Maserati Bora - Picture Thread | Page 31 | FerrariChat

Maserati Bora - Picture Thread

Discussion in 'Maserati' started by Ron S, Sep 22, 2007.

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  1. italiancars

    italiancars F1 Rookie

    Apr 18, 2004
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    it still happens, how else do you explain Porsche getting the mid engine GT1 qualified as a Rear engine 911?
     
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  2. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Then you still have the best part ahead of you!

    Be sure to read and re-read all the technical tips and modifications offered in these threads so that you aren't kicking yourself once it's all back together.
    There are a lot of them on here and that will make the car what Giulio Alfieri intended. Maserati didn't quite assemble them as well as they should have and Giulio missed a few things. Hard to perfect things with such a short run and very little money.
     
  3. M. Brandon Motorcars

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    @cnpapa24 has been bugging me to post photos of my Bora, and it's about time that I did so. 1975 US spec, Euro bumper conversion, Blu Ischia Metallizzato over Blu interior. S/N 916. (AM11749US916) All matching numbers. I've owned the car for about a year, and while it was cosmetically and (supposed to have been) mechanically restored when I got it, this last year has been spent rebuilding the engine from literally the crank up, as well as going through almost every system on the car.

    This morning was the first time that I've really been able to drive it. Since the engine is newly built, I was told to keep RPMs below 4K. Just got back from alignment after the steering rack was rebuilt.

    What a car. I've been waiting for almost a year to drive it, and I have to say, it's worth the wait. I also have a 1977 Merak SS that is a completely original car, and while I dearly love that car, the Bora really is on another level, especially that engine. I'm still getting comfortable with the handling and the brakes, although I even caught myself heel-toeing this morning without thinking about it!

    More to come...
     
  4. Froggie

    Froggie Formula Junior

    Sep 27, 2017
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    Is that easy with the LHM braking system?
     
  5. M. Brandon Motorcars

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    I wouldn't have imagined it was possible when I first started driving the car. But, once you start getting a feel for the brakes, I just started doing it naturally.
     
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  6. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ
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    Hello and thank you for your great post, I was not aware that Porsche cheated in the seventies as well. I was at Le Mans in 94 writing a report for Cavallino when they cheated not only competitors but their own clients with the Dauer cars....at least Porsches will never have Modena charisma and most Porscheists have no clue what they are missing, half a dozen times when I was at MCG, 911 types came in looking down at Ferraris and Maseratis...but after I gave a carburetted, enthusiastic and sonorous Modenese ride to those who were qualified customers (with full treatment: airport perimeter road and tunnel:)) they ALL INVARIABLY changed automotive religion, exclaimed OMG I have seen the light this is fantastic etc etc Bwwoaahahahah:)!

    The reason is simple: those people decided at 14 that 911 is God and never used their critical judgment to assess OTHER cars (horse blinds glued on) after that whereas anyone who is into classic Maseratis is an independent thinker who pays attention and forges his own path:) I have met tons of boring porkie pie owners but never a boring classic Maserati owner:)
     
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  7. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Spectacular colors.

    The Merak is gorgeous and has gonads but the Bora has the balls.
     
  8. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie

    Jan 19, 2014
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    Yes it is. I drove it some prior to deciding to restore it and enjoyed it. It will be an entirely different car once restored however.

    I will - is the advice in this thread or the other Bora thread?
     
  9. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie

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    Much like in life, when it comes to my automotive pursuits, I try to be an independent thinker and well studied. :) I am more a fan of specific models than any particular marque.
     
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  10. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Look in all of them. Fchat is not a well organized technical solutions website but nonetheless most of the issues with the Bora have been discussed here.
     
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  11. 71Satisfaction

    71Satisfaction Formula 3

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    ..it is easier to Heel-n-Toe my Bora than my Alfa GTV6.

    It's not about LHM vs conventional hydraulic braking...
    ..It's all about the pedal position.
     
  12. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    If you're driving at high speed on a track and doing heavy braking then it's a lot easier as the brakes aren't touchy/grabby at all under such loads. I find that they are in fact magnificent for brakes from that era. YMMV On wet twisty roads at much slower speeds I wouldn't do it. For those unaccustomed to the LHM it's not a system dependent upon brake pedal travel but rather on the amount of pressure applied so the brake pedal is rather stationary when compared with typical hydraulic braking systems of that era. Keeping the system well bled and rid of any nitrogen that's leaked into the system also ensures better operation and less grabby performance.
     
