FORMULA 1 VTB RUSSIAN GRAND PRIX 2019: RACE ▄▀▄▀ SPOILERS ▀▄▀▄ | Page 15 | FerrariChat

FORMULA 1 VTB RUSSIAN GRAND PRIX 2019: RACE ▄▀▄▀ SPOILERS ▀▄▀▄

Discussion in 'F1' started by SPEEDCORE, Sep 28, 2019.

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  1. TonyL

    TonyL F1 Rookie

    Sep 27, 2007
    3,811
    Norfolk - UK
    Full Name:
    Tony
    I have said it before and will say it again, SV is No 1, CL is No 2. Vettel has previous is this area so its little wonder he didn't comply or indeed the team thought he would yield the position after great start. Don't make stupid agreements beforehand.

    CL will be a WDC but needs to learn team strategy as well as race craft. Be a team player for gods sake! You'll get lots of bonus points from the team if you do and if you move on then other team managers will review your history. Playing the victim will put you in a B team if SF ditch you. Simple!

    He didn't let SV past on the first lap, SV outpaced the guy from 3rd place so he should be man enough to take it on the chin, tuck in behind and hound the crap out of him for the entire race would have been the best retort.

    Ferrari need to go back to basics and remember no team has ever serviced two No 1 drivers without acrimony and discord.

    + Ban bloody radio calls and he [+others] wont have a platform to whine from.

    Ferrari lost a potential 1-2 today through bad luck & a bit of stupidity, i'll be fair and say naivety which Binotto has to stamp out.

    tony
     
    Jakuzzi likes this.
  2. bobzdar

    bobzdar F1 Veteran

    Sep 22, 2008
    6,367
    Richmond
    Full Name:
    Pete
    He made it well into the window for mediums, both cars had a lead on Merc and both cars, on fresh mediums, were going to open the gap on the mercs. After Hamilton pitted they would have both been 6-7 seconds up the road with Vettel as rear gunner, and we saw how difficult it was to pass even with a faster car. They would have had a fairly easy 1-2 as they were flat quicker than the mercs all weekend, both in qual and race. The only way Merc could have gotten the win was to sacrifice Bottas and have him hold the Ferraris up, but by the time they caught him his tires would have been toast and they'd breeze by.

    The only reason they didn't win was the mgu-k. This is what, the 3rd race they've lost due to technical issues? That's more damaging than any mistakes Vettel has made.
     
    NeuroBeaker, Picchu88, 635CSI and 3 others like this.
  3. stavura

    stavura Formula 3

    Sep 1, 2016
    1,328
    U.K
    Full Name:
    Harold Lounge
    A bit harsh that wouldn't you say?

    They did leave Vettel out for longer so that once he pitted he would come out behind LEC. A much better way of 'swapping' them around rather than having one driver slow down and allowing Lewis to gain on them.
     
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  4. bobzdar

    bobzdar F1 Veteran

    Sep 22, 2008
    6,367
    Richmond
    Full Name:
    Pete
    What are you talking about? What karma? They gave Leclerc the lead back - and the gap on your screen proves they would have easily been past Hamilton when he pitted. He's only 18s ahead of Leclerc, and Leclerc on fresh tires so closing the gap. When Hamilton pitted he would have been 10s plus off the lead, and if the mgu-k didn't blow up, Vettel between he and Leclerc to play rear gunner. Ferrari nailed the strategy - have the two of them lead the race, undercut with Leclerc to get the lead back and then have a fairly easy win, if not a 1-2 if Vettel can hold off Hamilton. The only thing they did wrong was another technical issue.
     
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  5. lagunacc

    lagunacc F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Aug 24, 2013
    2,670
    That'd be team politics. He respected the team strategy.
    It's the slow guy with zero integrity who didn't.

    God sorted that out, but CL should learn - defend your position.
     
  6. 635CSI

    635CSI F1 Rookie

    Jun 26, 2013
    3,001
    London UK
    Full Name:
    Graham
    Exactly, though the driver politics need to be managed we lost today due to a technical issue with the mgu-k.
    Enzo used to have a cabinet of failed components in his office. The engineers responsible for the various parts of the car NEVER wanted their faulty parts there...
     
    375+ likes this.
  7. DGS

    DGS Six Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 27, 2003
    60,049
    MidTN
    Full Name:
    DGS
    IMO, this loss came from the pit wall.

    The team screwed up the pit stops, trying to put Leclerc out front in the pit rotations, after Vettel blew off team orders.
    They should have let it ride, and had a chat with their drivers after the race (on the carpet).

    Leclerc was taking better care of his tires than Seb was, with that string of fast laps to try to justify staying out front.
    Leclerc's engineer should have been going for the over-cut, not an under-cut.

    If they hadn't pitted Leclerc so early, he might have been on newer mediums at the end.
    Ham was pushing his mediums to keep contact with the Ferraris, so he had a lot of laps on a soft tire.
    That early stop led them to try for the softs at the SC --- which was too many laps on softs for the lower down-force Ferrari.

    Charles made one mistake: He stayed too close to Bottas during those three laps of non-DRS, after the restart, so his tires had wear by the time he could really capitalize. The tire wear just went downhill from there.
     
