The Official Latifi Thread | Page 5 | FerrariChat

The Official Latifi Thread

Discussion in 'F1' started by Nuvolari, Jul 3, 2020.

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  1. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jun 3, 2006
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    Why not?

    If you can't stick by what you say, you shouldn't say it in the first place !
     
  2. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

    Mar 24, 2008
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    You really take this place far too serious.

    About time I'm putting your incoherent nonsensical ramblings on ignore.
     
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  3. sammysaber

    sammysaber Formula Junior

    Dec 21, 2011
    553
    Hang on. Are we saying we shouldn't discuss Latifi because he's not on this forum ?

    Best,
    Sammy
     
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  4. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

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    Ok William, next time do you want it in percentages so you can comprehend it better?
     
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  5. I don't know......are you?......and whoever else?

    I know I've never even implied, let alone said, anything about not discussing Nicholas.

    The closest I've come is calling this kind of thread silly. I don't knock actors I don't prefer, singers I don't prefer, race drivers I don't prefer.....any performers I don't prefer, period. I just ignore them and proceed with the entertainment. I was raised with, and agree with, the notion that it's better to say nothing if there's nothing good to be said.....;)
     
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  6. Metastable

    Metastable Formula Junior

    Allen Berg was also from BC.
     
  7. simpen

    simpen Formula Junior

    Jun 14, 2016
    291
    Ah, the classic strawman argument. You claim he is utterly useless, people rightly point to the fact that bringing in money to stop a team from going bankrupt is a plus in modern F1 (surprise surprise) & you turn it around by saying that means he is a good F1 driver. See the flaw in logic there?

    PS: The more you put people that disagree with you on mute, the more it sounds like an echo chamber ;) But I am probably taking thing too literal, right?
     
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  8. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

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    Since we are discussing Latifi the driver, I'm still waiting for someone to proof me wrong. All I see is people saying he's not useless because he brings money.

    I don't actually have that many people on mute. No more than a handful.

    This is a topic about Latifi, Statistically speaking the least successful driver in F1. The only positive he brings that people can talk about, is that he brings money. Yet some of you are now moaning that it's being pointed out that he's not all that bueno?
     
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  9. 375+

    375+ F1 World Champ
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    Dec 28, 2005
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    Michael Latifi owns approximately 10% of Mclaren International, does he not?
     
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  10. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    He is driving the least performing car on the grid at the moment.

    Even a talented driver like Russell can't do nothing with a Williams, and we have seen what he can achieve in a good car..

    Latifi has absolutely no chance to learn, improve or perform whilst he is driving such a bad car.
     
  11. Mitch Alsup

    Mitch Alsup F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    9,252
    I believe that last sentance should read:: "If you think Latifi is a good F1 driver, present your evidence !"
     
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  12. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    While I agree that the Williams is a bad car incapable of delivering any good results, Latifi has not shown any flashes of brilliance in the season. No exceptional passes, lots of spins especially in practice, a washout qualifying record, etc. Russell on the other hand has done some exceptional things (especially in qualifying) even if he never scored a point in a Williams. He appears to be one of those drivers who is just 'there' and a few years from now we will hear his name and say 'he was in F1?'
     
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  13. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Possibly.
    Many drivers have gone through F1 and shown no brillance whatsoever.
    As far as I know, Latifi has always been inside the 107% lap time, and caused not accident.
    Russell is on a different level, I agree.
     
  14. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    There is no doubt that Latifi has earned the necessary points to have a Superlicense and has managed performances that are within the allowed rules (ie. 107% qualifying) so he is 'within the rules' at the 'Grand Prix' level. Equally he has not been at the center of controversy or the cause of accidents. He just seems to be there doing his thing and not really bothering anyone in the process.
     
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  15. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    Some great historical information! While Jacques Sr. never had the fame of his brother he was a fast and wild racing driver that did quite well in North America. Here are some cool historical videos of him in lesser known machinery. The 80's and early 90's were a booming time for Motorsports in Canada. There were a number of well organized championships with good prize money and TV to sell to sponsors. The costs were not huge so there are some very good drivers to come from nothing and make a name for themselves in the sport on their talent. As soon as the big tobacco money went away those series died overnight and have never returned.

    Here is a clip from the Rothmans Porsche Turbo Cup where JV Sr. wins. The track is Mount Tremblant which is currently owned by Laurance Stroll. Scott Goodyear also features in this race with an EPIC drive from the back to end on the podium.