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  13. hyenahf

    hyenahf F1 Rookie

    May 25, 2004
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    Marc
    yes, ha! I can see your passion spilling out :) , i feel very much the same. Before i was old enough to drive in the 70's and early 80's, i grew up in a household with multiple porsches. They were common place not only at my home but literately littered the streets here in america. They won nearly everything during that period, paris-dakkar , LM, sportscars, F1...etc. Watching jacky ickx (who was on porsche's payroll as an consultant) call the monaco f1 race on TV, robbing senna of his first victory to ensure prost and his porsche powered mp4 was the last straw for me. Since then i bought italian cars. Ive mellowed out my stance quite a bit, in the last few years and recently picked up a 930 and a tracked out M491 911 since its they only vintage car i feel safe tracking anymore. my heart still belongs to the 70-80's italian exotics with their interesting engineering, masterful designs and uncompromising soul. im just too busy to deal with them at the moment :)

    yes agreed, porsche comes in again with Barth's help and allowed a bespoke racing car in ruining it all.

    For a few years there the BPR series formula was nearly perfect in where true production based sportscars ran again. Mostly privateers developed and raced those wonderful approachable cars. The field comprised with genuine road cars that we can identify with, Mac F1s. 348, F40s, vipers, vettes, esprits,elises,marcos, maser ghilbi, panteras, 964-993's, TVRs, venturis, xj220 etc.

    Gordon Murray went on to claim as spectacular as the LM winning F1 performance was, it was very difficult to adapt the cars suspension geometry to lowered race spec mostly due chassis being designed as road-car first. The motor was also dummed down reducing power.

    With the series growing popularity the FIA would soon absorb BPR enabling cars like the porsche GT1 which was a just race car disguised as a barely legal street car. The writing was on the wall once that happened. I went to some of the late races where the once formidable mac F1s became backmarkers for these new batch of these faux road cars.... and yes the very last GT1 developed car (illegal toyota) coming full circle, looked just like a group C car again and the series died.

    best regards to the both of you
     
  14. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ
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    Yep and then Mercedes arrived with a sledgehammer when everyone else had normal hammers....I was in Sebring when FIA GT came and Mercedes had containers full of floors so they could run against the ground for max downforce, they had so many mechanics, engineers, trucks it was insane, they just killed the series along with the other reasons you mentioned...

    And back in 84 I was in Monaco when Ickx, whom I hugely respect, cut the race short because of the rain just before Senna passed Prost for what would have been Ayrton's maiden win...nowadays such conflict of interest would not be allowed...
     
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  15. boralogist

    boralogist Formula Junior

    Jun 21, 2005
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    How fast is a Bora---really:

     
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  16. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Bull sheet. Two old men, very old men remembering things as they were not. But it's fun just not believable.
     
  17. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ
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    #767 Nembo1777, Jan 26, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2020
    When I interviewed MM Cozza, Manicardi, Cleto Grandi and others such as Giancarlo Martinelli for my book between 2007 and 2012 they recalled the story in a slightly different way. They did not mention the top speed -but Euro Boras, like Euro Khamsins might have a differential ratio favoring top speed more than the US ratio meant to favor acceleration? I never asked that question.

    This industrialist had factories in Milan and in Taranto in the extreme south of Italy, the sole of the boot -960kms /550 + miles away. You must realize that the autostrada already existed, there was very little traffic and of course there were NO speed limits yet. This man, very gung ho, shows up at the factory one day and says:
    "-I have a problem with my Bora.
    -Yes they say what is it?
    -After half an hour at top speed I have steam coming out!"
    At this the Maserati staff rolled their eyes since no one is expected to try to stay at top speed more than a few seconds, no car, certainly almost fifty years ago, is conceived to manage to stay at top speed anywhere near that time span and they explained this to him.
    -"I don't care my autostrada is very straight, devoid of traffic and it should be able to do it: I want to save time!"

    So they did improve the cooling for him.

    I flew to Bari in the south to inspect a car a few years ago and from the plane I could see that autostrada, an endless ribbon, very straight and though of this man hurrying to his next meeting:)
     
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  18. boralogist

    boralogist Formula Junior

    Jun 21, 2005
    998
    I honestly don't blame anybody who hasn't driven a healthy 4.7 Factory Euro Bora at redline for failing to understand what these cars---one of which I am lucky enough to own for over three decades---are capable of!

    Regards.
     
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  19. boralogist

    boralogist Formula Junior

    Jun 21, 2005
    998
    Good point.
    Yes, they do!
    One of many many differences with the 4.9 US cars.

    Regards.
     
