If you re exited by hybrid, yes ! Seriously, there is nothing more exiting to come, exept one car and Icona
I agree with you I am not saying i am excited by future models not really in fact i just wanted to share some thoughts about the future and future strategy. The model I’m really excited about right now is the VS ( provided it remains a pure na) The 812 is prob one of ( if not the) last pure masterpiece. Future models sure will be more powerful, hybrid but not really what i’m excited about. These will be super expensive and will turn the 812 into a bargain sooner than we think
Very true but the volume here is going to be lower. My car was the first delivered in the us and as a 2021 model. Honestly, I could really care less but will be interesting to see. But it’s a very fair point you make
While it does seem like the future will involve some kind of hybrid system or other assistance, and therefore is not as naturally exciting as the allure of a NA V12 to many of us (myself included) lets not forget the recent lesson of the 812 GTS. Many worried about the dreaded GPF. It must ruin the sound right? And it must ruin the experience. Well, on the evidence of several actual owners here, the GTS sounds great and is involving to drive- so the experience was not ruined one bit! Ferrari managed to get around it and deliver a car that we will love to drive and own. So while there are challenges and things about which to be concerned, we shouldn’t forget that Ferrari is a master of getting around these challenges and they always delight us. I can remember a time when everyone cried about no more stick shifts. Do most of us have this conversation anymore? No. If you want a stick shift Ferrari, there are many available. As pertains to the GTS, it seems to me they will be in production roughly a similar time to SF, maybe even a little longer, so it is possible there will be the same number, even more than SF. SF could be looked upon in the future as a relative bargain, but its impossible to know the future. So we have to just enjoy the present and try to make our best plans for tomorrow. FORZA FERRARI!!!! Sent from my iPad using FerrariChat
I agree with some of what you said...but the 812 GTS production has been limited to 2 years as confirmed by the factory and multiple dealers. I think they are aiming to produce less.
It's more than sound, which is changed, it is long term engine performance with all that added backpressure (which is poison to the engine), it is potential replacement costs when one fails (based on F8 pricing, should be around $7000 per GPF/4way-catalyst) in the 812 and you have to replace both if you replace one otherwise one side of the engine will be working much harder than the other because it is emissions related, it should, in the USA, include 8 year warranty... and don't forget that Leiters directly stated they were able to overcome the horsepower loss, but barely, so the engine is more strained https://www.topgear.com/car-news/supercars/ferrari-says-it-will-fight-save-v12-extinction: That particulate filter was a particular issue for Leiters and his team, as it meant power was originally down on the hard-top 812. He regards the engineering work to replace that power as his proudest achievement with the GTS. and for long-term owners all of that matters in addition to the sound...
Ok Valkyrie and T50 are two game changers. Not in the same league either. Ferrari should be brave on this one !
Fully agree. I know for a fact that Kline and Novitec are currently developing GPF-delete options for the 812 SF and GTS. Given that there are various sensors involved I think it's not as simple as for a cat replacement, but I'm confident something should pop up soon. And in due course, any model which has GPF fitted will have people who want it removed, so a solution will be developed...
Has anyone been able to confirm how much weight is added by inclusion of GPF, both in terms of the GPF itself but also extra heat shielding necessary?
Only "solutions" that "pretend" to work are those that plug into the OBD2 port and block the codes to the ECU so it does not produce CELs...not a viable long-term strategy, plus will likely negate warranty if discovered...and I presume Ferrari will create an update to trap this (for instance, if GPF does not produce an "I'm present" signal every so-often, throw code...) you might take a look here for failed attempt by a major after-market exhaust company... https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/posts/147379125/
not that I know of, but an estimate would be 50kg total additional weight, remember the general guideline is GPF devices must displace as much volume as the engine's displacement, so, they will be large (3.2L each)
I think it will be very difficult to do a GPF delete, plus it will void warranty. Worse than that, the car will not be road legal anymore. I don’t think you can underestimate the EU’s determination to ensure that if a car is fitted with a GPF to reach emissions, it stays that way. One of the brands I work with has already had a number of customers’ cars checked, with issues found. These have to be rectified. So the manufacturer will be pretty unhappy if it turns out they are modified. If it keeps happening, the manufacturer is forced to fix it and other sanctions can apply, I believe even a ‘stop sale’ order is possible. The only way around would be to put it back to stock before VOSA (in the UK, other bodies in other EU states) test the car. That will be expensive and the manufacturer is not notified before the test, it would rely on the customer, who won’t bother.
Totally agree. In fact, at the GTS launch last summer, one of the Ferrari tech people at the presentation spoke about how, in the post emissions-scandal world, the regulators are looking to the manufacturers ensure that these devices are not easily defeated by a third-party (e.g by deletion). There are guys in Germany who will sell kits that suppress warning lights by sending codes through the OBD ports, but that activity gets registered in the system memory as evidence of tampering.
did they retain the mechanical lifters like the tdF motor or did they use hydraulic lifters like the 812 motor has???
They taped over the exit vents on top of the fenders but kept the intake openings behind the windows. Therefore, they had to exhaust the air and that's what the funky vents are for around the quad exhaust tips. This feature may not be in the released version especially if the top vents return in some form.
Based on the reviews of the 812 GTS by owners like yourself (thank you again for sharing) as well as the reviews of the new Roma, the GPF is pretty much a non-event for front engined Ferraris. This is even less of a shift than going from carbs to injectors. The mid-engined cars seem to be having a much larger impact of the GPF but that again is at low and part throttle applications and I am sure Ferrari will find a way around this over time. Even though there has been liberal world is ending scenario exercise done over GPF on Ferrarichat, I personally am not bothered much about it, especially for the 812 special edition.
The reason the mid engined cars have a larger impact from GPF has nothing to do with the engine layout - its the turbos. If you combine turbo and GPF you get crap sound a la F8 Tributo. I agree GPF is likely not a big issue for the 812 special edition, unless it has turbos. What might be a bigger issue from a sound standpoint is the incoming strict EU noise limits (which the GTS seems to have dodged). As per GPF it’s likely these would apply to the whole production; not only certain countries
Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Photos by: Lego and Supercars HD: 1. https://ag-spots-2020.o.auroraobjects.eu/2020/08/12/ferrari-812-gto-mule-c406212082020084425_3.jpg 2. https://ag-spots-2020.o.auroraobjects.eu/2020/08/12/ferrari-812-gto-mule-c406212082020084425_1.jpg 3. https://ag-spots-2020.o.auroraobjects.eu/2020/08/12/ferrari-812-gto-mule-c406212082020084425_8.jpg
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I wonder if they are using the 812 as a test mule...? If not, looks VERY similar to the 812 SF, except for some ugly additions to rear diffuser and a slightly reshaped front bumper...