  8. subirg

    subirg F1 Rookie

    Dec 19, 2003
    4,186
    Cheshire
    Don't know what to say. Yet again Ferrari's strategists toss the race. All this deal making at the start of the race achieved nothing but long lasting driver tension. Merc somehow romped home to a surprising 1-2 and the championship continues to slip further away. Garbage weekend. Ferrari have forgotten how to win. Pure and simple.
     
    Hocakes likes this.
  9. Dino2010

    Dino2010 F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Nov 20, 2006
    4,852
    Belgium
    It's much simpler than that.
    The virtual SC, caused by Vettel's engine problem, forced all drivers to slow down,.
    Elton pitted instead and joined the race in front. Done.
    Maybe Seb and the red team could have thought of parking his car somewhere else, in order not to cause a (virtual) SC, in the pits, for instance.
    In that case LEC would have stayed in front. Bottles and Elton would have had to pit during normal race speed. And LEC would have won the race.
     
    fil likes this.
  10. 375+

    375+ F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 28, 2005
    11,884
    Seb was told to stop immediately and he pulled it off directly by an opening in the barrier. He deliberately positioned the car at the opening and thought that the corner workers could simply push it behind the barrier.
     
  11. Dino2010

    Dino2010 F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Nov 20, 2006
    4,852
    Belgium
    I know. The engine sounded like it wasn't completely dead yet. If Seb would 've made to the pit or to a 'safer' place, there wouldn't have been need for a virtual SC.
     
    fil likes this.
  12. Cyt

    Cyt F1 Rookie

    Feb 1, 2014
    3,297
    Sydney
    Full Name:
    Cyt- Chin
    Due to this Ferrari lost a potential 1-2.

    Poor form
     
  13. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    This - Ferrari are a political mess with a fast and sometimes faster car.

    Mercedes are geared to maximization of results as a team. Im hoping one day next century Ferrari will provide this structure.

    Drivers of the day both Mercedes pilots. Sorry but you must keep cool, and focus. They appeared to do that.

    Ferrari are just pathetic. I have fear about next year. The tenor of the relationship in Ferrari with drivers has to be a concern.
     
    subirg likes this.
  14. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    You do not 'deserve' a title by accident with a faster car. +1. Fail today. Does not look good for the future given the habit of 'over' managing situations and drivers in Ferrari. Entertaining though - so frustrating when lately they appeared to have moved on over that.
     
  15. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    +1 the race pace and tires useage was coming into play for assisting Mercedes it seemed. I was a touch surprised by that.
     
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  16. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    To placate him? I have a strange feeling its degrading around the drivers now in the team. This would not be a surprise. Vettel has a token win for the year. Overall he has not done well and is the slower driver. Has a temper and lacks the capacity to handle pressure when applied as has been shown over the past. He has no real answer to Charles. I would think in the team there is a chasm with support for both and a battle to balance the volatile Vettel vs the faster younger future found with Charles.
     
    crinoid likes this.
  17. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    He is welcome to leave. I know and we know that is not in the cards. If he does not like a sport he can no longer engage in and dominate Im sure an exit door at Ferrari is clearly marked. He is not adapting at all. His 'crutch' Kimi is gone. Will not at all miss Vettel ever. If you linger for the past you get left behind. Suits him perfectly after being pushed out at Red Bull. No loss ever when he is out of this sport he so dearly loves. Life changes. Grow up and live it.
     
  18. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    They never stopped the idiot Seb. Why change...........
     
  19. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    Post of the day LOL :)
     
  20. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    His temper affects his logic. He lacks control. Is very much one who comes across as 'entitled'. I heard Charles reminding the 'management' at Ferrari what was agreed.....a contract. Would we not do the same???????????????
     
  21. DF1

    DF1 Two Time F1 World Champ

    Perfect headline - Formula 1 Hamilton wins in Russia as Ferrari's race implodes
    --Ferrari's Russian Grand Prix imploded after Sebastian Vettel sparked a team-orders controversy then retired, causing an ill-timed virtual safety car that handed Mercedes Formula 1 driver Lewis Hamilton victory--

    Someone with Italian language skills please post the nuclear headlines sure to appear in Italy tomorrow!!
     
  22. furoni

    furoni F1 World Champ

    Jun 6, 2011
    13,609
    Vila Verde
    Full Name:
    Pedro Braga Soares
    I for once am not that disgusted by our defeat today. car was quick and IMO team did everything right...luck just wasn't around for us, plain sim'ple, this victory was simply shafted up elton's arse by sheer luck, nothing to do with Mercedes best strategy.
    We were competitive , it's the 4 pole in a row, i say Ferrari is doing ok...we arrived late to the party, but at least we're having some fun...just relax and let's wait for the nex one....
     
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  23. Jack-the-lad

    Jack-the-lad Six Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 22, 2004
    69,048
    Moot Pointe
    Mercedes also have the advantage of clearly defined and acknowledged #1 and #2 drivers......a multiple world champion and a guy who drives on a year-to-year basis.

    Ferrari, on the other hand, has neither the discipline nor the confidence to decide if they are going to clearly define team hierarchy or “let them race.” It seems to be determined on an ad hoc race-by-race basis. They have the luxury and the curse of also having a multiple world champion, but teamed with a highly talented rising star who sees no reason to defer to seniority and past achievements. Binotto needs to be more authoritarian. His management style seems too indecisive. Aggressive drivers are going to exploit that to their own advantage, and understandably so, until made to stop.
     
    fil, Smyrna355Spider and 375+ like this.

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