  20. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    You could get the Bora either way when it came to the final drive ratio. My best friend George Marin who died last spring was a huge car guy and he had a Bora for a long time. He bought his Bora quite by accident in a manner of speaking. He was dead set on a Daytona. He spent months trying to find one that drove "nice enough" the way he described it. George also had a Gullwing and a Cord Sportsman.
    At the last dealership he tried the salesman suggested he might like a very low mileage Bora instead and did he ever! I won't compare the two cars here but for him it was no contest.

    He also had his ZF transaxle modified by Roy Butfoy http://www.rbttrans.com/about.html
    They modified it to utilize the same 5th gear that was used in the Pantera. But he wasn't interested in more top end just lower RPMs in normal use. Go figure? I have the quicker diff ratio which I found quite useful most of the time. Going over 140 mph in that car isn't all that much fun.

    Before I joined the MIE club they used to have their annual meet in Tahoe and he described one year when they had one or a couple? of the factory technical guys come over for the meet. This top speed question came up. Specifically the the 174 mph listed in the Norbye book and they shook their heads and rolled their eyes. George spoke fluent Italian and acted as a sort of interpreter when Giulio Alfieri was looking over our Boras on the Quail Lodge concours lawn. So he was able to query them pretty well. I dove my other fiends Bora, Jim Johnson, which also had the European ratio and it was well tuned. He owned an exotic car shop at the time and a QV DD Countach. On that car he had installed an ignition box so that you could change the advance while driving. We ran that Silverstate open road race route both ways the day before. I had it 160 +- 2 mph for 10 miles chasing a Turbo Porsche in a very even match.
    That road starts out at a bit over 5000 ft elevation and ends up at about 4000 in a town called Hiko. Right next door to area 51! :eek: Nope never seen one. We weren't UFOs but we were certainly flying, IFOs.

    That Turbo Porsche got identified for several hundred dollars and almost thrown out of the event! :D :D I did my best Sargent Schultz impression ...

    So could the elevation cut 14 MPH off of the top end? :rolleyes: It probably had some effect.

    I beleive what George got out of the technicians at the Tahoe MIE meet probably emanated from the above story and I think they told him about 166 but that it took almost forever.

    On that day I drove we didn't experience any temperature disasters but it was cool out. The day of the race, very next day, it was horrible by the time we ran. No way 160 was possible on that day. Max was 130.

    In any event top end is not what this car is all about anyway but guys with their exotic cars are always swinging their .... around in such conversations. We had a lot of fun and never got hurt.
     
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  21. boralogist

    boralogist Formula Junior

    Jun 21, 2005
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  22. boralogist

    boralogist Formula Junior

    Jun 21, 2005
    998
    Ladies & Gentlemen---

    It just occurred to me, given its launch in March 1971 at Geneva Salon, that 2021 will be the 50th Anniversary of the Bora.

    I think we should organize some kind of a get together, possibly in Modena to celebrate the birth of this unique car which has become such an important, emotional part of our collective lives.

    Hope that at least some of you feel the same way.

    Thoughts, ideas, suggestions?
    Just wanted to get the ball rolling!

    Thanks.
     
  23. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 World Champ
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    #773 Nembo1777, Jan 27, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2020
    Hello,

    I have been thinking about this for some time, the ball is already rolling, the possibility of a BORA CINQUANTA in June 2021 is being evaluated. Decision time is April this year.

    It would be along the lines of KHAMSIN QUARANTA which I organized in 2012 with my publisher. A four day International Bora gathering in a prestigious and convenient location with touring rally, interesting visits, concours, Giorgetto Giugiaro, MM Cozza and Collina of Maserati Classiche, with gala dinner and dancing.

    First priority is a census of running Boras in Europe and establishing goodwill with no politics or commercial interests getting in the way. Retromobile in Paris is next week and I will be there four days meeting key people from various clubs....so watch this space.
     
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  24. boralogist

    boralogist Formula Junior

    Jun 21, 2005
    998
    Sounds Brilliant!
    Very much look forward to your updates!

    Regards.
     
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  25. am117au

    am117au Karting

    Apr 22, 2014
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    Greg G
    A Bora gathering would be brilliant to see a collection of Bora's and meet some of the faces off those who share information and experiences on this Forum.
    Located in Australia it would not be possible to bring my Bora but i would love to come and share some camaraderie with like minded individuals.
    To throw in my 2 shillings worth mid to late July would be perfect as i normally come to Europe around that time .I think it would be highlight after spending 24hr on the flight to get there.
     

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