488 - GPF exhaust solutions for Pista | FerrariChat

488 GPF exhaust solutions for Pista

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Soup Nazi, Sep 17, 2019.

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  1. Soup Nazi

    Soup Nazi Rookie

    Jan 18, 2007
    21
    Please advise if anyone knows of any GPF delete options, exhaust or software fixes.

    My '17 488 sounds better than my Pista, which is driving me nuts.

    Thank you.
     
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  2. junc

    junc Formula Junior
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    Have you tried keeping the valves open by having them plug in the vacuum lines? I had it done to my Pista and the car does sound better. Your Pista does not have GPF. They just made software changes that quiet the car considerably after the initial cold start for EU rules. At least thats what I was told.

    It does sound better than it did prior to valve adjustment but I think at lower revs it still is quieter than the 488s Ive had. Its the world we live in now with all the EU requirements for sound. I would imagine that to really fix the sound issue we would have to replace the cats which gets into warranty issues etc.
     
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  3. Texas2step

    Texas2step Formula Junior
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    Pista currently does not have GPF


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  4. mkraft3003

    mkraft3003 Formula 3
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    You might actually want to own one first. As others have mentioned, the Pista does not have GPF.
     
  5. dmark1

    dmark1 F1 World Champ
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    Lol, no kidding. Troll alert
     
  6. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Guys- please read the original post. He owns a 17 488 and a Pista.
     
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  7. mkraft3003

    mkraft3003 Formula 3
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    I did. I also saw his prior post where he asked how he could order a 488 as his local dealer wanted him to lease a California. Fast forward and now he has a 488 and a Pista and thinks his Pista has GPF. A little strange especially since no one has ever said the Pista has GPF.
     
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  8. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Fair enough. Don’t know his post history- was just commenting on the posts in this thread.
     
  9. IloveGT

    IloveGT Formula 3
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    Oct 17, 2015
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    What year is your pista?
     
  10. IloveGT

    IloveGT Formula 3
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    Did I just fall for a troll again? Where are there so many trolls on Fchat?
     
  11. mkraft3003

    mkraft3003 Formula 3
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    They are on every forum. Best thing is to not feed them.
     
  12. Soup Nazi

    Soup Nazi Rookie

    Jan 18, 2007
    21
    Wow. I actually have a 458 Speciale, 488 and a 488 pista, among other cars. Funny to see how incapable some people are to stay on the thread discussion.
     
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  13. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

    May 29, 2019
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    You know, while I dislike trolls as much as the next guy, I think you have this one wrong. The thread you speak of, was from May 2016. It's not a case of him asking a question one day, and then two weeks later, asking the opposite etc. He's been a member since 2007 and rarely post, and honestly i cannot find anything in his previous history that backs up your allegations.

    Back in '16 I'm sure he would not be the only US customer to get the usual run-around when trying to get an allocation for a 488, so there's that. And seeing it was three and a half years ago, he could easily have taken delivery of both a 488 and a Pista in that timeframe.

    A guy with less than 10 posts in 12 years does not strike me as a troll.
     
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  14. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

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    You can squash this pretty easily. Post a picture of your Pista with today's paper or a personal object, a pair of gloves or shades in the drivers seat.
     
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  15. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Veteran

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    At any ratd, the Pista does not have GPF. I was told that it was quieted down for the exact same reason the Speciale was quieted down, namely due to issues with track noise regulations, and not EU regulations.
     
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  16. mkraft3003

    mkraft3003 Formula 3
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    Very good point!! Again, just a little strange in that the Pista does not have GPF and at least accordingly to my ears the Pista sounds deeper and louder than the 488. I’m impressed if the OP is being truthful.
     
  17. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    The Pista sounds better than a 488 that I can say - also agree deeper and louder. I admit my initial impressions had me second guessing whether it did but now after some seat time and mileage I can comfortably say Pista's core engine note at all RPM sounds unquestionably better than 488 even though the gurgling and occasional pop has disappeared somewhat at certain rpms. But in saying that, the gurgling and occasional pop really only ever noticeably manifested in 488 at lower speeds when the Forza valve controller was in open mode. In stock mode 488 was quite docile (somewhat lame) unless the rpm exceeded @3500 when the valves would open up. It is my belief that once a successful valve controller solution has been established for Pista it will be significantly ahead in every situation.....more to come on that very soon guys.

