Hi All, I struggle with scrapping the bottom of my 308 every time I go in and out of my driveway as we are on a decline from the road. Unfortunately we are also in a complex of apartments with a shared driveway so not that easy to just tear up the concrete and re-profile. Has anyone tried or seen anything that enables a front suspension lift .....like modern super-cars have? Did a bit of searching but the only thing I could find was off road air bag kits. That's no way to treat a Ferrari I'm not hitting the chassis, but where the sills meet the floor in the vertical join is taking some light damage. Cheers, BB
Can you cut or fold the sill joint over, the joint is only there for ease of manufacture and it contributes nothing to stiffness of the car just attaches the outer sill and the small inner sill panel together.
How about two small 12VDC linear actuators mounted (rotatable) on the frame with smooth rods going through a rotatable bush on an a-arm? For normal driving the actuator is in the retracted position and the smooth rod slides in the bush as the a-arm moves up and down. Push a button to extend the actuator and the rod slides down through the bush until a block at the end of the smooth section presses down on the a-arm and lifts the car. Something like this one on ebay down under: https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Linear-Actuator-1500N-12V-DC-Electric-Motor-Max-Load-150KG-for-Auto-Door/123838632270?hash=item1cd55b914e:m:mFm_CwqEAU8NPqEwEFUy1Dg
I suppose you have already tried crossing the threshold at an angle which effectively shortens your wheelbase perpendicular to the crest point.
I have done a bit of research here. There are two ways of going about suspension lift. Hydraulic - you can drive in any position - KW coilover kit - with KW HLS $10K ish https://www.kwsuspensions.com/products/kw-suspensions/hls-hydraulic-lift-system.html - TUV Approved! JRI - integrated lift in shock. https://www.jrishocks.com/shop/specialty/hydraulic-ride-height/ BRR performance kit - http://www.brrperformance.com/project_cars.php Otherwise you would need a set of coil overs - Air cups need to be full up or down. You cannot drive in the middle.... Air cups - https://coilovers.springrates.com/products/stanceparts-universal-air-cup-kit-front-rear?variant=12899580543010¤cy=USD&gclid=CjwKCAjwnrjrBRAMEiwAXsCc49YYu16i5j0dWdVr8XWizjdyDAVVx4Qu0_wo1kauLd1242uPwnu4lRoCDgMQAvD_BwE full Air suspension - Bagged air spring on coil over strut - all probably around $6-10K. Drive at any height. https://www.ridetech.com/ https://www.ridetech.com/ https://www.accuair.com/ It's very complicated. I am thinking the KW for me, eventually. KW has been around for a long time. The hydraulic system is very straight forward and if it breaks i will not need to replace the whole strut. They are common amongst tuners. The JRI's are cool but more boutique. Air is its own thing. Some people don't like it. Some say it can be tuned to perform very well... All of these are major SYSTEMS to install. tanks, reservoirs, plumbing, electronics and controls. It's a lot of work.
...or AU$50 ($80 with remote control) and a bit of work which is probably far less work than a complete system You would probably only need to lift one side as the anti-roll bar will lift the other side a bit.
Only 1.5KN max force, so about 150Kg. You'd have to match them for stroke vs increasing weight as the springs take less and less weight as the chassis lifts - some fascinating calculus may be needed!
Yes I already tackle the drive at an angle which is slightly better than straight on. I did look at linear actuators but their length make them difficult to setup, there just isn't enough room in the front end and I think a cam system would be needed to enable normal operation when down. Thanks Sltillim .... that's some great research and more what I was thinking. I'll take a closer look at those options. John I only moved in 12 months ago ..... I think I'd be in trouble if I told my partner we were moving again because of my car I'll let you all know what I come up with. Cheers, BB
Stand on a scale next to your front wheel, lift the wheel arch until the scale has increased 150kg. Easier than calculus and I suspect the car will have lifted a couple of cm. This is what I was thinking of. The rod slides through the bush of the rose joint in normal use. To lift the car a little at low speed, the rod is push through the bush until the stop presses down on the rose joint and lifts the car. You could alternatively clamp an arm to the sway bar and have a similar sliding rod onto the arm which can rotate the sway bar. There may be more space somewhere along the sway bar and a hinged "L" arm would allow the actuator to be prallel to the sway bar. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Can you rent a garage nearby? I feel your pain...went through similar situation. I modified my driveway but am not happy due to the steepness. I know you cannot modify your driveway. Good luck and let us know what you decide. Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
Dang you're right. I just tried it, no scale but just guessing about 50 lbs of force and it came up at least 2 inches. I think you're on to something.
