Renault finally protests Racing Point | Page 8 | FerrariChat

Renault finally protests Racing Point

Discussion in 'F1' started by jgonzalesm6, Jul 12, 2020.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. Ferrari 308 GTB

    Ferrari 308 GTB F1 Veteran

    Feb 21, 2015
    7,716
    Tropical
    Isn't it the rear ones that have caused the issue?
     
  2. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,527
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    Yes....I stand corrected....thanks.
     
  3. Top speed

    Top speed Formula Junior

    Jul 4, 2020
    753
    Full Name:
    Joonas
    The FIA documents say that Mercedes delivered designs and all paper work to RP for those brake ducts. Are they still gonna stick to their childish lie about designing their own parts based on photos.
     
    stavura, fil, 375+ and 2 others like this.
  4. WPOZZZ

    WPOZZZ F1 Veteran

    Aug 22, 2012
    6,477
    Honolulu, HI
    400k is walking around money in F1.
     
  5. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,527
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    #180 jgonzalesm6, Aug 7, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2020
    Well, technically speaking Racing Point did'nt lie because look at the statement " We designed our car from photos of the W10".

    There's a grey area to that statement. It's a general statement instead of being specific.
     
  6. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,527
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    Here's a better summary of why Racing Point didn't get disqualified, but I also think a dangerous precedent might have been set that will be challenged by other teams. RP believed it was compliant, but a competitive advantage has been gained that can be used all season.


    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  7. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2006
    25,447
    So they can finish this season with "illegal" parts, is that right?
    That would make this decision even more dodgy, IMO.
     
  8. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,527
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    Yep

    Read above post #181.
     
    william likes this.
  9. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 12, 2004
    5,222
    Montreal
    In fact, tRacing Point had actual brake ducts purchased from Merc last year as noted by Andy Green in this earlier Autosport story. I don’t understand if they reused those again this year or updated them. Were they 2018 or 2019 design? Probably 2019 as they were not listed parts last year, so basically they didn’t need to “copy” last year’s design for the brake ducts as they already had them in hand.

    https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/150990/racing-point-brake-duct-hearing-set-for-next-week

    So Tombazis and FIA gave the all-clear without proper understanding of their own rules. I guess they were too busy helping Merc make a case for their DAS.

    Hopefully RBR protest Merc again with other stewards following the outcome of this protest.
     
    fil, Flavio_C and jgonzalesm6 like this.
  10. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2006
    25,447
    What about this time ?
     
  11. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 12, 2004
    5,222
    Montreal
    Furthermore, Renault should demand that the tRP bodywork and floor get scanned and compare this to the 3D surface data of the Merc from last year. If the results show profile variations within .020 to .030, this would confirm that the surfaces were provided to tRP and not “copied” from pictures.
     
    fil, DF1, 375+ and 1 other person like this.
  12. sp1der

    sp1der F1 Rookie

    Jan 10, 2009
    3,005
    UK
    Full Name:
    Simon Ashley
    So Merc again flout the rules and no punishment?
     
    stavura, fil, 375+ and 1 other person like this.
  13. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2006
    25,447

    That was legal in 2019 (for the brake ducts).
     
  14. Top speed

    Top speed Formula Junior

    Jul 4, 2020
    753
    Full Name:
    Joonas
    Yes, I know it was legal then. Was just pointing out how RP's claim about making everything based on photos was a lie; well I'm sure Mercedes gave photos to go with those designs. They tried to hide the direct Merc connection, probably fearing what eventually transpired anyway (a protest and a punishment).
     
    fil and ingegnere like this.
  15. Flavio_C

    Flavio_C Formula 3
    BANNED

    Sep 7, 2012
    2,445
    Insubria
    It's an absurd. Williams, Haas, Sauber, etc., invest a ton of money in development with the hope to conquer championship points that will help them increase their share on the F1 money cake. Pink Mercedes is LITERALLY stealing this money from them.
     
