
    Full Name:
    Mike M
    I replaced one last year....they’re (or were) about £90 in the UK. Failed in he same place and when I dissected the old one there is a hard plastic fuel pipe inside the rubber and mine had a flaw in it...they was no obvious leak but there was fuel in between the pipe making the rubber sticky.
     
  18. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    Update:
    New heat exchanger has arrived. I took a side by side picture of it to compare. As you can see the one on the left has a dark opening from all of the gunk. When I blew through the new one the air flowed nice and good. There is a NIGHT AND DAY difference from the old one. I’d strongly recommend if you still have an original exchanger to swap it out, even if you have no leak symptoms. Notice the flange on the new one is wider too, which fits better on the banjo for less chance of a leak. My part said made in 02/19 so it must be the new design, ordered from Scuderia parts for $550. Well worth it.
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  19. Ron8892

    Ron8892 Rookie

    Sep 24, 2018
    17
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Ron Hernesko
    Update:

    New heat exchanger is on and car is back together. Car started right up with no engine lights. Started the flushing process of the coolant using a dozen or so gallons of distilled water. I saved a little fluid from each flush to show the progress. Takes about 6 flushes to get all the old fluid and oil contamination out. See the picture below with the left being the first flush and the right cup being the last. I used one of those vacuum kits I bought off amazon for $100 to fill the system, and the adapter from my power brake bleeder (hooked up at 10 psi to my air compressor) to get as much fluid out during each drain. Seemed to be a smooth process.

    New coolant will be going in soon, which by my math will take the mix to about 25% coolant and 75% water for the time being (since you are only replacing about half the fluid during each flush). I thought about just running water wetter in there for the summer but read about a lot of horror stories about it causing gunk in the lines. Not sure where the gunk would come from considering there is probably next to none old fluid in there now, but figured adding just regular coolant would be best. I’m using OEM Euro Blue coolant BTW.

    I’ll do one more flush in the late fall before it gets cold out, and this should bring the coolant content up to where it needs to be to prevent freezing over the winter.

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