The Purosangue Thread

Considering Ferrari's SUV will be a bespoke clean sheet platform, I'd expect it to beat the Urus easily in most metrics. The DBX will be the real competitor for the Ferrari SUV, especially after Aston put their V2 in it.

 

I agree the DBX will be the Purosangue real competitor.
If we take a look at the DBS Superlegera 5.2 litres V12 engine specs there are some pretty big numbers: 725 cv and a monstrous 900Nm of torque that hits its peak at just 1800rpm and hangs around right up to 5000rpm. A DBX equipped with such engine will certainly shade the Urus in terms of power, On some comparative drive tests made between the DBS Superlegera and the 812 SF the DBS Superlegera caused a great impression, but the conclusion was that the 812’s engine and gearbox combination not only shades the Aston’s, but it is amongst the greatest seen in a road car. Ferrari is certainly aware of the fact that the DBX V12 will be a strong competitor of the Purosangue therefore I would be very surprised if for some reason Ferrari won’t be offering a Purosangue V12 version. For the Purosangue to beat comfortably Aston’s V12 engine with 725 cv and reign in the SUV segment for some years, probably will have to offer a Purosangue's version with a V12 engine that is similar in power to the present 812 SF that has 800 cv.
Aston’s V12 twin turbo engine main drawback is the sound that has been considered adequate but far from the sublime singing of a Ferrari aspirated V12.

 

DBX is already a giant meh IMO. Haven't heard from a single person that it was anything impressive. It honestly doesn't even look like much more special than a Lexus with more leather. Don't see how it could possibly be seen as a competitor to a future Ferrari SUV. The DBX isn't even a performance SUV, it's just a luxury SUV IIRC.

 

My local Aston dealer sold their entire 2020 allocation at their launch event.

I don’t know if 0-62 in 4.5s is enough for you to qualify it as a ‘performance SUV’ or not but it is in my book.

In a world of boring and bland German SUVs, the Aston’s interior and exterior are a breath of fresh air, originality and luxury compared to the others. It looks pretty damned good to my eyes.

 

4.5s seems very slow by today's standards. Urus is like 3s, no? Tesla probably under 3s.

I believe even most high-end BMWs and Mercedes are like 3.5s.

 

0 to 60 is 4.3 identical to the new Range Rover SVR, makes sense, about the same horsepower and weight. Supposed to handle better than any current SUV.

 

I have a Tesla Model X P100D (Performance model). By car the best daily-driver SUV on the market today. 0-60 is 2.7 seconds in Ludicrous plus.

As a car nut with an impressive ownership resume of performance cars, never in a million years did I (nor anyone else I know) think I'd say this - but Electric is the future. Like it or not. And Ferrari (and others) know it.

 

Well like most things in this world, it is until it isn't. The logistics of electric work well today when only 2% of the world population adopts the technology but what happens when that scales up to 10-15-20%+? It quickly becomes non viable (as we know it today) in terms of infrastructure support, charging demand and strain on the national grid etc etc. Not to mention the opportunistic taxation to consumers that will undoubtedly ensue if it becomes more mainstream......all of a sudden the dynamic changes when electricity costs more than gas.
Food for thought and highlights the short-termism upon which the pioneers are operating to align themselves with the eco-movement. Yes, it's all very cool, novel and futuristic today but........

 

Due to my professional activity I often have to drive on motorways to get to a place that is located more than 100 Km away from where I live. During this trips I normally pass by several Teslas and for a long time I was intrigued why I've never seen one of them going fast and all seem to be driving very slowly always well below the speed limit. One day while in a friend's home I was introduced to two Tesla's owners and I noticed that they spent a good part of the evening talking about their cars. They discussed their Teslas journeys like if they have been planed in advance with great accuracy and detail after knowing the available charging points on route. At a certain point I joined the conversation by starting to express my total ignorance about electric vehicles. I then asked "I reckon Teslas are very accelerative cars but why is it that every Tesla I pass by on my regular motorway trips is aways going very slow" ? After hearing some technical explanations about the different types of batteries that can equip a Tesla I finally understood. The autonomy of these cars can drop drastically if there is an increase in speed and if that happens they might not be able to reach their destination without stopping and being charged for a while.
I don't want to be disrespectful but all these troubles and limitations just to own a car whose engine is unable to produce any kind of sound…...

 

I have friends who have a holiday house in Spain.
They were very excited to get their first electric car - a Tesla (they’re very heavily subsidised in the Netherlands).

They used it to travel to Spain. It took them 29 hours. The wife told her husband that if he wanted to take the Tesla next time then she would take her car instead.

She did the run in 19 hours in her Fiat 500.

The issue with electric cars is that the range is quoted at a low speed. Given that drag increases with the square of speed, the range penalty of going faster is high. That’s why I don’t care that a Tesla will keep up with me from 0-100kph. It’s because I know that from 100-160kph I will leave him for dust ...

 

You speak as if the range issue is specific to electric vehicles only. It's not. Any vehicle, gas or electric, is exposed to a "range penalty" when driving at higher speeds. Drag is drag. More power to the wheels equals more energy wasted, electric or gas.

Range is not a problem for a daily driver. My commute is 30 miles each way. (60 miles per day). The MX is rated for 270 miles of range - but actual range is more like 200-220 being that I drive it the same way I drive all of my cars, I don't baby it for drive slower because it's electric. I really only have to charge once a week if i'm just commuting.

