Deferred Maintenance ... catches up.

Ouch... that's real bad!

 

I'd say that is more a matter of poor maintenance then deferred maintenance. Old hoses may get hard and crack, etc, but those kind of deposits on the manifold and in the hose would seem to indicate the use of the wrong coolant and /or tap water in the cooling system. I'd be suspicious the internals of the engine. As I have said many tomes, I've owned my 308 for 35 years and I've never seen anything like that. But I do use the proper fluids, etc. So many of these cars are abused by owners who shouldn't one them because they don;t have a clue.

 

Coolant NEEDS to be changed every 3 or 5 years , depending on the coolant type.

The anticorrsion additives deplete even if just sitting in a garage, and aluminum corrodes a lot faster than iron motors given the opportunity and right conditions.

Doug

 

How did that happen if it wasn't poor coolant maintenance?

 

Wow that's bad! Never seen anything as far gone as that. Tough one will be to bring the alloy back - even if its possible at all.

Good luck!
Mark

 

it happens ONLY when the coolant is too old, as it becomes very corrosive: it MUST be changed and don't let it become 15 years old. It can eat the block too.

ciao

EDIT
This is why I always laughed when during the inspections I did for buying a 3x8 many tell me "I change the timing belts every three years" and when I ask them "what about the coolant" often they don't know what to answer...

 

Like I said, I don't get it. Here is the same hose from my car; replace in 2010 after 25 years, for other reasons. If it didn't have to be removed, it wouldn't have been replaced.

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I agree more to this than just neglecting to refresh coolant. Must have had a leak of some sort (maybe a bad cap) and somebody just kept topping it off with the garden hose. Probably had some pretty bad water too.

 

Wow, this looks bad.
Coolant staying in the block for long periods of time will undergo stratification of the chemicals. The chemicals will move down lower in the block and the upper regions of the coolant will have more oxygen at the top and start corroding the upper areas. (Aluminum alloy head plugs, cast aluminum coolant components) In the past, I purchased a Dino 246 which sat for over 20 years. I had to replace all head coolant plugs, cast alloy coolant manifolds, and recored the radiator. I ended up rebuilding the motor. They should have drained the coolant for long storage. Also, the older type hoses with coolant kept in the engine for a long time will form cracks in the interior side of the hoses due to an electrolysis attack of the rubber. Take your older hose, shine light inside of it while bending, you will see the fine cracks inside. The newer hoses are designed to prevent this.

 

Image Unavailable, Please Login I see this all the time. This is what it looks like after you take off the intake.

 

I read all this anecdotal evidence of hose problems on FChat. Here is another coolant hose off my car after 25 years, in 2010. It's still soft and flexible, no cracks on the out side, no cracks on the inside. The car had 27k miles on it at the time, and this piece of hose has been sitting in a box in the garage for another 10 years. I can show you 1/2 a dozen other pieces of hose that are similar. Quite frankly, in my 60 years of fooling with cars, and cars that I generally own for long periods, 69 Z28 Camaro sold in 82, 76 Camaro sold in 93, 96 BMW 328 wrecked in 2014, 2002 Toyota truck (160k miles) still owned.... I have never once replaced a coolant hose except those on the 308 which were replaced by my tech during service for another, unrelated issue. Never replaced a radiator either. My 308 still has the original and has never had a cooling problem other than a failed expansion tank cap. I just don't get it. I'll stick with if it ain't broke, don't fix it.


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Thermal-Oxidative Degradation of Rubber. Most elastomers will undergo significant changes over time when exposed to heat, light, or oxygen (ozone). ... Hardening is much more common because free radicals produced when rubber is exposed to heat, oxygen and/or light rapidly combine and in this process form new crosslinks
This is why I replace all rubber items even if they look ok. Timing belts, cooling hoses, tires, brake lines etc.

 

One source of non-anecdotal info: https://www.brandfonhonda.com/potential-hose-failure-branford-ct.htm

Another source: Went to a local NAPA store to get hoses. They have the info about electrochemical cracks forming in hoses at their order desk with photos.

I drive my 308 every weekend to reach normal operating temperatures and open the heater valve. I will be changing my coolant every 4 years. I replaced my hoses with new in 2018 and vacuum filled with Shell Rotella ELC.

Either way, each person will operate their Ferrari as they feel is best.

 

Hoses are like tires, you don't wait for them to "break" before replacing them.

 

I'd venture to say that water pumps and expansion tank caps fail more often than coolant hoses.

 

That's a hard ugly hose too. There are many people look good on outside and then die because something went bad on the inside.

 

Yup! I've seen perfect really old tires people put car up on blocks. Then put car into service and rubber cracks off to the cords! A tire shop will not mount a perfectly new unmounted tire if the date code is 5+ years.

 

M,

Lots of dissimilar metals on these cars too! They can be an electrolysis nightmare. Interestingly the block metallurgy is quite robust. I remember rebuilding an NSX motor and every stud hole had to be timeserted because the studs came out with black corrosion such that a new stud wasn't going to do it.

 

Well, now you got me going FBB. I can only guess you're looking for some entertainment.

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Yep, day b hard as a rock. So hard and brittle you can squeeze it is a vise, inside out and.... Oh wait, where are the cracks, electrochemical or otherwise? And dam, that fold is right on the seam too! No drips, no runs, no errors. Maybe the cracks are on the order of the Plank length?

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Sure, Gate's will tell you about electrochemical cracks. Where are they? It's called marketing. Just like replace your (serpentine and V) belts every 3 years. Same with NAPA. Show me a picture of a worst case scenario, tell me a worst case story, offer me a glass of coolaid.

"Engineers emphasize that it's not uncommon to find premature hose failures due to electrochemical damage in vehicles driven less than 25,000 miles."

Not uncommon? Give me some numbers. What are the odds, 1 in 10, 1 in 1000, 1 in 1,000,000? Seriously? May I suggest that miles isn't the issue, maybe time is? How many of you have had your cars (daily drivers) serviced and the dealer or service station tech said, "Boy, you got 25,000 miles on your car. Better change the coolant hoses." Let me guess, never? How many millions of cars there on the roads with more that 25,000 miles? How often do you see a vehicle pulled over with steam pouring out from under the hood, or a path of coolant on the road to it's stopping point? Now one guy will chime in, right on cue, "It happened to me, once!" and the Ferrari Chat bad witch will scream, "It happen once, it will happen to all, (laughing maniacally)."

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Sure, if you have to remove a hose to service something else, replace it, but performing a "hose service"? Is this the new normal? Oil service. Fluids service. Major service. Belt service. Hose service?

Hell, even my Porsche maintenance schedule only says check, not replace, the belts at 4 years, 40,000 miles. Nothing in there about hoses, coolant or otherwise.

If you go down the list of things you could change because they "might fail" and cause a problem, coolant hoses are pretty far down on the list.

(Always fun to play bad cop. A little entertainment for the Covid crowd.)

 

LOL! Days of the future past.

 

For some a "major" service is a belt change.