    PS The valves are also there for a reason other than just muting sound.
     
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  18. mkraft3003

    mkraft3003 Formula 3
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    Absolutely agree. I would also point out that the cold start up is extremely loud. I can no longer sneak out of the house without waking up the neighbors!
     
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  19. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    #19 Shadowfax, Sep 18, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2019
    Absolutely!! It'll nearly blow the walls off the garage when it starts up in the morning. I don't think you'd want it louder on cold start that's for certain. Once on the go I find the interior engine note is dictated by the road surface due to the removal of sound deadening. On a smooth quiet surface the engine note inside is quite adequate. It is only on the course chip black top where the note is extinguished by the lack of sound deadening but put the foot down and that problem is fixed. The Pista can sound a bit too tame off throttle and at cruising speeds and I feel this is where a valve controller will have some distinct value. But if you are "on it" then best to leave the stock setting and allow the ecu do its job as there is a sacrifice to throttle response, linearity and low end power once the valves are knocked out of play from the ECU. That is a fact.
     
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  20. junc

    junc Formula Junior
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    You have mentioned in other posts speaking with a Ferrari Tech who says that valves closing and opening are needed for proper operation. Can you give any more detail? In a turbo car I would think it would make the turbos more efficient to have the valves open at all times. My service department opened the valves for me. I did ask them prior to doing so if there would be any issues after reading some of your other posts and I was told no. I also spoke with service at another dealer across the country and they also told me no there are no issues.

    Ive always plugged the vacuum lines in every Ferrari Ive purchased. Service techs did say that might not be possible going forward because Ferrari is starting to control the valves without vacuum lines in upcoming models. That is disappointing because its the easiest bang for the buck modification for exhausts on a Ferrari.
     
  21. junc

    junc Formula Junior
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    Agreed it is crazy loud at startup. Im not sure how it could possibly be louder.
     
  22. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    #22 Shadowfax, Sep 18, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2019
    In a 488 its different from the usual set up as the wastegates and valves work in symphony to create the immediate throttle response and linear power delivery by keeping the boost on tap at all times off throttle and, down low. This is achieved due to the wastegates bleeding off just the right amount of excess boost, retaining that in the area between the gates and the valves so it all doesn't completely escape down the line. Once the valves are pegged open outside of the ECU's usual control then the gates and everything upstream try and compensate for the total loss downstream and that involves a loss of power and throttle response actioned by the ECU which detects any change in pressure upstream which is to a degree dictated by what happens downstream.
    I feel with Pista having so much power on tap down low as it is, it may not be that noticeably felt as was the case with 488 to a larger extent using the Forza controller. I will be able to tell you more on this soon if this particular project I am involved with proves successful.
     
  23. junc

    junc Formula Junior
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    That actually makes sense. Hmm something to think about and do more research on. Look forward to hearing about your project .


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  24. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie
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    Knowing what I've been told about this by a tech 30 years in and clearly very well versed I wouldn't advise disconnecting the valves permanently on a 488 and, most certainly not a Pista especially if you plan driving it hard. Keep in mind the Ferrari engineers have spent a lot of time on achieving the level of power, throttle response and linearity over the entire rev range in low and high rpm situations. If you are running the stock ecu I wouldn't take it lightly. This engine is very finely tuned and the balance between sensors can detect any changes and then the ECU fights to compensate. In Pista it takes very little to cause change in fuel settings and all sorts of things. The valve controller will be good in the sense you can return the system back to stock setting when you plan getting up it.
     
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  25. junc

    junc Formula Junior
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    Yeah I don’t doubt Ferrari worked hard on fine tuning it. Interesting to note no check engine lights . Would think if ecu noted something amiss it would light up . It’s not as if the stock operation has the valves shut at all times but rather opens them at certain rpms. Does the Pista open the valves at lower rpms in race vs sport as the 488s do? I got my car with valves opened at delivery so not sure .


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