And come on - you drive at 100-160kph all the time? Most of us spend our time between 0 and 120kph.

You guys on the fence about electric should really consider owning a new(ish) Tesla. Look - I was a huge skeptic - and I'm on both sides of the aisle - hell I have a 488 Pista in the garage and just a bought a new 911 (992). And as amazing as those cars are, I will continue to say it - electric is the future.

 

You make some valid points - and infrastructure is a key one at that - however I completely disagree with the notion that electric is simply a novelty and that it is not the future. Some of you guys sound like the guys back in the 56k modem days - "oh people will never have high speed internet, too much infrastructure, fiber cabling, demand, etc).

But like those guys back in the day eating their words today, the Internet revolution proved it was here to stay and solutions were developed to push us past 56k. And now into 5G.

In a similar vein, solutions for the required charging infrastructure as well as power requirements will be developed. Solar will be more widely used and will improve faster than it has in the past. Other problems will be solved with time, and the more people who purchase EVs will only accelerate the progress, similar to the way gas powered cars accelerated the development of gas stations and delivery services in the 1900s.

Look I'm not a tree hugger, I'm not an environmental activist - although I do like the concept of zero emissions. (and yes, I'm aware that the electric power I likely charged with may have burned some fossil fuel). The power generated by these electric motors is just intoxicating and addicting- so much so that driving anything else now just feels old to me. And I have to believe that if they are that good now - and I truly believe they are THAT good - they will be 20 times better in a few years. The future is coming, like it or not, and it's electric.

 

Hell yes. I live in a country where you can speed without losing your license (unless you go more than 50 over the limit). And just over the border, I have access to highways with no speed limits

You’re quite correct and for short journeys it doesn’t matter. But the point that MDEL and I are making is that outside the confines of a short journey, the range penalty of driving faster really weighs on electric in a way that it doesn’t on ICE. That’s because the speed versus range tradeoff on electric becomes the difference between a 40minute recharge stop or not. For me in my ICE car, the penalty is a 5 minute refuel stop.

 

I just checked on some real world driving experiences of Model S drivers (there are a lot of them in the Netherlands) and they are reporting only 200km of range (125miles) when driven at European highway speeds of 160kph.

At that speed in the FF, I can get close to 500km on a tank. In order to avoid running out of juice, the Tesla will probably stop every 150-175km and I will stop every 400km (I don’t like to let the tank get too low). So the Tesla is stopping two times with a 40minute charge each time before I have to even stop once for 5 minutes.

On a 400km journey at 160kph, I am at my destination in 2.5hours.

The Tesla driver has taken 3h50m to do the same journey. Despite driving at 160kph, his actual average speed to complete the journey is 104kph and his journey time is 53% greater. This is why electric still has a lot of hurdles to overcome.

And for those who say - ‘but electric is fine for short journeys’ - please remember that many people can’t afford more than one car so the one they buy needs to be capable of short as well as long journeys.

 

Very well explained with examples that anyone can understand. Thanks!

Very well explained with examples that anyone can understand. Thanks!

 

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For real? I often do (much) more than 120 kph in my city runabout on suburban roads...

 

I remember when I got a 300 baud modem and thought that was blazing fast!

I think EV has some huge advantages for daily transport. But its not for everyone, at least not right now.

 

I concur with those whom say you get real world range issues in the Tesla on longer roadtrips.
Yes, in the US most people drive at 65-75 mph going along the I10 or 101 for hours. I know, I spent months there - it's a completely different driving culture.
Here it's a bit different. Going through Europe on the E45 or the like, yes the speed limit is mostly 110-130. But it does not change the fact that 150-160 is very common for the long journeys, and when oportunity knocks, it gets way past that. You should try cruising a Tesla P100D at 200-220 kph in Germany. Not even sure you get 160 km on a charge, let alone 160 miles. Once you get above 145-150 kph, range drops faster than the mood of a teenager whom was told "no".
Does it work for city driving and journeys where speeds are slow? Yes it does. Does it work for a long journey where speeds regularly exceed 145-150 kph? Not really.

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I don't believe it will be the future, just an interim solution and ultimately will proof to e a very expensive one, especially for nature! I believe the future will be hydro, using the same gas-stations everywhere in place! It just needs some more time to be properly developed.

 

Maye it would be good to study a bit how the batteries are built, what is needed, how long they last and what to do with them afterwards! That changed my view!

 

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I think I threw up in my mouth a little....

low profile tires are useless on an SUV unless it's never going to go anywhere but nice roads... in which case a lower entire car like a gtc4 works. skiing? don't need a jeep.

I like the lambo hurican rally car mock up. that's the direction it would be fun to take the soccer mom sports car.

your skill in that mock up is amazing! I do not want my personal comments to detract from or insult that!!!

 

that car lifted as a rally car with smaller wheels but fatter tires might be great. a Ferrari stratos?

 

Late to the Tesla party but I’ll add my piece. Our Tesla X is a blast around town and commuting but it would never suffice for an only car. Range and charge time is an issue and it only gets half the range in the winter unless you are a person who likes to drive with a parka on. No way I would take a trip in it by choice.

And no way is it “green”. I don’t want to know how many Chinese child laborers died mining for that battery. And what happens when it is done? I’m looking for a “Powered by Natural Gas” sticker time put on the windows...

I do love it around town though. Charge once or twice per week in the garage.


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