Now I understand what you were thinking! Its a good idea, but would have to take into account the following: the arc of travel of the lower control arm - which would mean the top mount of the actuator must pivot the under-hang of the actuator rod when in the "off" position - don't want to cause more scrapping issues clearance to the wheel/tyre when full lock is applied It would be great if the actuator had a "non-power" setting than enabled the rod to move freely. Then the end of the actuator rod could be solidly mounted to the lower control arm? I checked this out and the Stance Parts website. This is a fantastic solution, very neat and wouldn't be noticeable to most people (except that you have to hide a tank and compressor somewhere? Not that much of an issue for me as I don't run a spare wheel (I have a puncture kit from a modern car that lives in the rear compartment) so I could fit both in the front spare area. I'm running the Nicks Forza double adjustable coilovers, so would need to measure up and see if the lift cups will fit. Also if 50mm front lift is enough for me to clear my driveway. I don't hit my front end, I scrape along the middle of the body as the car passes over the hump in the driveway. More research ahead BB
the arc of travel of the lower control arm - which would mean the top mount of the actuator must pivot. Actuator has a mounting lug at the top which allows rotation in one plane, rose joint or a little play if you need more flexibility the under-hang of the actuator rod when in the "off" position - don't want to cause more scrapping issues If this is an issue use a rod within a tube above the lower rose joint (eg. 10mm rod bolted to rose joint and sliding in a 10mm ID tube which is fixed to the actuator. clearance to the wheel/tyre when full lock is applied. Yes, need to check but I think it will fit
I like the air cups. You wouldn't need a tank, just the tiniest little 12V compressor you can buy, tucked away behind the headlights. You would only use it once or twice per drive, and waiting 5-10s for it to pump up is no biggie
How about a small 12v gearmotor turning a threaded collar below the spring seat? I would put that on my car and know two others who want something like that. Anyone have a spare front shock they can sell/loan?
Picture of sills, completely flush with undertray would gain about 15-20mm Image Unavailable, Please Login
Hi Sp1der, Its a bit dark in that picture you posted. Are you saying you made the sills as per below in red flush? How did you do that? Cut them off and weld the sill metal to the floor metal? Or just hammer them over (I hope not! ). BB Image Unavailable, Please Login
@sp1der is on a different level!!!! He's been building an incredible Group4 Rally car. Prepare to have your mind blown! https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/michelotto-308-build.429130/
Are you sure your car is stock height and someone didn't lower it previously "because it looks cool"? Doug
I had the inners welded directly to the chassis tubes and the outers are essentially just aluminium covers which are riveted to the chassis tubes and the cut back original outer sills at the top, so the underfloor of the car is completley flat. The other way maybe to cut at an angle where these flanges are fouling. The sills contribute nothing to the strength of the car. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Hi Sp1der, Thanks for the further information. You've really gone to town on your 308! I haven't seen your post before, so now I'm enjoying catching up on all your good work. So from the factory is there also a inner and outer sill or is that something you decided to do? I thought the inners of the sills were spot welded to the floor? That is why I didn't want to cut them? Have I got that wrong? Cheers, BB
The inners come together with closing panels inside the car plus the outer sills. The inner part really acts as a sort of shear panel to support the inner floor part, it's far from structural though. You should find a 3 thickness weld under the door seal. If I was having this problem I would make a vertical cut in that flange and then fold over the flange say the first 4 inches to buy whatever clearance you need. If you ever need to restore then fold back and a small mig weld to put flange back together. Anything else looks a big engineering job unless you raise the ride height.