    Now for a Can-Am race from 1983 at my local track Mosport. Fast and dangerous this is a phenomenal place to race and still is a driver favorite. Ignore the video length as the real footage is only about 25 minutes



    Lastly we cannot forget Gilles' son Jacques who did very well in Formula Atlantic before going on to Indycar and later F1 stardom. Here is a video of his 1993 F-Atlantic win in Montreal. While it is popular belief that he was always going to get the Indycar ride ahead of Claude Bourbonais this is far from true. The final decision was made by Players who was sponsoring the team and the decision was made by two executives. A few years back I spent a weekend with one of those two guys and over dinner he told me at length and detail how involved the decision was. It was by no means a foregone conclusion and in the end the decision was down to 'almost' the flip of a coin. In this video you will also see another lost Canadian talent David Empringham. He came closer than you can ever imagine to an Indycar drive after a stellar junior career. No family money and just never got that final break. He is widely regarded (among those who know) as one of the great 'what if's' in Canadian Motorsport. He would go on to win the 24 Hours of Daytona a decade later. I see him now and then and always have a look at the watch :)

     
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  16. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
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    Great stuff, thanks.

    Love those Can-Am cars. I always said that’s what F1 should be: open cockpit but full bodywork—good for brand distinction and safer. And looks great!

    Hard to believe but nevertheless impressive that Canada was able to support a series like Rothmans Porsche and the quality of the drivers that competed in it. Like you said the racing tradition in Canada then was at its peak then.

    The quality of Canadian drivers was very high. Richard Spenard, who is mentioned in the first video and was Gilles’ teammate in F-Atlantic was quite a talent also. I met him at Jim Russell and a couple of times at Miami Homestead when he was driver coach for the Player’s CART team and can say was a really great guy. In terms of talent, I remember when he stepped into a one-off Trans-Am drive one year at Trois-Rivières and proceeded to blow away the field.

    And, yes, Empringham beat both Villeneuve and Bourbonnais to the F-Atlantic championship.
     
  17. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    +1000

    Me too !
    I think that keeping the open wheel format in F1 is an anachronysm.
    It's also the reason why so much money spent on aero to fight the unwanted turbulences caused by open wheels.
     
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  18. Bas

    Bas Four Time F1 World Champ

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    Excellent point and I should've!

    Exactly right. I get the same with that Will Stevens guy (who deserves an award for most anonymous F1 driver who did a full season in F1 since 1990, surely).
     
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  19. Nuvolari

    Nuvolari F1 Veteran
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    Wow Will Stevens is an anonymous one. I had to look him up to refresh my memory and the most impressive stat is that he is not even 30 years old.
     
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  20. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

    Jun 5, 2009
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    mathieu Jeantet
    Latifi is a sort of Bruno Giacomelli.
    The main difference is family wealth. There will always have been pilots in this sport who are there to make the number.
     
  21. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
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    Not sure why you picked Giacomelli for comparison but I don’t think it’s appropriate. “Jack O’Malley” wasn’t backed by family money and he won an F3 championship, the Monaco F3 race and the F2 championship. And in only his second season, not 4th or 5th season. He didn’t have the best cars in F1 but almost won at least one race if not for some bad luck.
     
  22. jpalmito

    jpalmito F1 Veteran

    Jun 5, 2009
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    Agree.
    I was a little bit too harsh with "panda".
    A sympathic driver.
     
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  23. ingegnere

    ingegnere F1 Veteran
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    Sep 12, 2004
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    :)
    I think we should wrap up the Latifi discussion and talk about Can-Am cars and Canadian racing in general. Much more interesting, I think :)

    I think the Latifi discussion can be summarized by saying, OK, so he’s not completely useless—he is after all driving an F1 car—but he is not exactly a future star, is mostly there because of family money (not the first, or last) and probably will never win a race, let alone a championship. Best to end here before getting to the almost 200 pages of the Stroll thread.

    So, Can-Am! Here’s Teo Fabi driving the March “Flying Nun” at Trois-Rivières in 1981 :p Much simpler and cleaner than current F1 cars but so much more style and presence:

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
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  24. william

    william Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I will always have a feeling of frustration regarding F1, as long at it keep the open-wheels monoposto model.

    In the late 60s and early 70s, when CanAm existed , I was hoping for F1 to follow and adopt some of its technical rules.

    Bringing enclosed wheels and uncluttered bodywork seemed to be the next step after the arrival of wings, spoilers, etc ...

    But F1 is stuck in a rut, a half-way house between following traditions, and introducing much needed aero to keep the cars in control.
     
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  25. Metastable

    Metastable Formula Junior

    A no rules (except electronics limited to identical ECU, and traction control not allowed) series would be interesting today.
     

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