430 - BRAKE light intermittent flashing at WOT | FerrariChat

430 BRAKE light intermittent flashing at WOT

Discussion in '360/430' started by VAF84, Dec 27, 2020.

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  1. VAF84

    VAF84 Formula 3

    I did a little searching on my issue, and have already checked the brake fluid based on a similar thread. It's nice and full, and also was recently flushed at Ferrari of Austin.

    The last two times I went to stretch out the car and get the fluids flowing (also don't want the ECU to adapt to granny driving :D)I had the red BRAKE light briefly flicker, typically towards the top half of third, before shifting to fourth (F1) at 90% throttle in sport mode. This is very recent. Doesn't flicker at all during normal driving, in fact come to think of it, the light didn't flicker in any other situation except straight line launches. The hand brake was all the way down. Checked a few times to make sure. The car otherwise drives as normal, doesn't feel like the brake is catching or anything like that.

    Anyone have experience with this? FOA told me at the post track day inspection that brakes were still good, but getting low. Haven't driven it much since. Will worn out pads trigger the light?
     
  2. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Typically, Ferrari brake lights will illuminate for low pad material (front, with rear optional) and low brake fluid. (!) or BRAKE.

    The Park Brake has a different symbol. (P) or PARK
     
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  3. VAF84

    VAF84 Formula 3

    Thanks Ian, that's reassuring, and in line with the most likely scenario. Looks like brakes are next on my to do list.
     
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  4. 24000rpm

    24000rpm F1 Rookie

    your car is a stick right? If so, it is because your brake fluid leaked so much that your brake fluid level sensor is giving a warning.
     
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  5. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Already eliminated as a cause....

     
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  6. 24000rpm

    24000rpm F1 Rookie

    would you elaborate on how that was eliminated? What was tested or done?

     
  7. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    You seemed to be suggesting that low brake fluid level was causing the brake warning light. Since the brake fluid level was visually checked ok, it can't be the level of the brake fluid causing the problem.

    It could, however, be a faulty brake fluid level sensor or sensor wiring (short to earth). I assume Ferrari designed their (float?) sensors to make reliable measurements under high accelerative forces i.e. the fluid doesn't shift to one part of the reservoir activating the switch. I wonder if the system has a timer to prevent momentary low levels trigging the light?

    Since the indications are intermittent, it's going to be difficult to faultfind. Perhaps for a short test period, you could remove the plug on the fluid level sensor to see if you still get the fault light under hard acceleration?
     
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  8. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Another line of thought. On 360's is the brake pad wear indication normally only triggered when the brakes are applied?
     
  9. 24000rpm

    24000rpm F1 Rookie

    Yes, just like you described, it could. When the car is under acceleration, the surface of the brake fluid will change from flat to a slope. The edge of the slope, while well above the sensor when the car is under no acceleration, could fall lower than the sensor when under acceleration, ergo the light. Not saying that your car is this case, but it is a possibility that I've encountered twice in my stick 360.

    No, it doesn't have a timer, so each momentary low fluid level will result in a flicker of the brake warning.

    I think the test you can do is to fill up the brake fluid to such a point that is over what the wsm recommended. If you still get a brake light, that means what I described isn't your case.

     
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  10. 24000rpm

    24000rpm F1 Rookie

    #10 24000rpm, Dec 29, 2020
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2020
    On my 360 , I've a test about a year ago that I cut all the brake pad wires to the ecu. The brake warning will not show in my test.

    also on my 360, also a few years ago, I was doing some track time, in which I totally destroyed my pads, worn to about 1mm or less left and all of the brake pads are cracked , too. There's also no brake warning light in the dash. Just my personal observation. I was surprised, too, at the moment, that there's no warning.
     
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  11. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Good to know. This is the same on the 355. Disconnecting the brake pad wiring removes any chance of the warning light circuit receiving an earth via the pad sensors. If no luck disconnecting the plug on the fluid level sensor, disconnect the brake pad wires one at a time.
     
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  12. VAF84

    VAF84 Formula 3

    It's the F1 transmission.

    Once I get some more time to do some other tests I'll update. It's already back in it's car jacket; but I try to schedule a run every two weeks. Thanks for the tips!
     
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  13. Qavion

    Qavion F1 World Champ
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    Perhaps broken pads also break the sense wires. Were the pads OEM? (Did they have wear sensors?)
     
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  14. 24000rpm

    24000rpm F1 Rookie

    yes, OEM. hmmm.... didn't remember if I broke the sensor

     
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  15. BrettC

    BrettC Formula 3

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    pad sensors are close enough to worn that vibration is causing a wire to hit ground. Mine used to do that and now they don't. I cut them off. Ha! With after market pads they also can get loose causing the same issue. drove me nuts having that light flash so I took them off.
     
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  16. VAF84

    VAF84 Formula 3

    Resurrecting the thread here as I missed the last three responses.

    The tech looking at it needs more time to resolve, but more than likely I will do a pad replacement. @BrettC comment makes a lot of sense. Ferrari of Austin told me my pads were getting low and needed replacement soon (not right away). The other place I took it to says there’s still life left. However, it may be that the OEM pads have a higher safety threshold, in the sense that they will flag a warning with more wear remaining than others might. In other words, not allowing you to get dangerously low on brake pad. My next step will be having someone replace the pads once I get situated at my next location.
     

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