  16. pilotoCS

    pilotoCS F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    May 19, 2019
    12,530
    The Capital of The United States of America
    Full Name:
    Willis
    It's amazing how quickly all of us have become experts on brake ducts. Quack . . . . .
     
  17. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 12, 2004
    5,222
    Montreal
    Nobody here claiming to be expert, just trying to understand how a team can copy another team’s car so exactly without the cooperation of the owner of the original design. Since this is difficult to prove and Renault (who ARE experts on brake ducts) protested specifically the brake ducts, we’re all looking to the outcome of the protest as confirmation of our suspicions.
     
    fil, Flavio_C and crinoid like this.
  18. Top speed

    Top speed Formula Junior

    Jul 4, 2020
    753
    Full Name:
    Joonas
    fil, ingegnere and crinoid like this.
  19. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Oct 3, 2002
    48,581
    @ the wheel
    Full Name:
    Andreas
    As expected they did not dock points from the drivers.

    And RP is capable of getting the 15 points back over Renault in the coming races. They might even go for Ferrari, we'll see.

    And RP has the option to go against the ruling but hopefully we can bury this topic now once and for all.
     
    william likes this.
  20. jgonzalesm6

    jgonzalesm6 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Oct 31, 2016
    20,527
    Corpus Christi, Tx.
    Full Name:
    Joe R Gonzales
    The FIA have plans to thwart this "copying" to go into effect in 2021.

    There are parts on an F1 car that are LISTED and other parts that are NOT LISTED.
     
    Flavio_C likes this.
  21. Flavio_C

    Flavio_C Formula 3
    BANNED

    Sep 7, 2012
    2,445
    Insubria
     
    ingegnere and Top speed like this.
  22. DeSoto

    DeSoto F1 Veteran

    Nov 26, 2003
    7,481
    Look, guys, I hate to miss a chance of trashing Toto, but I don´t think there is really a case about the ducts: they didn´t need that Mercedes told them how they are because they already had them. I´d even say that the penalty was harsh.

    For me the issue are not the ducts but the rest of the car. If I remove my tin foil hat for a moment, I´ll be tempted to say that all this was an arrangement: "hey, Cyril, please, don´t protest the car, just protest a single part and we´ll delete some points to put them behind you".
     
  23. Flavio_C

    Flavio_C Formula 3
    BANNED

    Sep 7, 2012
    2,445
    Insubria
    Toto Wolff: "the other teams have to get on with it, Racing Point did a better job than them".
     
  24. Top speed

    Top speed Formula Junior

    Jul 4, 2020
    753
    Full Name:
    Joonas
    Saw that interview, what an arrogant piece of sh*t. I'm sure his comments have nothing to do with his shares on Aston Martin. The guy is trying to get stranglehold on the whole F1, he thinks it should be his rules everyone plays by.
     
    stavura, Bas, fil and 4 others like this.
  25. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 12, 2004
    5,222
    Montreal
    Renault considering appeal over Racing Point F1 brake duct penalty

    https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/151153/renault-considering-appeal-over-racing-point-penalty

    "Just to put things in perspective any team will be spending 20% of its aerodynamic time into developing those parts. It's not small parts."

    Abiteboul stressed that there was also a bigger picture to consider of the wider subject of copying, and he said Renault welcomed today's pledge by the FIA's head of single-seater technical matters Nikolas Tombazis to maintain tighter controls in the future.

    "I think we need to recognise that what Racing Point has done, based on a car that has such an advantage against anyone else on the grid, has been a shock in the system, and has been a disruption," Abiteboul said.

    "We need to see how we deal with it. Yes, copying has been part of the story of F1. But technology has evolved so much, that it's now possible to do things that were not possible to do before.

    "The regulatory framework needs to evolve with the technologies that allow you to do some stuff that were not possible before with a level of accuracy that was not possible before.


    "And we've been pleased with the statement from Nikolas Tombazis this morning, in parallel to the stewards, about his willingness to tackle that matter and to tackle it strongly. But we need to understand exactly what was behind that statement."
     

Share This Page